SEN funding isn't a bottomless money pit

[Sogfree]

I'll preface this by saying I really enjoy my job working in a SEN school. I care deeply for the children and families I work with.

I've had 4 different conversations this week with parents where they expect an excessive amount of additional resource to be allocated to their child. They expect this as, in their opinion, it's needed. I disagree with 3 of the 4 parents that this is needed.

All 4 of the parents are going to fight the decisions county have made. Their decision to fight will mean county spend more money arguing the challenge.

Services are already broken with the increase in need. Recruitment fails, as there aren't enough speech therapists/OTs/CAMHS practitioners etc to employ.

One parent demanding extra from one of these services means another child gets less.

One parent demanding a child goes to school X at £100k per year when a place at school Y at £30k is going to meet their needs means the child who needs the place at school X doesn't get it, and extra £70k per year is wasted. And the parent keeps their child out of school for 12-18 months whilst they fight for the place at school X.

That's the reality.

Every parent wants the world for their child. I understand that. But taxpayers can't afford to give every child the world.

AIBU - parents know their child best and we should fund what the parents say the child needs

YANBU - there's only so much money to go around and parents need to accept hard decisions have to be made without challenging them

I agree with this. Even at Sen schools its the loud aggressive kids that get the most attention, resources, support. Quiet kids always get mugged off. Im on a personal mission to bring balance though. Im glad your son is doing well now :-)

Then they need to invest in state education to ensure that independent providers aren’t relied upon!

My son is very 'in between'. He's not disabled enough for SEN school but disabled enough that he has a EHCP and receives significant support at MS.

So he doesn't have a profound disability.

2 with EHCPs and yes.

Not the poster of that post but that’s not necessarily true.

my son is in year 10 at mainstream secondary. He very much has “complex and profound” disabilities, he just happens to also be academically quite able so falls into the no mans land. In order to access the curriculum he has full time 1-1 and a lot of intervention and a fantastic SEN team at his school.

Either you have been incredible unlucky with your LA, or you are exactly the sort of parent this thread is about.

Im a parent with a child with a learning disability in a SEN school and YANBU.
I kept him in mainstream till I knew he would no longer cope with mainstream and that was the senior school years.

I see lots of parents demanding sen places, 1:1s etc when their child simply doesnt need it. The sustem is broken.

YABU but that's because you are referring to parents 'demanding' support. No parent ever gets LA support from demanding it alone. There is always a strong rationale for need if support is given. A parent challenging a decision does not automatically mean support is given. The decision may be overturned if it was deemed incorrect IN THE FIRST PLACE... in which case the LA is the one at fault for wrongly rejecting a request for support in the first place. You, as a school SENCo, do not have the overview or final say on this.

Yes of course one child getting support means there is potentially less in the pot for another child. That's how it works when there is only a finite amount of money. But should that mean a parent shouldn't raise objections to what, in their opinion, is a poor decision? Of course not. Just because they are raising objections doesn't mean the decision eill go in their favour. It will only go in their favour if there is clear evidence of need.

As for the LA spending money on parental challenges... LAs often act unlawfully and reject EHCP applications by default. My son is autistic and has ADHD and his EHCP application was rejected initially. I raised objections and it was suddenly overturned- because the LA had made the incorrect decision in the first place. My son's needs are severe but the LA did not act lawfully on many occasions. Of course I should have the right to raise this. We don't live in a totalitarian society (yet!).

Finally, the money issue... untimately there are too many children qualifying for, and needing, support than there is money. Either a lot more funding is needed, or an overhaul of the system is needed. However, that is not your job nor mine. And to sit down and write this post and expect parents not to challenge decisions made by the LA that they deem incorrect? Disgraceful attitude - and I'm very glad you're not the SENCo in my son's school.

He doesn't have a learning disability, autism or global developmental delay which means that the SEN schools in the nearby area aren't suitable for his needs.

