Report scouts volunteers for stealing food?

[ThereIsACatOnMyLapAgain]

Volunteers in scouts do a hard job. I know the positive impact scouts has and Im very grateful to the volunteers.

We moved house 6 months ago and my son changed scout groups.

Last month I volunteered to help at a 2 night scout camp. "Scouts" means cubs and scouts. It was pretty physical with lots of walking, some climbing etc.

The leaders didnt give the scouts much to eat. For example, breakfast was a bowl of own brand cereal but the cereal only just covered the bottom of the (admittedly large) bowl with literally a splash of milk. Lunch was one slice of burger type cheese in 2 slices of cheap white bread and a packet of own brand crisps. Dinner was one hot dog from a jar in a bread bun or pasta with an own brand jar sauce. No snacks. Apparently they didn't cook enough pasta and some of the older scouts didn't even have any dinner at all one day. I didn't know about this until my son told me.

I'm not bothered by the quality/unhealthy food for 3 days and Im certainly not expecting any "proper cooking", however, the amount of food was just so little and the scouts were complaining they were hungry.all the time.

I wasn't in charge of the food and the kitchen was kept locked. When I asked, they said they needed to make the food last so I assumed they were on a tight budget and/or the volunteers had to buy the food themselves. Not great but understandable to ration. Then I overheard one of the leaders saying their funds were very healthy.

On the last day I was helping to clean up and went in the kitchen and saw bags of fresh food, tins of branded soup, tins of fruit, expensive pot noodles, packs of ham etc. They were all bought for camp.

I asked what happens to any left over food and was told that the leaders take it. I said should we give some of this food out as the scouts are hungry. They reluctantly agreed I could give out the tinned fruit which I did. When I went back into the kitchen afterwards all the food had disappeared.

One of the leaders later joked about how happy her rabbit would be with the fresh salad. I didn't click the comment straight away.

So the volunteers bought plenty of food using scout funds but then kept a significant amount aside to take home and fed the scouts crap. I can't see any other explanation? My son said afterwards that the scouts in his tent had snack bars with them because it's normal to not have enough food at scout camps.

His previous group was so, so different. They would invite other groups to eat with them and send the scouts home with any left over food.

My wife thinks I need to report it to the district as theft but I'm not sure that is wise.

I'm not in the position to go to all events/camps.

YANBU - of course you report it. The scouts are not being fed properly and the leaders may as well just be taking the subs money. If they steal food like this, what else are they dishonest about?

YABU - they will know you reported it which may impact on your son's treatment. Volunteers deserve to take home some cake every so often. Plus, good luck finding new volunteers if reporting causes some volunteers to get sacked/quit. 3 days of limited food isnt a big deal in the grand scheme of scouts and not enough to potentially force the group to close.

I know people have seized on possible stealing motivation in post but I really can’t understand that - 2 days or more hard work unpaid for a few tins and a pack of ham makes zero sense to me.
My guess is either very inexperienced camp cook or very odd dynamic (don’t challenge Leader she always does it this way)
It definitely needs you to speak up and looking at as something has gone very wrong.
I also can’t understand how it wasn’t an issue at time - doling out cheese slice sandwiches surely some kids allergic dairy, don’t like cheese, the bigger lads would ask for another sandwich etc
Running out of pasta for tea - there would surely to a line of kids with no food.

This is absolutely vile and outrageous!

I used to do a lot of my Dads admin (typing stuff up) when he was the Child Protection/Safety Officer for an outdoor extreme sports thing (bit outing if I say exactly what, though it was a long long time ago), so worked through a LOT of information about the risks, with Scouting and school trips incidents/deaths providing several case studies.

One of the commonly misunderstood risks when doing any outdoors stuff with kids is hypothermia and its often assumed people will only get hypothermia if temps are super low and/or they get wet.

Not the case, and more so with children - if you dramatically decrease their calorie intake whilst dramatically increasing their exercise, you don't need either factor! Just a kid who is already a bit on the lean side or hasn't got warm enough clothing/warm enough sleeping bag, or was already brewing a cold or similar... and that can be enough to tip the balance!

Of course this doesn't mean they'll all wake up stiff and blue, but if the volunteer leaders are unaware of the increased risk they're creating... you have to wonder what else they're unaware of/not taking seriously!

It sounds like this starvation camp has been the case for a while if other kids were expecting it and there weren't loud complaints!

Definately report it. I might be that whoever supervises doesnt know and the volunteers have just fallen into a culture of doing what has always been done but it needs to stop.
Helping yourself to abit of leftover food Id understand but thats straight up stealing!

I'm an ex cub leader and current explorer leader. If that is actually what happened, then that is appalling and needs escalating to the GSL (unless of course they were involved...). Our "Scouts" are very generously fed on camp, with plenty of fresh stuff, snacks, bedtime supper,and a cooked breakfast as well as 3 meals and drinks on demand.

