To think council housing is really unfair??

[Helpmechooseausername]

I totally get that some people need to be housed by the council, but AIBU to think that the system is abused - but it seems to be his the system works?

I know of two families who have lived in their council houses for years and raised their children there. They needed help when they first moved in, and so were quite fairly given council houses. But, now the kids have grown up and moved on. The parents both have got jobs, nice cars, holidays, go out for meals, etc., etc.. They can continue living in their council houses for the rest of their lives.

It seems massively unfair. Is it really not means tested?? Surely the houses should be given to other people who need them? How can it be right that they aren't told to move back into the private property market?

I feel a bit like when I stand in a queue in a shop, waiting to pay, while people come in and just take what they want without paying or queuing!!

And yes, I'll admit that I'm jealous! I can't afford to do any nice things for my kids and I, despite working hard, and it seems to be because I chose to own my own home and get a mortgage instead of getting a council house!

Pardon?

I think there is an under supply of council housing for people that genuinely need it because people that no longer need it are disincentivised to move out.

I don’t think that some people should have a leg up when others that work just as hard do not. I think where taxes are spent, these should be fairly allocated.

We live in SH. We aren't the problem. The problem is the market that has incentivised buy to rent for the wealthy, which drove house prices up, then rental prices went up.

Do you seriously think that kicking tenants out of their SH property would help anyone? There would be no incentive to work hard and come off benefits or improve your situation. It doesn't pay to work would become even worse because by working hard you could end up homeless.

I don’t think the answer is kicking people out but perhaps calculating the rent on a points based system. So you’d have a starting point just below market rate then there’s a reduction for children under 18, then a reduction if your income is below a certain amount, decrease for certain disabilities meaning the property needs certain adaptions, an increase for spare bedrooms and children coming of age. This feels a bit fairer to me as I agree with you that 2 adults on full time wages with flash cars shouldn’t be paying the cheap rent of a council house at everyone else’s expense.

It shouldn't happen in the private rented sector either. It didn't used to, until 1988. Before that, all tenancies were assured. IMO that's what needs to change, same as with everything else - if there's a group of people who are disadvantaged by how the law is, change the law so they're no longer disadvantaged. Don't change it so that even more people have a shit deal!

I would love a council house. I fled domestic violence with my two children years ago and I am in a HA 2 bedroom flat paying £950 a month! When the rent is increased again next April I will no longer be able to afford to live here despite it supposedly being affordable housing

Beware the unintended consequences.

If people are going to have their home taken off them if they earn over a set threshold they will just ensure that they stay under that threshold by avoiding promotion/ going part time or having one partner stay at home. All that will do is reduce the tax take and increase the need for top up benefits.

That's what the OP appears to be saying, or did you not read the post you quoted?

The problem is the right to buy scheme and lack of social housing. Not people who want and value secure low term rented housing. Why do people fo this? When a bad policy and lack of investment produces problems, it’s suddenly the users of those services that are causing the problem? It’s the same with posts about the nhs. Try using some critical thinking skills.

Also forcing those people into private rented is not the answer as there’s not enough of that either. Pushing more people into it will cause rents to go up even higher and make it even more unaffordable. We have a housing crisis and that is not the fault of the ordinary person who has no control of housing policy and is just trying to make their way through life the best they can.

What would be unfair is if the council gave people a secure tenancy and then effectively tore it up when it suited. That would not only be unfair but unlawful.

Also it would disincentivise council tenants from working or going for promotion.

Also the best way of creating a 'sink estate' is to move out all the wealthier tenants until the whole place is filled with people living in poverty. The whole thing works much better if it's mixed income. It was never supposed to be housing for poor people.

We should never have sold it off.

I feel a bit like when I stand in a queue in a shop, waiting to pay, while people come in and just take what they want without paying or queuing

You’re comparing shoplifting to someone renting a council house. Can’t decide if you’re actually this thick or on some kind of a wind up. Or both.

Any more anti landlord legislation and it will be a moot point how many rights tenants have because there won't be any properties available to rent.

@MyCyanReader Can you please provide a housing management system that will do this?
I don't fancy ringing all my tenants and then do the math for it.

