To think that therapy culture has made people too obsessed with themselves?

[TheTidyShark]

Self-reflection is good. Narcissistic self-obsession isn’t.

Agree.

There's a difference between actual therapy with someone good (which is often really challenging, and transformative in a quiet way, with work) and 'therapy culture', which has very little to do with therapy, but with people throwing around terms like 'narcissism' on the basis of something they saw on Instagram or a fridge magnet.

Can you give an example of the difference you see between self-reflection and narcissistic self-reflection?

YABVU. HTH.

Social.media is the problem not therapy ... people wouldn't need therapy if there was no social media. My guess is 80% of "anxiety" is due to social media, particularly in young people.

Well in a way I agree but in a way there is people on here that need it and fast

Agree, although I do think that the ‘self-care’ culture has also contributed to this. I do believe that ‘self-care’ is important, but the Meghan Markle-style constant self-reflection and self-nurture is incredibly inward-looking.

I'm not sure a true narcissist would seek therapy

The problem isn’t therapy it’s social media. Endless scrolling is so harmful.

I've not encountered this issue in real life. Who are these people - just a general impression you're getting or specific people you know?

Hmm, the problem being is that there are a lot of people out there who think even the slightest bit of self reflection is 'narcissist self obsession', the slightest bit of personal boundaries is 'people are being selfish' the slightest challenge at their own behaviour is 'I'm being blamed for everything wrong in their life'.....
I've witnessed someone describe another person going to therapy for PTSD after the death of a family member as 'navel gazing, they just need to get on with it'
I've seen threads on here where new mums are asking for a bit of time after birth to recover from a major bloody bodily event without tons of visitors as 'selfish'
I've seen PLENTY of people throughout my life, on who being told they upset someone they love, go 'no i didn't! And even if i did, I didn't mean it negatively so why am I being talked to about it when it negatively impacted them' which is so weird to me, if I was told I'd negatively impacted someone i loved because of the way I'd spoken to them or behaved, I'd be mortified.

The jury is out for me. Our DD is having counselling at the moment but we are only two sessions in, so assume/hope the counsellor is building a rapport (and DD isn’t always the most trustworthy messenger). But currently she is being incredibly rude and difficult and calling it “boundary setting”.

Oh, for sure it has.

Cross post on boundaries with @Daisyvodka 😂

Therapy makes you look at yourself. This can mean seeing how you enable abusers to continue. Because the old adage, the only person you can change is yourself applies. (I am not saying ACCEPT abuse. But therapy would help you deal with it which might mean leaving.)

Ignorance makes us blame others. Looking outwards without considering our own role in any dynamic.

Perhaps the OP will return to expand on the definitions of her post. Or perhaps not.

As per a previous post, I see social media as far more to blame than therapy. It’s far, far more accessible and prevalent for starters, so I find it odd to point to therapy instead of the online world that we’re all hooked up to to some degree. In fact, I don’t agree we live in a ‘therapy culture’ at all. Most people I know have never attended a counselling session. Many others may have done a short series of sessions. A minority (including myself) have more experience of it.

And lot / most of the more common therapies, such as CBT, are practical. You’re focusing on yourself, yes, but in the same way someone undergoing physio is focusing on themselves. The sort therapy where you talk about your parents for hours a week while someone takes notes might be a mainstay of American tv and film, but it’s not what most of us are getting when we see a counsellor!

Contrast social media with its focus on looks, visuals, obsession with measuring worth by numbers of followers / likes / friends, the need to be a ‘brand’, reduction of complex ideas (including those about therapy) to shallow snippets. And so on.

I'd take the self-reflection and self-help over the old "stiff upper lip, don't talk and get on with it" attitude. Just a couple of generations ago, child abuse, domestic abuse, ptsd, pnd, and any mental health conditions, just got brushed under the carpet and ignored as "unpleasant". People were cut-off, sent away, not listened to, or made to feel like failures.

Men who came back from war were abandoned. Children with downs syndrome were locked in instructions. Women with pnd were given electric shock therapy. Children suffering abuse were deliberately ignored.

We're better parents now, we listen to children. We are aware of out own, and other's, mental health and how to get help. We are more likely to speak out when we see something wrong. We don't make people feel like failures if they're ill.

Yes, like all things, popular culture comes along and takes everything to the extreme, turns it into a competitive sport. Don't follow popular culture.

Narcissists would not go to therapy unless couple counselling with the hope of further torturing their partner. I wish people would stop throwing around the term 'narcissistic' when they are entirely uneducated about it. Therapy saves people's lives. I am not even entirely sure what 'therapy culture' is.

What’s “therapy culture”?

Definitely not. Social media yes, therapy no. I have had therapy for 3 years now and it saved my life (literally)
It has done the opposite for me. My anxiety and depression was so bad it was all I could think of. Therapy has decentred me from my own life and given me perspective as to my place in the world

Quite, a narcissist doesn't think there is anything wrong with them

I think therapy can be wonderful, life changing, even life saving for many. I think most people do benefit positively from it.

That said, people with narcissistic personality traits tend to be good manipulators, and it is said that they are also quite good at manipulating therapists. I have watched this happen, and it was quite astonishing how quickly the therapist was tricked into believing a sob story. Many narcissistic people thrive on sympathy and victimhood. They can paint some quite believable pictures and a sympathetic therapist may inadvertently feed into these self-obsessive behaviours. I'm pretty sure most narcissists don't go for therapy to be cured of narcissism, but that doesn't mean they don't go for therapy. In my experience, as soon as the therapist cottoned on to the narcissistic behaviour and challenged it, the person simply switched therapist.

And even if we avoid the narcissist label, I can think of a few quite self-obsessed people I know who treat others poorly but use therapy-speak to validate their shitty behaviour and demand special treatment.

So I do see where the OP is coming from.

Edited to add: the person in my experience was diagnosed as a narcissist by a qualified professional, so I'm not throwing labels around without understanding their meaning

'Therapy culture' is my head is the Tik Tok 'psychologists' giving vague 'symptoms' of a psychiatric disorder that literally anyone can have.

ADHD is the worst one at the moment for me. Literally every person I have ever met could diagnose themselves with having it if they watch some of these stupid videos.

That is closely followed by anxiety, which used to be called 'worried' or a bit 'fearful' - a perfectly healthy response in life to many situations and something that is unnecessarily pathologised.

They are just 2 examples which really get my goat, but I agree with you @op it makes people completely self-centred and worse than that, they tend to actually start making demands on you in terms of what you can do, say and act around them. People need to learn stoicism and to be part of a community- giving something to others, not terminally 'mentally ill' and focused only on themselves.

Its a good point to make though! Its a bit like gentle parenting, there's a lot of well intentioned but ultimately either uninformed or not smart/emotionally intelligent individuals out there who think it means 'never say no to your child' and therefore do that.
People in therapy being arseholes about boundaries can be good people who don't get have the maturity to deliver in a polite way, or are too impacted by the issues to deliver in a polite way, or a person whose personality in general is a bit difficult and therefore the delivery is in that same vein... there's not enough public awareness in general about how personality impacts recovery in mental health!