But bear in mind that the volunteers may have bought or brought their own food independently to keep camp costs down.

Were they rationing the cereal to stop big kids taking half the box and leaving nothing for the younger ones? Or to stop young ones spilling it? Or to manage wastage? Were the young people allowed seconds of they were still hungry?

I'd check these things out, because there's nothing more galling than giving up hours of your free time, paying to go on camp, paying to do your training and then being accused of theft. Except for maybe watching a Beaver fill a cereal bowl to the brim, dump a pint of milk on it and then not eat it.

Gosh that’s rubbish. We did a Brownie camp recently and they had plenty of food, plus we had food-based activities where they made snacks etc. Didn’t hear anyone say they were hungry all weekend (and our girls aren’t shy about telling us things ).

Volunteer food came from trip budget too but it was hardly luxury, we had pasta the first evening before the girls arrived and then what they had the other night. We did have some leader-only biscuits I brought my own food as I am on special diet for medical reasons currently.

Sounds very miserable and not the ethos of these things. We only ever aim to cover costs with the charge for these trips, all the money paid goes into stuff for the trip. If we have leftover money we might take girls for an ice cream or to buy a souvenir with it.

Haha we had the same on a recent Brownie trip! At half 11, 30 mins after they’d had their snack, the ‘is it lunchtime yet?’ chorus began. They were appalled when I told them that some people don’t have lunch till 1 or even later!

Yep, you’d have to be the thickest thief in the world to donate this amount of time for such limited rewards!

Completely understand what you are saying and agree it's sensible to do small portions and come back for more if you're hungry. But they were just small portions. No seconds. They were told no if they asked for more.

As I keep saying, I appreciate that they may have bought supplies from their own money. I don't think that's the case though. However even if it was, why would they buy them but not serve them? What would be the point? That is a genuine question.

I'd love there to be some sensible explanation to restricting / keeping the food.

Allergies were catered for eg one cub was gluten free. Their food was kept in a seperate ice box (not in the fridge with the other food) and had specific utensils and so on. I know this because I had a discussion with them about it. I wasn't in the kitchen but I assume they followed it otherwise why would they go to that much effort?

There were other allergies. I can't remember the details but they were constantly double checking with each other every time food was served.

I have no concerns about their management of dietary requirements.

Honestly, there with things I didn't like/agree with but the only thing I was concerned over is the quantity of food.

That's terrible, I would definitely report it to the Trustees. I'm a scout leader and no-one goes hungry on camp - there's always cooked breakfast (plus cereal for those that want as well), a hot lunch unless they're out hiking and hot dinner plus a pudding. Scouts always get served first, then Young leaders, then leaders - so if we were short then it would be leaders who would be hungry. We often have bread left over that ends up in my freezer, and I bring home the half empty bottles of ketchup but I don't gain anything else!

It sounds like they have a case of "We've always done it this way" And are reluctant to change it. Might be thinking they can run a camp for a tenner a head, or catering for a child being half an adult, or just someone who thinks they know best.

But it won't change if everyone just buys their head on the sand. Its probably not maliciousness.

I volunteer with a different uniformed youth group.

Our meals are huge and varied, perfected over decades. We know how to scale up quantities depending upon how many kids are there and noone is ever hungry.

Breakfast is porridge and cereal, followed by bacon/sausage/eggs/halloumi with beans/tomatoes/mushrooms.

Lunch is usually sandwich, roll, wrap based. Cheese hummus, tomatoes, eggs etc plus salad. Crisps, biscuits, fruit, yoghurts.

Dinner is a filling hot meal with potato rice or pasta followed by a decent pudding.

Open access to fruit during the day.

All food preparation is communal - kids take it in turn to be part of the cooking team. We cook in the open on gas burners and it's incredibly clear to everyone what's available.

We minimise waste but such leftovers as we have go home with volunteers. It's all left in a pile and people help themselves in public.

I'd love for someone to come up with an explanation for it. I really would.

I'm pretty sure the leaders didn't pay for it with their own money but even if they did, why didn't they serve it? What's the point in going to the effort of shopping for camp, carting it with you with no intention of serving it and then lugging it back? Why buy it in the first place if you plan to keep it?

I agree that it is ludicrous to suggest that the leaders are spending all this time and energy so they can get a couple of free posh pot noodles. That is what makes this so bizarre in my mind.

The fact is, there was plenty of food but the scouts weren't given it to eat despite them complaining they were hungry.

I'm not oppossed to the leaders having some fancy biscuits on the camp budget (and I don't think many parents would be) but the leaders also missed meals as there wasn't any food so that wasn't the case.

