Just something I can’t get out my head recently

[RightOrAMeringue]

Let me preface this by saying it’s really reductive and over-simplified and a bit daft. I get that. And also I have lots of men who I cherish in my life -
dad, bro, husband, friends, etc etc. But I just can’t stop thinking about it as a concept, so hear me out…

AIBU to suggest/ partially believe that society, as a whole, would function better in the absence of men? Say that we found a way to artificially create sperm, or just fertilise eggs….would people still go for the organic stuff and roll the dice on the person that comes along with it? And, if not, and if the option to select gender presumably came along with the artificial sperm revelation…why would anyone choose to have a male child, and risk never having grandkids? And therefore…would an all-female society emerge? If so, would it be better? I say yes.

Before anyone says we have that option right now in the form of sperm donors/ one-night-stands etc, it’s not quite the same. It’s never totally string-free, and society is woefully lacking when it comes to being a single parent. Sex selection also requires IVF, and it’s not exactly reliable. Im talking about a world where you can buy artificial…semen, DNA, whatever, and apply it like a medication. Boom, pregnant.

As for the emergent utopia, I feel like a world where a far greater proportion had the theoretical opportunity to grow a child would soon begin to look after their interests in terms of career and income protection, mental health, general gynaecological and obstetric healthcare. We might see more of the fabled “Village” form to support parents and, therefore, children. Children therefore may be more well-adjusted with better early years care….less neglect/ deprivation/ childhood trauma….less crime?! Social services/ prisons/ policing costs come down, get reinvested into….healthcare? A free holiday for everyone every year?! Who knows.

Going by the stats, and assuming the absence of men doesn’t increase/ decrease women’s likelihood of committing certain crimes, we could expect astonishing reductions in sexual and domestic violence, murder, drug dealing, people trafficking, drug addiction…the list goes on. And, I reckon, you could argue that even if there was an uptick in female offending, it still wouldn’t be enough to fill the void left by male offenders.

I don’t know. This isn’t a call-to-arms, not making a case for it, I don’t hate men. The idea came to me and I haven’t been able to get it out my head as a concept. Reached a point where I’m just really interested to know what others think 🤣 by all means, point out everything I’ve missed/ am
completely wrong about.

I think the bottom line is that we’re social creatures who crave connection. The type and amount of connection is individual. But ultimately that’s what life is about.
That can’t be replaced with science

I'm guessing you've never met anyone who works in a women's prison?

Cleanse the male 'top dogs' and female top dogs will just take their place.

No-one will be any safer.

Matriarchal societies were known to be safer for everyone involved and less about power more about everyone’s needs being met. In a society like this maybe men can exist, but in a way where they actually respect women and don’t either rape/kill them or make endless excuses as to why that happens.

People are always so keen to tar everyone with the testosterone brush and assume that women are just as violent and greedy as men, which doesn’t hold up to scrutiny.

I see what you are saying, but think @PizzaPunk makes a very valid point. Wherever there is a vacuum something always appears.
Love your username BTW.

I’ve met someone who does.
The circumstances that lead to women being in prison and behaving poorly usually involve abuse and coercion from men. Without men much of this behaviour wouldn’t happen.

As I’m sure you can tell I’m a big fan of men. 😎

I think what we would be better without are men as they are currently mostly socialised and allowed to behave by society. I don’t think we’d have to get rid of them altogether.

Society would certainly be a lot less violent.

Lets just remove all men from society...

No, absolutely ridiculous thinking. Personally I have many men within my family and friends groups that i love who are not as you describe., and as pointed out above, theres many women who are absolute dangers to society, worse than any blokes.

Wouldnt it be better to have a society where bad things have ramifications? That bad people are removed from society, at their first action, that we teach early that there are ramifications, so people arent tempted to be bad.

Not quite the point I was making though.

I'm talking about the violent and bullying behaviour from some women towards other women, when they're actually in prison.

Not how they got there in the first place.

We'll still have murders, sexual assaults, drug dealers and everything we have now.

