To think the school system is ridiculous

[Suflan]

This post is talking about the school system in the republic of Ireland, but I know that the school system in the UK has some similiatites, so this is also relevant to people in the UK.

I went to school in Ireland a long time ago, 20 years ago.

My younger cousins are just sitting their school leaving certificate (irish equivalent to a levels) this year and they and their friends have been posting about the exams, after it happened, on social media.

I was just thinking what they learn and do exams on is such a load of shite. Like how is it relevant or necessary in todays world at all.

They posted about their maths paper, all the quadratic equations, prove that point 5,1 is on the line etc etc, extremely complicated equations, and algebra.

Like what do you need that for in life? Its so totally pointless. And maths is mandatory to do, so they need points from maths to get into University.

Like what is the point of learning these things. Surely they should be learning something useful. My cousins have said to me that they think that a lot of what they learn is totally pointless too

Boole, born in Lincolnshire and teaching in Cork, was the massive 'father' of the particular algebra computer bods use.

I don’t have an issue with how sciences and maths are taught. However, my kids are now at university and I did not really like how some of the more analytical subjects were taught at gcse.

For example in history and English, they were taught how to pass the exam. Their essays were all about how to get the maximum number of points in each answer, rather than sharing interesting ideas and creativity. I think that aspect of the exam needs to be changed, as it seems to have got worse since my day. My kids left with top grades but v bored and disillusioned with those subjects.

However, I do appreciate the breadth of subjects that I learned at school. I’m in my 50s and still have to eke out what I can from my geography up to the age of 14 and history up to 16. I think my breadth of knowledge peaked at GCSE level!

No, because when I was a child I couldn’t see the point of it.

I did go on to study maths later as part of higher education courses, though.

Honestly OP, I find it so depressing that you work in a school and don’t think children should be challenged at all academically, exposed to anything outside their comfort zones, or widen their horizons at all.

Why learn anything, when you can just leave school with no qualifications and work in tescos, or do a bit of cash in hand labouring for your mate’s dad. No point in reading or going anywhere when you can just watch Love Island, play Call of Duty and scroll TikTok.

It is good for children to read plays, to see art, to hear and play classical music, to learn languages, and yes to consider careers like engineering and accountancy which are well-paid and meritocratic. We should have high expectations and high aspirations for our children. Thank god DS’s school doesn’t feel the same way you do.

That doesn't really answer anything. There's a big difference between a highly qualified Ed psych and a parent volunteer.

I watch Love Island and play Call of Duty. I also have a Doctorate, speak three languages, play an instrument and am very well read. 🙄

I assumed a teacher at first but then realised OP said they worked in a school which could be anything from Head to cleaner. I was initially concerned OP was an educator and questioning the point of algebra.

Come on OP what are you in the school environment? I’m not well educated (left school at 16 with barely an O level), and also wondered the same as you (until It was explained to me why algebra is important). I have changed my view and actually regret not treating maths with more respect and interest.

I don’t really see the point of that question. My son loved geography and got top marks in his GCSE but didn’t take it as an A Level.

Yes, and aren't you glad you are able to have such a wide range of interests? Wouldn't it be a shame to only watch love island all day and miss out on everything else because it's not "easy" or"accessible" or whatever OP is saying.

So what do you suggest then seeing as everything can be taught after high school? Reading , writing, sums, done. School done and dusted after Year 6?

Yes you are right. I don't make my point too eloquently 🤦.

I would like a significant compression of the details on those subjects. I recall with R.E that the time and brain space allocated to that for example, imo, is a waste for many. How exactly could we pull one out and when would be right to allow them to specialise in something else, or continue and specialise on this? That would be wonderful.

I don't know exactly how that would look. It would take work. I imagine there would be a good model somewhere. I must look at Scandinavian countries and see if there are examples nearer to what I imagine there.

I do agree ref English and shakespeare as highlighted by OP. The texts and the depth and duration of what is looked at is imo way too much. It is in fact enough to encourage only disengagement for many.

I loved English and studied this much further after school. Yet, even I saw the depth of exploration was way too enduring. I especially understand what a waste at the level and depth for those without the inclination or skill or desire. At various points I too felt ' please stop this Shakespeare bullshit now. We get it. '

This is the ultimate point I believe OP is making, and I agree with it. It isn't necessarily that there's no value for anyone.

I take note of the posters comment ref R.E and their experience specialising in this, which I hadn't considered.

I suggest we actually stop and think what we are teaching for the future, rather than leaving the subjects and level virtually unchanged for the last fifty years all the while the entire World has changed dramatically.

I'd personally be more in favour of learning skills rather than facts.

So, say, for languages, rather than concentrating on one or two MFL to a pretty high level, do a more broad brush approach of general "language learning", i.e. a lot more of the common areas such as male/female/neutral words, prefixes and suffixes, etc, i.e. the "roots" of common languages, which languages are very closely linked with similar words (often just slight differences in spellings etc) but mean the same. And more emphasis on "how" to learn a foreign language, rather than forcing kids to "just do it". Maybe more emphasis on spoken languages rather than technically correct written, i.e. teach to communicate verbally with less emphasis on technically correct essays etc.

We need to accept that "facts" and similar are now available in the palm of our hands, so "rote" learning really isn't as important anymore.

Does everyone who thinks biology, physics and chemistry are important have to take it as an A level or become doctors or pilots? Do you think biology is important, did you become a medic because of it?

Acknowledging something is important doesn’t obligate you to follow it as a career or do it as an A level.

Lol at someone who hasn't read the thread.

I did answer it.

Loads of jobs use algebra. What a ridiculous thing to say!

@BunnyLake maybe try and READ the threads that you post on

I wrote my exact job title already on this thread.

Just because you haven't bothered to read the whole thread, is not going to make me answer the question again.

Regardless of whether school kids like it or hate it, why do you think algebra is completely irrelevant in this ‘day and age’?

Your suggestions on language learning sound like a ridiculous waste of time, and I say that as someone who speaks 5 to a pretty high level.

Male/female/neutral words differ across languages (girl in German is neutral, just to take one example). Prefixes and suffices won't get you very far (does learning im, un, re, il let you understand English?). And the best way to learn "how to learn a foreign language" is actually to learn one.

Your complete lack of knowledge of about science, technology and engineering as careers is a bit shocking.

I agree with you to an extent

I fell into sciencey job and I do use maths daily but rarely anything more complicated than multiplying and dividing. Rarely algebra and trig.

what I wish had been clearer at school is that yes work out the area of a square / odd shape or circle. But make it relevant to when you’re older and needing to measure carpet to be fitted or getting a new kitchen or sofa and seeing things fit. Not just randomly working out the area of shapes without the meaning behind it.

remember doing one single lesson on Roman numerals and it was done in a this was how other empires used to count. Not this might be useful if you ever come across a clock with these symbols on.

And yet if you’d read the whole thread - you’d have seen that maths is critical in this day and age…algebra in particular. Core maths skills are needed for 80% of modern careers. Advanced maths for 15-20%

The poster above you disagrees with you

I did. I went on to study French and Politics, but I use algebra lots in my job in the Civil Service.

It'd actually be better if all schools taught a second language from the start. Being bilingual from the age of 4 gave me so many skills in translanguaging, understanding different grammar patterns and identifying when to use them, picking up new language rules. I pick up new languages so quickly as a result. We need more language learning, not less.

All children in Ireland are taught English and Irish...that's a whole other thread.