Some of my customers get basic UC some get ESA PIP, (talking one will get £390 to live off and one over £1200) should rent be benefit means tested too?

700 is cheap! Where do you live?? A 3 bed here (South :not London) costs £1600. Council rents are always much cheaper than private rent my nieces 2 bed council flat is £630 rent, it would be over 900 private. Anyone having a council property is getting a good deal.

I don’t understand the mentality of wanting to reduce other people’s quality of life by evicting them. Everyone should have a safe secure home and we should be building more good quality housing to achieve that.

It’s not the fault of someone living in one council house that you have a mortgage and struggle to get by - they haven’t influenced the housing market or forced you to buy. They have as much right as you to choose where they live in their old age, even if they didn’t take a mortgage.

Council housing has only recently been so coveted, and overwhelmingly so on mumsnet for some reason. Yabu.

But they’ll be paying a heavily subsidised rent…why should a retired couple get to keep a cheap 3-bed house when their kids have all grown up and moved out? They should get a 1-bed flat. The only ones who should get to keep a 3-bed house are those who, y’know, actually bought their own?

People who get council houses don’t generally stand to inherit to any significant extent. You could just as easily say that the inheritance system is unfair and abolish it or increase inheritance tax.

The grass is always greener but sometimes it’s better to count our blessings (or know our privilege as the kids say these days)

@Helpmechooseausername a lot of the problem is one parent families. both parents still need homes big enough to accomodate their children! previously the family would stay in one home but now they require two!! the people who are in homes are hopefully paying rent. it doesnt matter how much they earn, they are entitled to stay in the house which was allocated to them. your needs and their needs are exactly the same- a roof over your heads! you opted to buy most likely for a better area.

I feel a bit like when I stand in a queue in a shop, waiting to pay, while people come in and just take what they want without paying or queuing!!

I must be doing it wrong because I pay full rent and have always done so. Please tell me where I get to "just come in and take without paying or queuing"!

Council (or housing association) houses aren't free! Those entitled to housing benefit, or uc with housing element get that whether they are in council,HA OR private rental!

Those who are not entitled pay rent in council, HA or private!

My parents grew up in a time when lots of people lived in council housing, not just those in real need. Then Maggie decided to offer right to buy, which I think would have been fantastic if more council housing was built, but it wasn't. Every successive government has failed with housing, both social and with allowing prices to spiral out of control.

The problem is we've been convinced as a society by the right wing press that it is shameful to live in social housing and that the more your house if worth if you own it the better, but that is just bollocks in many cases.

Yes, there are many more needy people out there than the family you mention but the system is wrong because there isn't enough provision. Wouldn't it be great to live in a society where you could choose to live somewhere decent with a decent rent?

The government has got away with not building new social homes because people fell into the idea of 2 income mortgages. How many could afford to buy if the old style one income mortgages were the norm. There would be far more pressure to get it sorted if they couldn't afford to buy in exactly the same way low income 2 wage families still cant afford it either.

There needs to be a mass social housing build. It needs to be the norm for long term rentals leaving the private market for shorter term rents.

Originally most council housing was for working people, not just families, of good character and married.

Well no, they shouldn't. They will for the most part have a secure tenancy which means that as long as they don't breech the terms, they are legally entitled to retain it for life, paying the rent the local authority deems fit. The fact you don't like that doesn't mean people should forego their rights under law to make you happier.

Actually yes we can.
Just like people are kicked out of ‘their home’ when they rent.
Unfortunately it’s not THEIR home. It’s the council’s and Theyre renting (at preferential rates).

And if they dint fit the criteria anymore, they need to go to private renting. They’ll have to cope like anyone else who is renting and might be hoping to get a council house. Like the OP.

Fwiw other countries review periodically if someone is still entitled to a council house. It’s not hard.

I agree to an extent. Many people would have been unable to get a foot on the property ladder if weren't for Thatcher but it just went too far for too long.
The only good thing Sturgeon done (in Scotland)was put an end to it.

And yet, back when we had assured tenancies and now in countries that have them today, there were many more tenants and many more private rented properties than there is in the UK currently. Britain was always traditionally a rentier economy, back in the bad old days of lifetime private sector tenancies and rent controls.