to think that life would be less complicated if we didn't have a societal presumption of sexual fidelity?

[fanjolina]

Just reading all the recent threads about errant partners has got me thinking. Why does society demand sexual fidelity?

If sexual relations were on a par with drinking, partying etc - i.e. you could do them with other people when in a relationship, with no impact on your relationship - then life would be so much simpler.

I'm not advocating a free-for-all shagfest, but why is sex held as the most sacrosanct element of a relationship? It makes it particularly hard on couples where one partner has no interest and the other still has desires. Yet to find sexual satisfaction elsewhere to meet their needs is deemed abhorrent.

However if I decided I didn't want to drink again and stopped my DH from ever drinking with anyone else I would be seen as unreasonable.

But AIBU for even thinking outside societal norms and daring to view sexual fidelity as anything less than sacrosanct?

(P.S. I have no personal desire to be unfaithful - but that may just be my societal conditioning )

It's a fascinating debate fanjolina. I suspect it's a bit of both - nature and social conditioning. Jealousy appears to be a fundamental human instinct ... I mean you see it in very tiny children, jealousy of sharing attention, sibling rivalry, I din't believe it is simply a social construct. But I would imagine conditioning also plays a role. These days, the huge increase in STIs also has an implication, because even in the most carefully considered liaisons, there is an element of risk unless both partners remain monogamous.
It's 'safer' sex, not 'safe' sex, after all.

FIndtheriver: while I said that historically men's ownership of women has been an issue, monogamists of both sexes are obsessed with owning another individual sexually.

FIndtheriver: the increase in STIs is more to do with pissed-up teenagers not using condoms than people refusing monogamy.

I think it is very emotional for me. I always wanted, from being a young girl, a relationship/husband of my own. Maybe there is some deep rooted security/insecurity there, I am not sure.
So for fanjo's q, my answer is much more nature, than conditioning, I think.
I was certainly never bothered about being married, as such.
My husband is very old fahioned and traditional in his views on right and wrong, infidelity etc. I never really needed to have 'that conversation' with him, because it is very clear we both feel the same.
We both like to think that we would, finish one reltionship before starting another. I know that it is easy to think this, before you find yourself in that situation, but if it is so very important, as it clearly is to me, I hope/like to think that I would never ever cheat/ sleep with anyone else.
I have always felt like this. I have given fidelity alot of thought and pondered why it is so important to me. Not everyone has even ever thought about it, but I certainly have.
I am quite good a spotting cheaters, before they have even cheated, just becasue of their personalities/beliefs and morals.
Or is that just me ?

Mdamez:
'the increase in STIs is more to do with pissed-up teenagers not using condoms than people refusing monogamy. ' - absolutely true, never said it wasnt. Simply pointed out that ANY sexual liaison carries an element of health risk unless both partners
are completely clear and remain monogamous. Practising safer sex will obviously reduce the risks. Fact.

'while I said that historically men's ownership of women has been an issue, monogamists of both sexes are obsessed with owning another individual sexually. ' - this is YOUR interpretation of one particular view. There are plenty of posts on here to show that many monogamists are making a choice about how they want to conduct their relationships, not trying to 'own' someone else sexually. Why put a negative connotation on someone else's choice? To say all monogamists want to own someone's elses sexuality is as bad as saying anyone who isnt monogamous is a slapper. Very prejudiced view.

Sexual fidelity is difficult because in some relationships the opportunity and desire for sex (with someone else) is not equal. I do not have much time or opportunity for an affair as I am at home with 2 pre-school children and am 19weeks pregnant, so unless I fancy an affair with a check out assistant at Tesco's (and I am not into spotty teens or mature women!) - it is not happening.

Whereas my DH is working in the Big Bad City everyday and sometimes needs to work late (not often). I have no doubt that he is completely faithful and has no intention of an affair of any kind.

If I did not have this trust in my dh and if I felt he could go off for a shag if he felt like it - I don't think I would be able to cope. I need the security now while I am in this stage of my life and our relationship. When the kids are older then this may change - but I sincerely hope not - I would like to think we will remain faithful.

So what I am saying - I think - is that sexual freedom in a relationship can only possibly work if you are in an equal situation.

However infidelity seems to come out of lack of communication and a lack of understanding that a good relationship needs to provide support for both partners through different difficult stages of life - the biggest challenges coming with the introduction of children and their needs.

Does (partner) approved sexual freedom equal infidelity? I only observe that occasionally a partner doesn't object to "outside activity" but is more concerned about appearances. I hasten to add that DW and I are happily married without outside help but I can imagine that for some it is losing "face" that is the problem.

Really interesting post Bigmouth. I agree with a lot of what you say. I think the 'equal' situation thing is possible though, if there is equality at the heart of your relationship. Any relationship can go through phases where one partner may seem to be 'dominant' in one area, whether it's economically dominant or within the home. Your last paragraph is spot on - I think that's absolutely how infidelity happens. Of course, it's only infidelity if it's cheating, and not an agreed open relationship by both partners. Madamez has been talking about such partherships, where is can be perfectly possible for one or both partners to have sexual liaisons with others. I have no problem with that, where it's an agreed decision; my only problem is with madamez's assumption that those of us who choose monogomy are somehow making a less valid choice, because we want to 'own' our partner. I really think this is a myth in this day and age. There are plenty of posts on here showing that very many people CHOOSE monogamy, not because they feel coerced by another person or by society - it is a free choice.

FTR: sorry, was shortcutting a bit. I make a distinction between people who choose a monogamous relationship and 'monogamists' who are obsessive about it, assume that their partner feels exactly the same as them without ever discussing it, go through post/phone messages/emails and make sexual ownership the focus of their entire lives.

Oh I see madamez. Agree with you there - though hopefully the types who go through messages and emails are pretty rare!! Who'd have the time?!

I think a lot more apparently monogamous marriages/relationships have the odd bit of 'outside activity' than you'd think.

I also have friends who function very well, and very honestly, in a relationship where they are each others' primary partners but they also have the odd fling - quite openly - on the side. And their point is that sexual monogamy doesn't work - see para 1 above - and they would rather acknowledge the attraction that most (I'd say all) of us have to other people and work that one through.

As motherinferior says, polyamory (ie consensual, agreed multiple relationships) is a lot more common than people think.

I know a lot of people who are in or have been in multiple relationships and it seems to lead to a very healthy attitude to relationships in general - eg the end of a relationship doesn't mean the other person is evil, and actually thinking about what levels of commitment and reassurance they want or need from their partners.

Of course people who do have multiple partners can still be unfaithful by breaking their agreements with their partners.