Anyone else lost a bit of ambition now they’ve been taxed to the brink?

[Peasontoastt]

I used to be extremely ambitious and was really eager to reach some sort of financial security. As a consequence, I’m in what’s considered a highly paid career, I work hard and it took me many years to train.

Just as I paid off my student loan (which took many years), I then had a baby and returned to work to be stuck with the childcare dilemma. I struggled through that phase and have come out the other side but being taxed so much, no child benefit, still paying for nursery even though dd has ‘free’ hours now. It’s likely that savings are going to be bashed next, so what’s the point in even putting anything aside when there’s likely going to be a 4K cap on ISAs.

I used to feel so ambitious and of course I know money isn’t everything, not by a long shot. But having worked my way up the ladder and with huge responsibilities only to feel penalised financially for doing so…what is the point? Yes I have more financial security than someone claiming benefits but equally, I am not being flippant when I say a few years of resting and being at home and being frugal is starting to seem so much more attractive. Has anyone else started feeling this way? I feel taken the piss out of by every financial angle!

Maybe people shouldn't expect to build a life on national minimum wage? Mayen NMW is supposed to be for your first ever job (like working the tills at McDonald's) and then you ultimately progress to bigger and better things.

But you don't necessarily need to pay shit loads of tax if you are a moderately high earner. If you operate as a company, you can be tax efficient. If (as I am) you are employed, you can put £ into your pension and opt for tax efficient benefits like extra leave, green car schemes etc. And if your taxable salary is still over £100k, you are doing OK, so maybe you should contribute more in tax.

There are plenty of jobs, not all of them unskilled, done by people of all ages that pay that or not very much more.

Teacher assistant.

My point was that you used to be able to build and have a life on NMW. It is the the cost of housing and everything else that means it is no longer possible.

A person on NMW needs to have enough money to live. It used to be enough. Now it is not, so their wages are topped up via UC. That is not the fault of the person in that job. Not everyone is capable of more than NMW for lots of reasons.. that if you can't even think of one, then you are very privileged.

Personally I retired much earlier than planned. It's not just income tax, it's everything else and Labour's IHT on pension was the final nail.

If IHT on your pension is a problem for you, the solution is very simple - use it for the purpose it was intended and spend it.

Care work for starters. It should be done by people who have the aptitude to do the job... not people using it as a stepping stone. And an experienced carer is worth their weight in gold. Sadly, they just don't get paid enough.

I have known people in low paid roles who loved their job but were forced to leave to earn more elsewhere in jobs they hated.
People who love their job are the lucky ones. And it that job is low paid, then it should be enough to live on.

I don't get the whole "NMW is for school leavers etc". If the gov have their way and force vast swathes of disabled people into work, then they will be starting on the low rungs too... some in their 50s and 60s.

Some of the recovery coordinators in the drug and alcohol services I worked in weren't on much more than minimum wage. It was a high pressure job and not unskilled. I know one of them struggled to afford her train fare to work towards the end of the month. The reception staff were all on minimum wage, and the job was very demanding.

I know someone who is a peer support worker for a MH charity. She runs all the groups that many of us rely on. She is on NMW, but had to have years of experience in MH (including lived) to secure her role.

that's exactly what I'm doing. Instead of trying to pass it on to my DC. If I was allowed to I'd continue working for about 10 more years. And paid over 600k in tax for this

I earned more than NMW while I was there, but not a lot more. I earned about 4K more than the RC I mentioned and I coordinated the Education, Training and Employment provision over the whole city. The third sector is very poorly paid.

Yep, but all the staff are vital and it is not a "starter job".

Exactly. If people think all NMW jobs are unskilled entry and starter jobs they're pretty naive.

I understand if someone is disabled.

Apart from that, it's on you to better yourself and up skill yourself. If one job on NMW isn't enough. Get another job and build your income. Cut your expenses. Your leftover income to invest and grow your capital.

My shift pattern in my NNW job was 5 over 7... so I did 10 days in a row at times. I was falling asleep on the bus home.
Fuck getting a second job. I would not find another to compliment my shift pattern, and I was too exhausted to work any more.
No one seems to value a work/life balance anymore. It is all about working yourself to death to get money.
You should be able to work and not risk your physical and mental health, and have enough to live on.
And if a NMW job is good enough for someone with disabilities, then it should be good enough for everyone.

I'm all about personal responsibility, but this comment is really unfair.

How can you do it all on NMW?

I think a structural issue with the UK is property prices and our obsession with owning houses, not flats. If a couple on NMW could afford a reasonable housing, rented or owned, we wouldn't have all these issues. Everyone could pay taxes, there would be less pressure on higher owners, less of a drain on welfare etc etc. Until then, either NMW has to be substantially higher (leading to collapse of the economy) or the state continues subsidising low-paid plus a lot of people not seeing the point of work at all , so ever growing welfare budget.

Well, this thread truly has it all.

No waste in the public sector? Christ alive, bring back the laughing emoji!
”privileged” to pay higher tax rates, but not at all privileged to be able to claim benefits.
Low tax country
Someone making zero contributions and is a net taker is the same as a net contributor reducing their hours.
There are no multi generational issues of persistent unemployment.
You cannot earn more than £50k per year unless you are an investment banker or self employed
It is easy to set up businesses in the UK.
Everyone paying a higher rate of tax is one illness away from claiming benefits.

If any or all of the above is what people genuinely believe, it is not difficult to understand how we got here.

I spent my teenage years getting drunk in various fields, and dating 20-odd year old men.

Went to uni at 18, dropped out, went back at 20 and eventually got a degree. I won’t pretend my degree, PGCE or Masters were easy, but I didn’t work harder than your average student.

I don’t work harder than most now. I definitely don’t work harder than my staff do. I “profit” from the flexibility that length of experience in an industry, position and accountability to less people provides.

I think it’s misguided to think that everyone who earns well works hard, we don’t.

What do you do? If you coast at your job and get paid alright, then genuinely good for you. All I'll say is that studying and hard work can't make things worse.

Thats quite needlessly cruel.

Yeah, a perfect example of the sort of thoughts you should keep to yourself.

Are you sure love 🙄

My ambition and my quality of life are not strongly connected to my take home pay. I choose to work in the public sector doing a worthwhile job that I enjoy and am good at. I also choose to work part time so I can be around for my children after school. My ambition is to raise well-rounded, kind and community minded young people who have opportunities in front of them to live their lives how they want to and to be a goid example to them. It's also to contribute to society in a positive way, including paying my taxes but also by doing my job well for the next 20 or so years.

Trying to maximise my take home pay to spend on new cars, expensive holidays and luxury items is not what ambition means to me. Those people who are so strongly focused on avoiding tax and getting rich should take a step back and think about what's actually important in life.

And who is going to do all these jobs which people like you look down on if everyone gains some marketable skills and moves to a better paying job? Some of you seem to have no clues.