How do I reconcile with DSis?

[ChocworkOrange]

DSis and I have fallen out, it has been two and a half years. In my view (and the view of DH, mum and friends I've spoken to, and mumsnet previously), she was completely in the wrong. It is clear that she would like to reconcile - by this, she means, we go back to how we were before and carry on. She will not acknowledge she did anything wrong, will not apologise, just thinks everything is my opinion, my perspective, my view and that she has her own (which don't align with reality, or that there's an objectively unacceptable way to treat people).

I love and miss her. Our brothers live abroad, parents are divorced and mum has recently been diagnosed with cancer. I feel as though this needs to be fixed but don't know how to stimulate any change in her. How should I proceed without going back to being treated poorly?

You make the first move and take it day by day. Good luck.

I don’t know what happened between you, but to fix this you need to make the move, agree to draw a line under the past, but then let her know your boundaries moving forward - what you won’t accept in future, and how you expect to be treated.
Then hug it out 😊

Good luck xxx

@ChocworkOrange is it more important to be right than happy?

Everyone involved knows the truth, even if she doesn't acknowledge her part.

Life is so short, if you think re-connecting would be beneficial for you and your sister then move forward, without agenda.

eta; a simple "do you fancy meeting up for a coffee?" is fairly non-committal

This.

You can't change her, only your reaction to her.

I think right and happy are somewhat hand in hand here.

I don't see how I can be happy in a close relationship with her when she thinks that treating me the way she did is the right way to behave. I worry that it's likely that she'll just carry on again exactly as before.

A lot of the things she did for years were unquestionably not ok - she denies that a lot of them happened at all (things I witnessed, things other people witnessed). Others she argues are perfectly acceptable.

I feel as though I need her to recognise that there are objective, factual truths regarding what she did and not hide behind "her truth" or "everyone sees things differently".

You cannot stimulate any change in her.

It reads like she has consistently treated you poorly and then there was a final instance if poor behaviour which caused the falling out.

So if you want to reconcile, you need to accept that she does not now and never will take responsibility for her past poor behaviour.
Then reach out to her and don't bring up the past. Just spend time with her in the now enjoying it for what it is.

Most importantly spend some time thinking of what you will do when she behaves poorly in the future. Create your boundaries and stick with them. I don't know what form her poor behaviour takes, but for example, you're at a cafe with her. She comments on you eating a cake and your weight. Maybe your response could be calming saying "it's really rude to comment on people's body's. Please stop and don't do it again" She doubles down on the fat shaming, instead of backing off. So you say "I don't have to listen to your rudeness" and then you leave. Don't hold a grudge, be status quo next month when you meet up again.

I'm sorry to hear about your mum's diagnosis. Life will be much easier if you and your sister are able to be polite in each other's company while all this is going on. Maybe you could message her and say something about your mum - something nonconfrontational. You can say (if she raises it) that you don't agree with how she behaved/what she said before but that it's important to get along so that you can both care for your mum.

Then if thats how you feel, you wont have a relationship aside from sharing the duties regarding your parents.

my sister was like that always wanted to be right. Until something happened and we put our feeling aside for the sake of the greater good. We get on great now.
she has her boundaries, i have mine and we dont cross them. We both grew up and move our relationship in a more mature way.

then last year i was able to say outloud how i felt when the last straw happened. She listened, didnt acknowledge anything, but she listened.

i am so happy we are where we are now.

but if you need to be right, you wont have a true relationship. Decide what you want.

My sister and I have no relationship. I am sure she thinks I am in the wrong. I think she is in the wrong. We did briefly reconcile for family reasons, but it didn't work for long and she was back to what she was. Hell would freeze over before I apologise or consider myself in the wrong. I don't care what anyone else thinks about that - they aren't in the same place as me and haven't experienced what I have, and I have no intention of involving them or discussing it with them.

Whatever your "line in the sand" is is for you to decide, but you have no right to demand that she change or apologise. That isn't a judgement on which of you is "right". Simply that no relationship will prosper if it is based on demands to change.

Thank you.

Weight/health is actually one area. Even at a healthy weight, I was never healthy enough. Everything I ate was questioned, every way I exercised. This led to a few incidents:

1. When I started having seizures, she told me that they were a choice and that I should stop making poor life choices. My seizures were not caused by any lifestyle choice.
2. She would nag me all the time about how I should take up running. I hate running - I always hated running, I will always hate running. Then, I decided to run a marathon (for a few reasons but mainly because I wanted to raise money for a charity that had helped me and also because it's a bucket list thing to do). She was completely unsupportive, wouldn't talk to me about it, didn't donate, didn't watch, didn't congratulate me - just sulked about it.
3. After DS was born, we were staying at my mum's house (her, me, my brother and respective partners). I was nursing DS and DH went to make a cup of tea. She ambushed DH in the kitchen, sat him down and she and my brother demanded to know when I was going to get back in shape and what he was doing about it, about my eating and exercise habits etc.

It's not everything but she tends to judge everything I do - and that includes any choices about my health. It's difficult because, whilst I massively respect what you've said, it's more complicated in the moment (i.e. if she made that comment at a celebration for mum's birthday - I would be wrong to storm out and not prioritise my mum, or when I hear the comment second-hand, I'd be initiating a conflict to seek her out and tell her not to comment on my body).

