Husband wants to back into contact with toxic family

[FunOchreTurtle]

hi, first time positing here as I’m at a loss

my husband and I have been married 5 years, together 8
I’ve just had a baby, 4 month old. And we have 2 young children. We have 3 under 4.

anyway his family have been toxic from the day we got married. We asked for no photography during the ceremony- rules apparently didn’t apply to her.

long list of more toxic behaviours which we tried to work past but she continued to carry on. His brother threatened to “leave my children fatherless”. Along with other disgusting things he said about myself and also my side of the family.

fast forward we decided to cut contact 3 years ago.

*my problem

last December my husband had a breakdown ; he was wanted to end the marriage suddenly out of no where. He walked out on me a the kids (while I was pregnant) and stayed at his mum’s house. - this is the first time of contact I know about he’s had with them.

he came back , we sorted things out (although I do find it hard how he treated me while pregnant), he said his mum didn’t want anything to do with him and he just stayed there to think.

I’ve just found out that all that was a lie. He’s been in contact with his family. Ringing her everyday, long phone calls whenever he’s out of the house in the car etc. He’s lied and hid all this from me but also he now is saying to me he wants contact with them

I honestly don’t know what to do. I can’t believe he’s forgiven the way they’ve treated me and the family, and I feel pushed to the side now

I know she is toxic and will gossip to him, end up getting inside his head and telling him to leave me because I’m the problem?

I'm sorry OP but you are married to a liar. As far as I'm concerned that means he will lie about anything and everything because that's what liars do. You can't have an open and trusting and worthwhile relationship with a liar.

And know he has lied to you about something really important to you by continuing contact with his family and saying he hasn't.

I honestly don't see how your marriage can recover from the deceit.

Realistically,he's been talking shit about you while he was living there. He's been lying and having a secret relationship with his mum out of your ear shot for a reason. He's already been spouting the narrative that you are the problem, and she's been lapping it up.

He is going to have a relationship with his family. You can't stop that. He's an adult and can choose for him self. You need to decide if you're prepared to stick around and watch it unfold. You also need to put in place boundaries. He can do what he likes but that doesn't mean you want them in your house or around your kids.

It's hard because if you separate he will decide who has contact with the children during his contact time. I'd be inclined to try and hang in there so your kids get a bit older, are able to talk and a bit more independent. But, this isn't a relationship I'd be prepared to stay in.

I’m so sorry, OP. You’re living my worst nightmare.

To some extent, it doesn’t matter what he’s been saying to them or that he’s been deceiving you. He wants to do something that to you is the worst thing ever. You can’t stop him and if you throw down the ultimatum, you play right into their hands AND have no guarantee that eg if he picks you, he’ll stick to it.

As a PP said, the only thing you control are your boundaries. It’ll be shit that if you divorce he can bring your kids to his family during his time, but you know him best: is he actually going to get off his arse and facilitate this?

Figure out what you can live with, being selfish and thinking solely about yourself and your children.

HE can have contact with that (and you wait until he’s burned again or they corrupt him and your marriage over time), but you don’t have to and neither do your children.

Not ok that he lied.

But there seems to be many underlying issues here. Whose decision or lever was it for him to cut off contact? They may be toxic but they are his family and he may have happy memories with them.
And them taking photographs (probably a few) may be upsetting but surely a non issue especially 5 years on. Surely there are better more urgent things to keep you annoyed?

In any case it feels like you two need counselling or need to break up. Sorry op.

He wants to be in contact with his family but scared of you?

Ah op I'm sorry, that's a serious betrayal.

It's a hard one because on one hand, your dh is also a victim in this, he's being manipulated by his family and having grown up in that toxic environment it is going to be very hard for him to break completely free of that. Im wondering if the stress of lying to you and the pressure he's taken from his family while keeping such a big secret has actually contributed to his break down since it came so out of the blue. He's in an abusive relationship with his mother and siblings and by keeping this secret he's completely isolated himself with it.

At the same time, he's also putting you in an impossible position- his brother has threatened to kill him and by extension harm your family. That's too serious to ignore and it is his job to step up and protect you all from this. The problem really is that he's maybe tried to do this by not talking to you about it while still sitting on the fence and he can't do that. He also cannot lie and secret keep like that from you as his wife. That's a major breach in trust that he's created. I think it would be very understandable if you couldn't move past this, especially after how he treated you while pregnant.

