Report scouts volunteers for stealing food?

[ThereIsACatOnMyLapAgain]

Volunteers in scouts do a hard job. I know the positive impact scouts has and Im very grateful to the volunteers.

We moved house 6 months ago and my son changed scout groups.

Last month I volunteered to help at a 2 night scout camp. "Scouts" means cubs and scouts. It was pretty physical with lots of walking, some climbing etc.

The leaders didnt give the scouts much to eat. For example, breakfast was a bowl of own brand cereal but the cereal only just covered the bottom of the (admittedly large) bowl with literally a splash of milk. Lunch was one slice of burger type cheese in 2 slices of cheap white bread and a packet of own brand crisps. Dinner was one hot dog from a jar in a bread bun or pasta with an own brand jar sauce. No snacks. Apparently they didn't cook enough pasta and some of the older scouts didn't even have any dinner at all one day. I didn't know about this until my son told me.

I'm not bothered by the quality/unhealthy food for 3 days and Im certainly not expecting any "proper cooking", however, the amount of food was just so little and the scouts were complaining they were hungry.all the time.

I wasn't in charge of the food and the kitchen was kept locked. When I asked, they said they needed to make the food last so I assumed they were on a tight budget and/or the volunteers had to buy the food themselves. Not great but understandable to ration. Then I overheard one of the leaders saying their funds were very healthy.

On the last day I was helping to clean up and went in the kitchen and saw bags of fresh food, tins of branded soup, tins of fruit, expensive pot noodles, packs of ham etc. They were all bought for camp.

I asked what happens to any left over food and was told that the leaders take it. I said should we give some of this food out as the scouts are hungry. They reluctantly agreed I could give out the tinned fruit which I did. When I went back into the kitchen afterwards all the food had disappeared.

One of the leaders later joked about how happy her rabbit would be with the fresh salad. I didn't click the comment straight away.

So the volunteers bought plenty of food using scout funds but then kept a significant amount aside to take home and fed the scouts crap. I can't see any other explanation? My son said afterwards that the scouts in his tent had snack bars with them because it's normal to not have enough food at scout camps.

His previous group was so, so different. They would invite other groups to eat with them and send the scouts home with any left over food.

My wife thinks I need to report it to the district as theft but I'm not sure that is wise.

I'm not in the position to go to all events/camps.

YANBU - of course you report it. The scouts are not being fed properly and the leaders may as well just be taking the subs money. If they steal food like this, what else are they dishonest about?

YABU - they will know you reported it which may impact on your son's treatment. Volunteers deserve to take home some cake every so often. Plus, good luck finding new volunteers if reporting causes some volunteers to get sacked/quit. 3 days of limited food isnt a big deal in the grand scheme of scouts and not enough to potentially force the group to close.

Definitely agree with this. Don’t make an accusation. Contact the scout group leader and and give details of the food provided.Do you know what the cost of the trip was per child?
You don’t even need to mention the ‘leftovers’ . The leader will be able to work out for them selves the difference between what was spent and what was served. They can then conclude from there.

I was on a Beaver camp at the weekend and the Beavers were given more food than your Scouts. I would definitely contact the Group Scout Leader to say that you were concerned that the Scout Meals were not sufficient for them and confirm exactly what food was served.

We do feedback after camp, and last year the Scouts (especially the older boys) said more food... this was after a cooked breakfast, lunch was sandwiches, crisps, fruit and biscuits, and a massive bbq late afternoon. So we are adding an extra meal for them!

Leaders do take "leftovers" home but only stuff that would go to waste... tins, crisps, biscuits etc stay, meat and bread is frozen. So its just fresh fruit and salad really. I've taken home a load of banana, made banana bread and sent it back for snack time.

If they are purposefully hoarding food it is wrong.

So the leaders didn't eat anything extra that you saw? Because I'd think they were eating more than the measly portions you are suggesting were served.

They gave the fruit out because you pushed them.

Camp funds may be a separate pot to "main" funds so unit funds for activities might be healthy compared to their camp budget.

But it really does need reporting. Camp is cold and active and you need extra fuel. Like I say, it's bordering on a Safeguarding risk for me that they weren't being fed properly

This.
They aren't giving the kids enough food. You factor in the cost of food when you set the price for a camp. The hoarding of not surplus food would concern me too.

People paid for that food, either through fundraising, or parental contributions, on the understanding it would be fed to the children, and volunteers.
I would list all the types of food that weren’t served (salad, noodles, fruit…) then send a mail to the most senior person in the organisation, locally, to ask if there’s any guidelines re waste of funds if food is not planned properly, so it’s purchased and not served, also asking what process is in place to ensure that the camp’s menu is checked in advance (so it’s appropriate) and that what is purchased matches what’s on the menu.