In this scenario I think best to just draw a line under it all and consider that you’re not giving in or going back to where you left off, but starting new and that you’ll both already have changed as a result of the experience. Tell her what you don’t want to hear moving forwards with regards to your body, that you appreciate she means well but that it’s unhelpful for you. She may well also have been told by people that she was in the right - people can absolutely be wrong and right at the same time. Main thing is finding a way to move on and avoid a repeat,

I will follow this thread with interest as we have a similar situation. I have not spoken to my Sis for 2 years, her husband physically abuses my DN and because I intervened and called it out they have campaigned to bring me down. She and her DH did not come to my wedding and even tried to wreck it 6 days beforehand. Interestingly they still allow me contact with DN (he was here on Saturday and came to the wedding) so I think on some level my sister knows I have his best interests at heart. I love and miss my sister too but she is choosing her lifestyle and marriage over her child and flesh & blood so her values don't align with mine. I have had to accept that if I want a relationship with my sister that would mean accepting a level of conflict, tension and enabling the abuse of my nephew that personally I can't tolerate.

If you boil it right down OP it's about what you can tolerate - despite all the emotional factors impacting on your life (your mums diagnosis) do her values align with yours and can you tolerate it if hers don't?

@ChocworkOrange

"I worry that it's likely that she'll just carry on again exactly as before"

but this opportunity to re-connect gives you total agency to ensure your boundaries are now in place going forward?

If you need her to acknowledge/accept her misconduct and she will not do so, where does that leave you?

I don’t have any relationship with my sister due to her behaviour.
The way she talks to people is appalling, and she will never apologise.
She has fallen out with life long friends over her comments and attitude.
She has taken part in a group sport for years, and when we were on better terms I went along thinking I might get into it. The sport itself was great but the constant “does she speak to you like this too?” and “has she always been so rude?” comments got me down so I didn’t go back.
It really is about what you can accept and move past. In my case I can’t accept, and won’t accept, being spoken to like dirt or like I’m an imbecile.
I have a more peaceful life without the nastiness and the barbed comments disguised with a tinkly laugh.

Thank you - we are civil. She tries to act as if nothing has happened - I am colder than I was but not unkind. But I don't message her separately, I don't share jokes or reels with her, I don't phone her... I almost treat her like she's mum's friend at family events - perfectly polite, but I don't have a real relationship with her.

I have said to her that, unless she acknowledges that her behaviour was wrong, I don't think I can have a relationship with her one-to-one. She just responds with odd quasi-psychiatrist phrases like "I do agree that it’s super important to consider whether a relationship is healthy and safe though, so I respect your decision if you don’t want to have a relationship with me" and then talks about how she's such a great, kind, considerate person and that she "struggles" with not giving too much of herself... It's the exact opposite to how I've experienced her. Some of it feels as though she thinks I'm unreasonable ungrateful for the great lengths she goes to try and control/fix everything that's wrong with me.

Sounds like she has a personality disorder? You'll never change her. She's always going to be right in her head.
Do you speak much to your brother who also harassed your dh about your post pg weight?

So weird.

I'd stick to being polite.

Sounds like she s giving you some space. Acknowledging that you cant come back to the closeness you had before while thinking she had your back in a way so cant say she was wrong.

just agree to disagree move on and like you say treat her a your mums friend

@ChocworkOrange I don't think I can have a relationship with her one-to-one.

Do you need to though? "Blood" can be massively overrated - there is no reason why people need to be or can be "besties" just because they have the same parents. It sounds like you actually have a relationship - your definition of "reconciliation" appears to be that she agrees with you and apologises. If you are perfectly civil to each other when you need to be, and can function in that way within the family unit, leave it be and accept that is it.

Your sister is a pain in the arse.
She isn't going to change.
Accept this.
You have enough pain and upset ahead without a horrible sister causing you more grief.

Stay distant from her, it will be less drama in the long run.
Get some counselling if you need support but stay away from her.

Honestly, do you really need her in your life? she doesn't sound like she added much to it before?

I do wonder, @ChocworkOrange (but please do correct me if I'm completely off the mark)

does she give you the impression that she, somehow, feels "superior" to you, therefore her opinion is correct?

Or, do her opinions make you feel "inferior" therefore less worthy?

It is a difficult dynamic, if so.

Only you can decide if it's worthy of repairing, with firm boundaries in place.

@PhilippaGeorgiou you're right about blood relatives being overated. I have a close relationship with my dsis cousins etc. But my closest friends are the ones I turn to usually. Plus dh and dss. It's twee but friends are family you choose.

@ChocworkOrange your sis isn't ever going to bring much to your life.

I had similar with my sister-in-law. Still decidedly chilly. I had really good support from chatGPT!

I don't think she has a personality disorder. I think she's spent too much time Googling how to be a good person and not enough time actually with people and learning by doing. Her social interactions look like watching someone do the Tour du France when they've spent years reading about how to ride a bike fast but never actually rode one.

I speak to my brother. When it came up, he admitted it happened and said they talk about my weight/body all the time. On the other hand, my sister denied it completely, called DH a liar and made comments like "this is pretty scary for me to hear" and that she's "happy to speak to DH to understand where something like this even came from"... She genuinely wanted me to think DH was lying to me about things like this rather than admit to what she did (she didn't know that my brother had already fully confirmed everything DH said).

@ChocworkOrange even if you're morbidly obese it's non of their business.