He has 2:1 TA's at school and is significantly physically disabled.

Personally I would have preferred for my child not to have multiple complex disabilities, and to have his needs met at the local school, followed by a typical life of working and full independence. Unfortunately that isn’t how things worked out for him.

The LA doesn't pay for the most of the assessments (apart from EP), submissions to EHCP's are funded by the NHS for physio, OT, SLT, medical and nursing as long as the child is already known to them.

By profound do you actually mean he would fall into the category of PMLD? Because it really wouldn't be possible for a child to get to Y10 in mainstream with PMLD. No mainstream can cater for that high a level of need.

Unlucky with the LA? Ha. This is extremely common behaviour by LAs across the country. So many are acting unlawfully and our SEN children are being continually failed. I applaud this parent who fought for her child's rights and I'm disgusted by anyone who would criticise her for this.

Well said.

Profound disability as in diagnosis like Retts or Angelman.

Edit: Physical disability alone should absolutely be accommodated in mainstream (with suitable adaptations) where possible.

Profound can mean more than learning difficulties though! He has many documents which state it but if you want to dispute to meet whatever you want to think then fine.

Yes. I'm one of those parents. PhD in Education, know the system inside out, conducted research into SEN system, currently a teacher. I unapologetically fought for my son's EHCP, as is my legal right, as he needs the support offered. There is absolutely nothing wrong with exercising this right (as some would have you believe). I fought for my son's rights as a disabled child. Now, if there is anything unfair about that, then that the fault of the system, not of me or my son. If other children aren't getting the support they need, again, that is the fault of the system and not of me or my son. Stop blaming the victim and start looking to the government to sort out this mess. The OP had a diabolical attitude (especially for a SENCo - I'm disgusted).

I'm in a similar position. I have a foster DC that has to travel and hour each way every day for Sixth Form costing £43.5k per year. I have an Ofsted Outstanding special school less than a mile from me. I'd be happy to walk him there. Both schools can meet his needs but the closer one has much better Sixth Form options for him. LA and his SW seems to want him to live with us but travel 2 hours every day to his current school. His current Deputy Headteacher has somehow managed to convince his SW that only their school can meet DC needs. It's not true I've had a previous foster child in the closer special school and they are a much better school.

It’s exemplifies the problem that somebody with no legal or medical training who has a duty of care to children could write such disgraceful things, doesn’t it? And demonstrates precisely why a “SENCO” is a completely inappropriate person to be gatekeeping or making any decisions on what provision a child requires. Just like the Local Authority staff, in the vast majority of cases they are far too ignorant to be making any such judgement and are not remotely qualified to do so.

How can you possibly see their educational requirements as a parent of another child? Have you been acting as their educational psychologist; PhD qualified; understanding their needs and running a battery of tests to establish what they need?

You have a very high opinion of your own skills.

Like pp, despite the fact that he doesn't have any learning disabilities, profound is how he's described in many of his documents. Though complex is the word most often used.

He doesn't technically have a diagnosis any more. As I said, he's a very 'in between' case because he doesn't fit neatly into a diagnosis of say autism or retts or down syndrome because he wasn't always disabled.

Well, yes, but when we're talking about specialist provision the obvious meaning would be the PMLD category as opposed to the common usage of profound.

Well they have failed all their SEND inspections, paid multiple consultants to come in and have constant DfE oversight.

Or maybe I've just been busy bribing the corrupt and incompetent SEND tribunal to ensure my child has the Rolls Royce education case law says they absolutely cannot have 😂

I notice you didn't make comment on the high level of lgsco decisions. Are they corrupt and incompetent too?

@CluelessBereavement DS1 is profoundly disabled, as recognised by every professional involved in his care and education, but he doesn’t have a LD. He has a complex mix of developmental, physical, psychological and medical needs. Profound disability doesn’t always equal PMLD even when you are discussing SS. It only always means that when you are discussing LD.