That is bizarre. Who are these people out of interest? What do they do out of Scouts as i would be concerned about other general behaviour they might be showing that you’re not seeing.

That’s awful. Do parents pay for camp?

Those poor kids must have been so hungry.

Absolutely report as a safegurding issue. As a scout leader I haven't done any camps yet but I am an ex girl guiding leader and ran the catering for several large camps. For every camp I would break down every single meal and the items to ensure there was enough plus leftovers. So for example cooked breakfast one sausage per child and two per adult, 1 piece of toast, 1 hash brown per person and so on. Giving an extra couple of portions contingency (say 5 per 30 people). Not everyone would choose everything so there were always enough leftovers for everyone. Any leftovers were kept refrigerated and were offered for the next meal (surprising how cold sausages were devoured), every hot meal had a pudding with it and elvenses were fruit and three's were cake or biscuit. We would ask parents to supply fruit to camp so one group would supply apples another bananas etc. This kept costs down but ensured we had enough. At the end we had very little leftovers for leaders to take home. It was generally fruit or cake and we would donate the fruit to an animal rescue for their wild animals and then cake if sealed we would keep for the next camp. To add I would itemise each item in a spreadsheet with what was needed, pack size and costs. I would get another adult to scan over and check I hadn't missed anything obvious before we went out and bought everything. I once had a camp where the fridges didn't work, I stead of not serving the items a couple of leaders and a group of guides walked to the shops and replaced the items.

In the case of there not being enough pasta why on earth did another adult not drive to a shop? The older kids could have easily waited another hour to be fed but just not feeding them at all is cruel.

I would report it to the district, but be prepared that it might end up with volunteers leaving the role.

Their behaviour is disgusting. My kids used to come back from scout camp saying they’d eaten loads. The food on camp was a big part of the experience.

I wouldn't have an issue with adult volunteers taking leftovers home, but this situation is completely different. The children were going hungry and no one thought this was a problem? Wild.

It all sounds very odd and concerning. I definitely think raise it. When you are looking after a group of kids as volunteers last thing you need is kids complaining they are hungry. I’m a girlguiding leader and food is usually plentiful and doled out regularly. The kids often get involved in planning meals or choosing from list.
If we do pasta we’d serve it pasta, sauce separately and cheese separately with garlic bread as even fussy ones will usually eat plain pasta and cheese.
We obviously try not to overbuy but long life stuff like biscuits goes in cupboard for another time if left over.
Brownies last pack holiday breakfast was choice of cereal, juice (lots had never poured own cereal/milk or juice so that’s exciting for them) plus brioche or croissant.

The leaders sometimes missed meals because there wasn't enough food made eg we generally didnt have lunch and on the night with the pasta and sauce, they didn't cook enough pasta so apparently some scouts didnt eat and the leaders definitely didnt eat. However I later saw 2 packets of pasta that hadn't been cooked so I don't understand why there wasn't enough food made, even if that meant making a second batch because they misjudged the amount when they first made it.

Its just so weird.

Just checking... if you were there overnight you've gone DBS etc?

The group sounds, at the very least, it needs extra help (from District, not just patents)

If the volunteers left because they were part of stealing children’s food that would be a GOOD thing.

if you’re DC is old enough take him to air cadets. Most of the volunteers have a healthy respect for the young people. Your DC will be able to go gliding, go on camps and obtain a BTEC. Some squadrons have a band and they will teach the DC to play an instrument. Safeguarding is taken very seriously and the leaders are all very well qualified.
in case you’re wondering, I am a volunteer at a cub pack and our leaders would never do what you have stated but my DGS has had a terrible experience with scouts amounting to bullying from the leaders. Nothing happened when my DC complained so my DGS had to leave. He is now old enough for ATC and is very happy.
Volunteers are difficult to find and a senior leader suggested our pack take on more children. They soon backed down when 2 of the leaders said they’d leave if this went ahead so don’t expect anything to happen when you complain!

That's absolutely dreadful. I was a scout and young leader and we always made sure we had plenty of food available, huge meals were cooked. Snacks available as well as the tuck shop box. Absolutely report it. Id be horrified as a parent now.

As a scout leader, please report this. Food costs are factored into camps and although the budget may be tight there is always enough food on our camps to feed all children (sometimes with seconds) and all adults. We also have snacks and drinks available all camps. We tend to cook something like a large spag bol for tea, which sandwiches for lunch. No one should be going hungry.