Because the female 'wrong uns' won't have to fight the male 'wrong uns' for that spot.

It's hardly a new concept! 😂

And it's a terrible one.

And so all straight women can no longer have a sex life? Erm, no thanks.

Around here there are a few groups of middle aged women, who seem to bond my going swimming in the sea, and singing around camp fires. Not a man in sight. You couldn't pay me enough to join them. I like men. 😍

Women's prisons IME are mostly very sad places rather than angry or violent. Though there are angry violent women in there. But that might be my experience as an outsider not an inmate
I guess it also depends on the type of prison and how it's run.

Disagree, based (reductively) on that study of aggressive male baboons.

Googled a quick summary for those who don’t know it:
‘A study of baboons in Kenya by primatologist Robert Sapolsky revealed a significant shift in social behaviour after an outbreak of bovine tuberculosis killed off the most aggressive males in the troop.
The remaining baboons, including the lower-ranking males, females, and juveniles, exhibited a more peaceful and cooperative social structure with increased grooming and reduced aggression.
This more peaceful culture persisted even after new males joined the troop.’

Oooomg right just had to jump on again firstly to thank everyone for humouring my mad thoughts - it’s almost a relief to get it out my head 🤣 I’d really like to respond to some of the main points early on because there’s just so many good ones. And please forgive my not quoting anyone directly, my Mumsnet abilities are pretty crap;

Companionship - this made me feel quite sad, so yeah, I guess at least for us heteronormative girlies, male companionship would be missed. Currently worried my husband will somehow read this and I’ll have hurt his feelings 🥺

Female prisons - V good point, I’m sure they’re hell. BUT, as NoodleBuyer points out, the demographics/ behaviour may not exist in the first place if men weren’t there tempering the environment outside of the prison in the first place.

Behaviour change > eradication : Yes, and this actually is a really good segue into a discussion about the fact that the fact this is even a debate suggests male behaviour/ conditioning needs looking at in general. But, in a world where the solution is but a turkey baster away….would anyone bother/ keep screaming into the void?

Sex: really good point again. Not sure if having some designated men just for sex/ androids like Jude Law in the movie AI would turn the whole thing back into a dystopia. Although…Jude Law…

And, finally, DuskyPink1984…dismissal without discussion was a wee bit disappointing. Why is it a terrible idea? When was this idea floated before and by who?! I need to know!

thanks all!

Sorry, you lost me at admitting you're heteronormative

Well, some women don’t fancy men, or only men. If this is a surprise this may not be the discussion for you… 😋

I quite like men, so, no

I don't think so tbh

I think that there are a lot of truly awful women, and there are a lot of women who like the patriarchy, and enjoy enforcing it and even benefitting from it

There would just be a cast system of women that would emerge and we'd be no better off

Now, and huge increase in social housing, a huge investment in the NHS, and robust unions and a well equipped school system would make the world of difference, as class is the biggest divider in society, imo, rather than gender xx

Plus, who would I lust after?

Chat gpt..

The use of heteronormative, it's the "norm" bit...

I think there was a sci fi book I read about a society like this.It sounds really interesting.Would the men be like Stepford husbands under some sort of control you could get one out if you needed them for something?
Or they would be completely gone and we would just reproduce asexualy?
I think in the book I read the men lived somewhere else outside the woman's town.
I also had have a few pretty important men who I am glad are in my life like my son, he is really a good person. My husband is pretty okay too.
Food for thought though

Aaaah yeah maybe the wrong term to use. Wasn’t for a second suggesting heterosexuality was the norm, more just being self-deprecating for being so boring. I’ve edited that though, sort of harms the whole debate. Thanks!

Sex: really good point again. Not sure if having some designated men just for sex/ androids like Jude Law in the movie AI would turn the whole thing back into a dystopia. Although…Jude Law…

For some reason I can't 'bold' that - but our female utopia is going to have men as sex slaves?
Um, no....,

Or kept horses on a livery yard.