Winter fuel payments

[dearydeary]

I have just heard on the news that this is being discussed again and they are considering reinstating them.

While I think that people who are on a lower income (pension credit for example) may need additional help I do not think this should be a universal benefit any more.

It appears the government is still looking for votes. What about everyone else in society? Younger people at universities or just starting out? Individuals with disabilities?

Surely we need to be moving to a more means tested approach as the finances need rebalancing?

Where pensioner need help, I am happy to support but many older folk have benefited from good pensions, valuable house price increases and a stable employment market. This is not the situation for many of us any more.

Have I lost the plot?

My parents got child benefit & it wasn't even means tested.

I agree. Starmer will be making a huge mistake if he back-tracks on this. IF something needs to be done, then he'll have to find another way of dealing with any genuine problems. But the political fall out from another flip-flop will be disastrous. The damage has already been done. The voters he's lost won't all go flooding back because he does a U turn!

IF he feels he has to do something, he'd be better sacking the hopeless Reeves who has basically screwed up everything she's changed. He should blame her for it, and blame her for the disastrous IHT changes, NIC hikes, etc., install a replacement Chancellor and draw a line under it all.

My parents are furious that they don’t get it anymore, though they go abroad from November to February every year so I guess they trip does need paying for somehow

Jesus, all this furore over a couple of hundred quid. God help the government that has the balls to do something about the egregious triple lock

I find it disturbing. We will end with bloody Reform because so many people are annoyed about have a benefit means tested & want to blame the boat people for all the ills of the country rather than look a bit closer to home.

My mum who is 79 couldn't afford to buy a house, even with dad working full time they just didn't have enough money, We were dirt poor, they didn't even have enough money to feed us all properly.

• where were they going to magic money up from?

I agree that it needs to be means tested - they may have got the level wrong. There is no justification for reinstating it to all pensioners when child benefit is means tested - most families with pre school children at the threshold are likely to be struggling.

The fossil fuel companies should offer money to the pensioners, not taxpayers. They gouge us on prices to make profits. They could offer discount prices to qualifying people / households.

I was responding to the poster who said why people didn’t object to child benefit being means tested but did to WFA. The levels are completely different. (And I don’t think how child benefit is means tested is fair either, but that’s another issue)

I don't think anyone on this thread has said that wealthy people should get it.

Everyone has a different definition of wealthy though & it's subjective . Is a pensioner who is mortgage free with a small private pension poorer than someone earning 80k but paying 1.5k in rent & 1.5k in childcare?

Ah yes, but that "couple of hundred" quid can make all the difference to some pensioners as you very well know.

Or Christmas.

The moaning doesn't seem to be because it's left them short but rather it's their entitlement for paying in all their lives.

You didn't "claim" WFA - it was sent to anyone receiving state pension.

my mistake.

they still used it for their holiday in their villa in Spain.

they do no t need the money.

They're on an income of around £4500pcm, with no mortgages etc.

THEY DO NOT NEED THE WFP

True. It’s not the wealthy pensioners that will mind.

The moaning doesn't seem to be because it's left them short but rather it's their entitlement for paying in all their lives.

The vast majority haven't paid enough tax for years of a state pension let alone free healthcare, education etc. That's the issue with the changing demographics

What were they staying in a tent?

Frankly I don’t believe it. How much difference can £150 - I know it’s this amount because I used to get it - make? Seriously? Especially when pensions increased by more than three times that (£468) in April?

Didn't stop them means testing child benefit....

my mistake, they got £300, not £600. And they did very happily say the spent it on their flights and stuff to their 4-bed villa in Spain

But the point remains, they absolutely do not need that money, they have around £4500pcm income through rentals, pensions and investments and not all pensioners are choosing between heating and eating - some are INCREDIBLY wealthy and the WFP shouldn't be universal

Yup, most won't have "paid in" anywhere near enough to cover the costs of public services they used, benefits they've received, etc.

We need to change the narrative. No one is "paying in". Tax isn't a savings nor insurance scheme. We need to get the message across that you "don't get back" what you've paid in.

ALL benefits should be based on NEED only.

oh come on - £300 in term -time can get you a holiday for 2 - yeah not the Caribbean for 3 weeks, but you can go to Europe easily for that much in January or whatever.

Plus if you're like my ILs, they own a property anyway in Spain and just need to pay for dlflights/car

Just add £200/year to the state pension, which is taxable, Then the taxpaying pensioners will give some of it back in tax.

My point exactly. "They" can means test when they want to. The CB means testing is a fiasco, and should never have been done that way, but it shows they'll do it when they want to do it.

How do you know their income @ButteredRadishes? Our kids aren’t party to our financial affairs, they have no idea what our income is.

They certainly DO mind. Lots of my "wealthier" clients are spitting feathers about it, despite them having more money than they know how to spend. Some of them mention it repeatedly over several meetings! You'd think they'd have been expected to sacrifice their first born child. The sense of entitlement is extraordinary from some of them.