It sounds like kitchen people were not up to job but why did no one step in. If you’ve run out of serving pasta you’d just say can you put some more on. It sounds like something very amiss or odd dynamic.
Cooking for a big group is a lot of work but kids and leaders going hungry is not norm.

Absolutely report. Kids can’t have fun if they’re starving.

One of my fondest memories of Guide Camp was learning to make French Toast/ Eggy Bread and serving it up to everyone saying ‘thanks Chef’

Yes, odd indeed.

Also don’t understand why the op didn’t query any of this at the time, asking questions around the lack of food rather than doing a Miss Marple and then posting on here. She saw bags of food when the kids were underfed and thought “I know what I’ll do - I’ll wait till I’m home and then ask on Mumsnet whether that’s an acceptable thing.”!!

My real concern is that this picture distorts all my own/friends’ experiences with scouting. I’m not involved at all personally as I’m too selfish to give that much of my time but my family have benefited hugely, including taking part in international jamborees. Being a scout leader is a big commitment hence the shortage of volunteers. It’s not just the weekly meetings but all the prep, extra rehearsal time when performances are happening, parades etc. I find the idea that anyone would sign up for this on the off chance that they’d get a few bags of pasta pretty incredible.

There are few organisations left (probably scouting and DofE) that offer outdoor, adventurous, extracurricular stuff that’s affordable for everyone.

The portions described sound more suitable for picky young Beavers than Cubs and Scouts, but it sounds more likely that its root is in poor planning or inexperience than in an attempt to defraud the unit for boosting the leaders' larders.

Scouts are likely to have adult-sized appetities, especially when boosted by being active all day on camp. Cubs aren't going to be far behind. It can be hard to guage how much food you'll need and the appetites of cohorts can vary from trip to trip. My then Cub ended up underfed on a sleepover because it was the first one back after a 2 year Covid-gap and the Leader in Charge had a small appetite and had forgotten how voracious the appetites of older children can be. The leader did learn from the experience and fortunately it was only one night/ morning.

Camp timings can also be demanding to co-ordinate the activities with kitchen logistics and that can cause intentions to slide, with snacks and suppers suffering. If you've got a hyper-tired younger end of the unit needing to be sent to bed ASAP, losing an extra 20 mins to deal with hot chocolate and biscuits is not ideal.

If there's things like salad going untouched, it may be that the planning stage was overly optomistic about the logistics of timing, space and equipment to serve that. If it is literal camping with mess tents, cooking times can be way off from expectations based on domestic/ industrial appliances. There is likely to be little space to serve up additional bowls of side salad.

They do need to review and learn from what happened and to modify for the future and it is worth flagging up, but there are a number of logistical reasons more likely to be behind under-catering than malice or fraud.
Most people wouldn't willingly get umpteen 8-13 year olds excessively hungry for their own self preservation!

No. If you read my post, I did query the food and was told they needed to ration it. As others have said, funds can be tight / volunteers sometimes have to buy the food themselves so although it was far from ideal, I assumed this was the case.

We hadn't been in the group long and this was my first time volunteering at a camp. His previous group was so different (and like the other posters have described), so I didn't know which was "normal".

As I explained, I had no access to the kitchen until the last day which was when I saw the food and insisted we did give out extras. The rest of the food then disappeared. It was the last day so there was no point in querying the missing food any further.

I already feel awful about this and like I failed the children by not pushing hard enough. The children get a lot from it and I guess I figured that crap/insufficient food for a few days was a better option than the volunteers leaving and the group closing.

I was DBS checked and had to complete various training packages. They were also very on it with never being alone with a child, not going in their tent etc.

I have no concerns apart from the quantity of food and just general attitude to meal times.

Im not playing detective. As I explained, I don't know what is normal and I was hoping there was some other explanation.

Isn't cooking outside part of the experience?

I agree it needs raising.

Yes it is normal for food to be divided up and taken home after camps but

1. There should be enough food for all meals. We typically have enough that scouts all get firsts, leaders take first, scouts get seconds, some leaders may have seconds, then we try to fling thirds at people to eat it all.

1. Leftover food you put everything open and perishable out for lunch on the last day to get it eaten. Then you go through long life stuff and compare dates with the date of the next event so you can use it for scouting. Then what doesn't get eaten and can't be used for a future event you send home with people.

Leaders should eat with the kids or cater separately but eating with the kids is best. Encourages eating, models manners etc. Though when scouts are doing their own menus and cooking themselves we will eat separately, there are limits!

Was the GLV (previously known as GSL) on the camp? I would suggest a word with them.