Anyway, I've sent an email to my son's previous leader asking if I can have a chat. I've not said what about. She is lovely so hopefully will shed some light on it or give me advice.

I'm feeling really guilty that I let this happen so that tells me I need to do something. I am scared it will negatively impact on the group though.

Reporting might impact on the group. But its a potential safeguarding issue if children are going without meals.

I think chatting to old leader is a good first port of call. Good luck.

Hopefully though your feedback will improve the catering for the camps in the future. Clearly the kids enjoy it atm but it’s important to me as a parent that they are well fed, and if not I would not support it by sending my child again. Just do it the right way, stick to facts, compared to other camps the food was poor and don’t make any accusations.

Yanbu.
I am a former cub leader and have done a lot of camps in Cubs, Scouts, and for Girl Guides as well.

You need to feed the young people (Cubs, Scouts, Guides, Venturers whatever) properly. They are on the go all day, probably burning energy like they don’t normally do. They are tired so feel everything more. You need them to have full bellies to be comfortable and comforted, to keep going with the activities, not be homesick, and not get emotional and start causing rows/getting homesick…

Yez, camp food is usually a combination of cheaper Lidl food to make funds go far enough, and plenty of fresh fruit to keep them healthy. Part of scouting is actually about learning about healthy food and to take responsibility for cooking/cleaning up as patrols, not depending on adults to do it all. Camp is supposed to be a fun time, and a chance to learn and practise skills of all sorts. So you need energy.

I am horrified! Yes, if there was leftovers, we would either take it home to keep for next camp (unopened non perishables) or spread it out between the parents who help strike camp/unpack gear and the leaders. But it’s literally whatever is leftover. We plan relatively well to not over-buy but always plan enough extra for dealing with emergencies of all sorts.

and we also plan to keep the costs to parents as low as possible. Not spend as little on young people’s food so we can get loads! (Our one luxury is a packet of the good teabags as we drink gallons and gallons of that from dawn -5am - to dusk - often past 2am!). The other luxury of recent years, a bag of ground coffee to go in 1 leader’s camping cafetière, were bought by that leader from their own pocket - for the first cup in the morning for each of the sleep deprived leaders.

I'm a scout leader. If anything we over cater for camp, have a menu on the board and the more people that hell in the kitchen the better!

Speak to the glv (formerly gsl) about it

Wtf. No no. I can't believe they are doing that.

Scout leader here. Typical day for us would be with scouts and explorers we put cereal on the table and they help themselves (usually we have to do a milk run a couple of time lol). As much toast as they want or we might do sausages baps one morning.

Lunch is always two sandwhiches or choice of ham or cheese, packet crisps and massive bowl of fruit to help themselves.

Dinner is usually bbq with lots of hotdogs and sausages then smors for dessert. Or huge amount of pasta that always has left overs
There's packets of biscuits broken out regularly

We keep camp as cheap as possible so parents arnt stretched. We only expect our basic food to be covered (same as kids eat) and we bring our own purchased snacks on an evening once everyone is bedded down.

Should add leader buy their own tea and coffee as well.

Personally I’d email your local volunteer Cub Scout and thank him/her for the camp but detail that your son and others were hungry throughout after such restrictive rations and you’d like to do the camp with them next time to help them meet the needs of the cubs. You understand it involves lots of work.

If I was a parent paying for these camps I’d expect my kids to be fed.It actually needs reporting as a safe guarding issue as the kids are being neglected on these camps due to lack of food.

I'm horrified by what you describe OP - I really hope you've got the wrong end of the stick somehow, but please do raise it with your leadership team.

I cater for Scout, Cub and Beaver camps in our section, and am constantly amazed by how much food they can put away after a day or two of physical activity, it's like they have hollow legs! I always supply plentiful high protein meals, with plenty of carbohydrates, and a constant supply of chopped fruit/home-made flapjacks/cake as snacks. I also avoid UPF, except in cases where a young person has restricted eating and needs something extra as a 'safe' food.

If your young people are being told they can't have second helpings, and are going hungry during the day, then they won't get as much out of the camp, so it's a daft thing to do - plus anyone who's dealt with 30+ hangry young people knows enough to never get into that situation again

Definitely report this, it sounds all wrong. No young people should be going without meals and whoever was in charge should have rectified that, by asking for more to be cooked or driving to the nearest shop. The food should be covered in the charge for camp and pasta is not expensive. I think this is a case of poor planning and poor leadership rather than stealing.

My daughter just got back from guide camp. They had cereal and cooked breakfast, a fruit bowl they could help themselves to and good cooked meals, spaghetti etc. We were asked to send cakes, no nuts, in a box for the puddings. Maybe you could ask if the camp leaders need help with catering from parent volunteers? 3 leaders doing everything might be a bit short staffed?