If it were me, I'd only consider continuing the relationship if he agreed to marriage and independent counselling and make that a non negotiable. He needs space to understand that this relationship is abusive, to see the real impact of it on himself compared to what a normal family dynamic looks like, and the impact its having on his wife and your children. Cutting contact with your family is a big step and it's going to carry more guilt and weight for him because its his family, so he needs to be ready on a personal level to actually follow through and be consistent with that. I'm thinking consistent therapy (longer than 6-8 weeks) might help him actually understand the severity of what he's done and how abnormal his family is. When you grow up in it, you don't see it because to you it is normal.

Honestly, I personally would be putting everything into trying to trying to get him to see sense and try to reach a compromise, purely because i wouldn't want my kids being in contact with his side of the family without you there, when he's clearly not in a position to protect them from these people. But you know your limits on this and its also very important for them to have a healthy, happy mummy.

He's really fucked up here and he needs to understand he's jeopardising his family and his kids security in life to maintain contact with people who are abusing him.

Paging @Attilathemeerkat!

If you were a man demanding his wife cut contact with her family because of reasons including someone taking a photo at your wedding I think the answers would be different.

I don’t want the photo/videoing during the wedding ceremony to be the main problem, I’m stating it started since that day

other things which have happened is our baby was born during Covid times, was in hospital poorly. We asked to meet in open space just his mum and dad, they invited 3 other people ignoring our boundaries.

another example, while I was pregnant with my first child, mil put in the group chat with his side of the family, that she knew I was pregnant because I looked fat!

that is just one example of many toxic behaviours i put up with 2 years before we decided no contact which was a JOINT decision. But he seems to of been able to forgiven all those things which I simply can not.

Can you trust him, after leaving you while pregnant,and then lying to you since?

I'd start planning my exit

You may also want to post this in the Relationships forum.

I would now plan your exit from this marriage. The trust is now gone and he with it. You cannot trust a liar and he’s lied basically to get out of trouble. He is still very much enmeshed with his parents and seems unable to be without them.

He is enmeshed with them and is also mired in fear, obligation and guilt. Familial enmeshment like this indeed does wreck family life.

And what MauricetheMussel wrote too.

(hi mussel)

You said you have only told us a few of their toxic behaviours, however, saying you were fat and that's why she knew you were pregnant and taking photos in a church, is not enough reason to cut off his family completely. I assume you also told us their worst behaviours for this thread.

That is his family, no wonder he had a breakdown, he must be under incredible pressure.
I would have set strict boundaries but still continued to see them, or if not me, my husband and children.
I think if you don't work together on this issue and understand this is his family, his past links, its the end of your marriage.

if this was reversed and a man wanted to stop his wife seeing her family we would probably think it was potentially abusive and he was trying to isolate her.

I'm not saying that is the case here and I'm not saying the OP should forgive and forget their behaviour. If the OP wants to remain NC she definitely should do that but I don't think it's reasonable for her to expect her partner to do the same. This is his mum and his family and if he wants to contact them he should be able to do that openly.

I agree with this. It sounds a bit shit and I can see how a load of little things adds up to a lot, but nothing here is giving me massive red flags. I wouldn’t want to spend masses of time with them but going NC seems extreme. How many of these decisions were made by you and agreed to by him? What led to his breakdown? Lying to you is not ok but maybe it was his least worst option.

OP you are mixing up two separate issues.

Firstly you can be no contact with his family, but you can't force him to do the same. That means you need to think about the fact he essentially doesn't care about how they've treated you.

Then there's the lies and deceit. He's been in contact with them in secret and more than likely talking all kinds of smack about you, to them.

Neither of these look good on him and your relationship.

I love how everyone is focusing on the photos and ignoring the death threats from the brother...

You dont have too but he is an adult and responsible for himself you are trying to be controlling i wouldn't put up with it no matter how much it's justified

Woman can be just as controlling

Your marriage is unstable and you need to be making exit plans. Your husband has lied to you long term, he has mental health issues, and there has been a death threat.

Instead of facilitating your relationship with his family, which was his job, he talked shit to them about you and your family. He poisoned the well.

