To think DD should get place at nursery over children deferring reception?

[Matronic6]

DD has been at a nursery part time since she turned 1. In March we asked about going full time in August for nursery room and were told it would be 'no problem' as so many were leaving for reception and we had asked so early.
We emailed to confirm we had a place for August, and they said it'd be mid August.

I confirmed with my work that I will go back full time in August. I previously phoned nursery in early May to confirm she had a full time spot to commit to my employer. The only thing is it was verbal, I have gone through emails and at no point have they said 'DD has a place starting August xx'

We have just got an email asking if we were still interested in a full time place. We were confused but replied yes we still needed the full time slot. They have since replied that due to high numbers of children deferring reception and a lot of requests for FT there is less places in nursery and they could not confirm a place at this time but will update us.

AIBU to think that this is firstly really unprofessional and secondly DS should be prioritised for a place over children who said they were leaving but are now deferring reception entry?

@Nchangeoif it’s pissing you off why don’t you give your son the same advantage and defer him?

It sounds as though the nursery just assumed the children would be leaving not that the parent changed their minds. It also doesn't sound as though you had a firm offer from the nursery for a full time place just a message to say it should be no problem .
Its annoying for you but don't see any reason why why you should be given priority over other children. Hopefully a full time place will still become available for you.

Some children are just not ready to start school when they have just turned 4, some are.
I don't see why it should bother you if someone decides to defer entry because they don't think their summer born child is ready for school. And I don't think it has anything to do with giving them an advantage over other children .

Of course it does. Older children always have an advantage, especially in the early years. But if everyone with a summer born child deferred them, the children born in spring would then be the ones at a disadvantage. Where does it stop?

In France children are required to start school the September of the calendar year they turn 3 (meaning some of them are still 2). No one cares whether the child is ready or not.

Our preschool stopped guaranteeing spaces for third years because they were losing money over it. You can't get people to take up a space for the first if you can't guarantee they'll have space to stay for a second year, it was losing them business.

Some children are just not ready to start school when they have just turned 4, some are.

Its really quite silly. The curriculum in reception continues the same EYFS as in preschools. Its really not the huge change people make it out to be. I say that as a parent of a prem baby who snuck into a late august birthday of the year above and wasn't deferred.

A. We can’t afford to defer and pay nursery fees double as we have another child and our mortgage is coming out of its fix.

B. I wouldn’t anyway. He’s supposed to be middle of his year and learning age appropriate stuff. I don’t believe he would be disadvantaged. The only reason he would be is because of people deferring perfectly average children making him the youngest of a peer group spreading 1.5 years. It’s these parents disadvantaging him. Not me because I am doing what we are supposed to be doing by sending him to school in a normal year band.

@Nchangeo

What are you basing your knowledge on?
How do you define what you’re supposed to be doing? Deferring is allowed and very easy to sort out .
You clearly have complete blind faith in our government if you think that following what your “ supposed to do” is in your best advantage
The UK starts school earlier than almost any other country in the world. It is also very normal to defer in most other countries, becoming more normal here too as you’ve stated

I don’t need any knowledge for this. It’s literal common sense reasoning. If it becomes the norm to defer (as you a suggesting we are moving to), then there is no advantage anymore. Only disadvantage for those who would have actually needed to defer; ie those with serious difficulties.

And so we are not there yet; we are currently going through this weird period of flux. Where the curriculum is not correct for age, years have all mixed up ages. And then how do we solve the problem of those with difficulties; in how ever many years they reintroduce laws to ‘double defer’ for people who actually need it?

Honestly it’s nonsense. Some people do need to defer and I accept that. But it’s not the people I know. There kids are fine.

@NchangeoI would argue that it is literal common sense that we don’t sent tiny 4 year old children to school.
How would you explain the numerous studies that have shown that summer born children are at a disadvantage and the fact that deferral and starting school as late as 7 is commonplace in other countries?

I think it all depends on the individual child. DGD is an autumn birthday, one of the oldest in her year but has ADHD and is at least 2 years behind academically and emotionally so no advantage to her for being one of the oldest. If she had been born a week earlier and thus in the year before hers then she might well have needed to be deferred though. Her little brother is a summer born, not deferred and doing absolutely fine. In fact he is further ahead than either of my own DC were at the same age purely due to the fact he is at school and learning whilst they didn't start school until age 5 back in the day. Each parent just has to make a judgement call based on the child they actually have.

I don’t blame parents for deferring summer born children. But the situation it creates is difficult, especially as it’s not an automatic thing and therefore easier to access for DC with engaged, educated parents. There is 15 months age difference between the oldest and youngest in DC1s class. The girl who turned 6 at the end of May is very different to the boys who don’t turn 5 until August. I’m not sure what the answer is though, as some DC do need the option of deferral, so I wouldn’t want to see it banned.

I would be annoyed in your situation too OP.

You can’t or won’t read what I am saying.

Do you think it’s the magic sun woo that makes summer kids disadvantaged or being the youngest. If the latter obviously that moves depending on whether deferral becomes the norm; especially for normal spring borns. It’s turning something entirely simple into some odd version of parental game theory.

You're completely missing the point. It's not being the youngest that causes the extent of the disadvantage, it's the too young school starting age!

@Nchangeowhat you are saying is not grounded in logic or fact. You offer nothing to support your argument. In many many countries ( including Australia and Scotland) defferal is very normal . They seem to manage without any difficulties. The situation you’re describing is not the reality of what actually happens

I will agree with your point about it tending to be educate and engaged parents who defer. The ones who have actually done the research and can see what a disadvantage being summer born will be for their child. Where as actually it is probably often the case that children from more disadvantaged backgrounds would benefit even more from a defferal. This is why I always comment on these threads. People spread so much misinformation and there are many who don’t even know it’s an option. Anyone can do it. This should be spelt out to all parents.

But what changes between April and May? Surely April kids are still too young to be in reception? I actually agree with you that kids go to school too young in this country. But I’m not sure deferring summer borns is the answer…

It’s not really about the academic side. My DC would have been fine in the year above from this perspective. It’s about emotional maturity which feeds into positive mental health outcomes in the future

You can defer April and May born children. Anyone born in the summer term I.e after the Easter holidays.

Okay, March born children then?

As @LegoHouse274has said the point is that children who start school at just turned 4 are at a disadvantage because of how young they are. Presumably the research supports the fact that this disadvantage is less for those born in March, who will be 4.5 when they start. There is a reason why the government has limited the ability to defer to summer borns.

@Firefliesaremagichas responded to this before I could. That being said, on an individual basis, I can't change the age at which compulsory education starts for all children in this country. I would if I could! I can't even change the age at which my own child starts compulsory education. The only thing that I COULD do about it was at least ensure they didn't need to start an entire academic year earlier, so that's what I did. Is it 'the answer' on a wider level for all children, no, of course not. But it's all I could do for my own child, so I took it, as I didn't want them to be at the (statistical) disadvantage that reams of evidence shows they would have been at otherwise.

I am not buying that. I don’t know whether my son has just gone to a really advanced nursery/ prep or the school is very free-play based. But there is little difference between his prep and his reception. It gets more structured once you hit year 1 but there is lots of free library and interest time, and no homework even up to yr 6. I don’t believe he’s too young to start. I do believe that the only disadvantage he will face is being the youngest. Perhaps we have been lucky with our school/ nursery here.

Actually April-born! Children can be deferred if they were born as early as 1 April.

My son's best friend was born at the end of August. He said the biggest issue for him was he couldn't socialise in clubs and pubs during year 13 so his first experience was when he was with new people far from home which sort of messed up some of his first year at uni. I thought that was an interesting point of view.