You can only control yourself. You can be no contact. If you try to make demands of your husband to do the same, he's going to lie to you.

Go no contact yourself. Get a couple lawyer consults to see what separation or divorce would look like for you. Get copies of all financials. Play your cards close though. Are you planning to return to work after your maternity leave?

Update *

he said he went back into contact with her because he has no one else to talk to - he doesn’t really have friends

he is now saying his family are “normal” and not toxic. He’s forgotten or forgiven everything that’s happened. He said they’ve changed. That his brother has changed too. I reminded him of the violent threats and he said but he didn’t mean it. It’s just what he says. That’s what he’s like. I said NO that is not acceptable.

if he did have contact with his mum I’d say text only. No more secretive phone calls. But also I am staying no contact, and also the kids too.

honestly I don’t know if I can move past this I just feel scared and I am only 4 months post partumn

If he did have contact with his mum I’d say text only. No more secretive phone calls. But also I am staying no contact, and also the kids too.

Ok, I understand why you are hurting and I do agree they sound toxic

But I think your DH has lied to you (not saying he’s right) because he knows you will control his contact with them. “If he did have contact with his mum I’d say text only” I don’t know,

It sounds like he is in the middle and both sides are controlling (sorry)

If you can’t deal with your husband having his family in his life and you feel like it affects you mentally then you are absolutely within your rights to end the marriage, but don’t make him choose

I am NC with my in laws and SIL for very good reasons. DP and I do not have any children together but we do have children separately so he still stays in minimal contact with his family for his child.

It can be hard as often they continue to show their awful ways to him but other times he seems to forget what they are like.

I have had to accept that they are his and his child’s family.

I absolutely draw the line at any contact with them and he does chose to not attend family parties, Christmas etc without me to maintain that he is on my side and to let them know that he supports me in what happened. But will see them occasionally (couple of days before Christmas, Father’s Day etc) because they are his family and he feels a duty to do so.

it’s shit though! I do feel you. I am sure he doesn’t always tell me what his family have said etc when he visits to protect me, it’s been 2 years now and it’s ok

You don't get to dictate who he does and doesn't have contact with or how that contact takes place. They are his family. Unfortunately, you also don't get to dictate who has contact with the children. They are both of your children. They don't just belong to you. If you separate on his days he can do what he wants with whomever he wants.

Personally, I say .....

I understand that you want contact with your family and that's your perogative. I don't like the lies. I don't want for our trust or our relationship to be impacted. I don't expect you to lie to me about things or keep secrets. I was very hurt by your family and for my peace I don't want to have a relationship with them. I don't want the kids to have a relationship with them and I don't want them in our house.

Then see where you go from there. I think your relationship will be impacted. However, I'd keep the peace as much as possible. Your kids are little. I'd want to grow them until the are able to talk, toilet and a bit more independent. As I said if you separate you won't be able to be a buffer between his family.

Or he's scared to tell her he's seeing them because he knows there will be hell to pay if he disobeys her and he'll have to listen to her talk all kinds of smack about them?

We don't know the truth either way. We only know that the man wants a relatiobnship with his family and he's scared to admit it to his wife.

His contact with them is none of your business no matter how you justify it is controlling, you can have any opinion you want on it just stop controlling him and doing some weird guilt trip thing

Ahhh…this is the thread the other posters were talking about. I’m honestly still struggling to see how your MIL is ‘toxic’. Toxic means abusive…she sounds like a CF and a complete PITA but not abusive towards her son, you or your children.

Give your head a wobble, @FunOchreTurtle. You can set your boundaries, make them clear and uphold them…but you can’t force your DH to either have the same red lines in his relationships or to go NC with a family that he clearly still loves and wants to be with. As long as he stands up for you if they step out of line, that’s enough. Telling him that texting might be ok at a push is frankly bananas. You have no right.

You’ve come across as a bit judgemental and controlling tbh - and if you were hoping to get a different reaction on the new thread with a fresh crowd, I think you’ve been disabused of that.

Have an actual conversation with him, in couples counselling if necessary, where you keep your opinions to yourself and find out how he really feels about the whole situation. Whether he feels safe enough to open up honestly with you, on the other hand, remains to be seen.