A Deadly American Marriage

[Siffh]

Just watching A Deadly American Marriage in Netflix. Molly Martens is clearly derranged and murderous. She doesn't at all seem genuine. She reminded me a little of Amber Heard.. but like Amber Heard I'm wondering if her husband was entirely innocent of any wrongdoing. I'm basing this on the recordings she made covertly, in which her husband is heard to shout at her repeatedly, intervene when she speaks to his children, and accused her of disrespecting him. He also commented to his friend that Molly was "still crazy".. such a familiar trope.

What do you guys think?

The woman was absolutely deranged - she told so many lies of huge magnitude.

• she had a sister who died of cancer (not true)
• she was friends with Jason's first wife and that she wanted her to look after her children (not true)
• she gave birth to Sarah (not true)
• Jason's former FIL said he killed his first wife (not true)

Her ex boyfriend had written a book prior to Jason's murder, such was his experience with her. She was also in phyicatric facilities numerous times before meeting Jason.

She recorded him without his knowledge and the worst caught in tape is a relatively tame argument. (He doesn't call her names, doesn't yell, doesn't hit her - he sounds like a man very frustrated with her).

He was recording him and says she had a motion activated recording device on the nightstand - why not there the night of the murder?

He called her crazy - she bloody well was!

The woman is completely unhinged and it's know she manipulated the children and was very disrespectful of him (his appearance etc). He wasn't wrong in what he said on tape.

The children were clearly coached. The language they used confirms that clearly.

Molly & her father are clearly murderers, didn't do CPR and used excessive force even if it was self defence (which it most certainly wasn't).

This isn't even a close one - she is a dangerous, manipulative, lunatic.

All very valid points! Many thanks for the further information

I hadn't finished the entire documentary on initially posting, nor a I privy to the further information you provided.

She is clearly deranged I agree, and enabled by her father.

I watched it tonight and definitely feel similarly to you. In any event, even if his death was self defence, they beat him so badly the detective on the case said they’d never seen injuries like it. Self defence to me is surely just doing enough to make the person stop, not pulverising them beyond all recognition?

Yeah I also just watched this thinking it would be fairly tame and it’s awful. What those kids went through from start to finish is horrendous.
My inclination is also that she’s guilty - the pathological liar stuff swayed me that way

Many years ago I heard her ex give an interview about his book detailing her abuse - and it was insane. She was stark raving mad, but very plausible (at the start certainly, but she frequently lied about many things very convincingly). It wasn't until the very end that he said his book was about Molly Martens.

I saw it last night and it was really hard to find the truth . She was clearly deranged but then the secret recordings did demonstrate him being awful to her so who knows . I also thought her dad was quite sinister . I agree with the poster above though in that we never heard who administered the blows and they were more than disabling they really beat him . The poor children .

I've not watched it yet, but not sure why you've dragged amber heads name into it. I think that's pretty disgusting tbh.

The fact that towards the end she said that she felt bad for the children after her lawyers on appeal suggested that he had killed his first wife ( their mother) despite a thorough autopsy having been done and went on to say that she had hoped this would bring them back to her 😳 that is madness and shows it is ALL about her and not the best for them. The fact is that she and her father killed a man that night. The recordings did not show an angry man but yes a frustrated man and yes a frustrated woman and one who wanted the children for herself in the event of a divorce.

This.
She doesn’t seem reliable or trustworthy at all. The level of violence and force in his murder is far too excessive to be self defence.
It was all about her trying to get custody of those children. They must be sickened by her.
The real victims in all of this are the poor children.

I've just finished it and whilst I'm on the fence about his behaviour towards her, there was no way that was self defence.

I thought she was very calm and unemotional, I would have expected a lot more emotional if she accidentally killed her husband even in self defence. She kept calling the kids hers which didn't sit right with me either, I appreciate she was a mother figure since they were very young but they weren't hers. I just felt like she wanted to pretend she birthed them as opposed to taking them on as her own.

The dad was also very calm and how does her mum, aware of commotion just go back to sleep? Then the drugs in the system, them saying he was drunk but the post mortem suggested otherwise..

I think they wanted him dead for whatever reason and they killed him.

I think she definitely is mentally ill and not trustworthy in general, but it is possible to be untrustworthy/a liar and also be abused. I thought it was all total bs until the bit about the urine on her trousers and the nail scratch thing. So many different things could have happened. Maybe she drugged him then bashed his head in. Maybe he strangled her and she bashed his head in. It seems very odd that she and her dad would both just randomly kill him in such an obvious way. I guess unless they plotted it to look like self defense. But then why hit him so many times? Really couldn't say what truly happened

Not convinced he was a particularly lovely person given some of the stuff on the recordings, but her and her dad are really not right at all. It’s quite chilling watching them talk.

Poor kids, what a lot they’ve had to go through and they seem so emotionally intelligent and resilient. It was a hard watch, really.

One thing that was very strange to me was that the dad lied so much. He's ex FBI so he knows that they could do toxicology reports, autopsies etc. All I can think is that he was arrogant, assumed the police wouldn't look that far into it, and he'd get away with something. I guess I think if the central aspect of the story was true (I killed him to stop him hurting my daughter) why so many lies about other aspects of what happened?

I read that the police said she kept rubbing her neck when they arrived and they think she caused the ‘fingernail mark’ herself.

The dad lied so much because he loves his daughter. I think Molly killed her husband and her dad’s tried to protect her by beating his head (after he’d died) so badly that it’d be more difficult to tell what really happened. Liars convince themselves that their lies are the truth by repeating the lies over and over and that’s what they’ve done. It was so creepy when her father said ‘prove it’.

Yes that's what I suspect, too. It seems the most likely explanation. But I don't feel certain.

As some else says, I read that the police who took her in for questioning on the night had to ask her to stop rubbing her neck. It sounded like they thought she was attempting to leave marks on herself.

The urine on her pyjamas - was it just me or did it look as though they showed a completely different pair? And they gave no details of what tests were done to show urine. Surely if there was evidence of that, it would've been brought up at the trial.
Also they were saying that she passed urine because she has been strangled to the point of unconsciousness. But again that was never brought up at the trial.

I found Molly's dad quite chilling. I got a really bad vibe from him immediately and hated the way he talked about Mag's father being an uneducated man. It was so arrogant and dismissive.

I didn't find his statement that Mag's dad thought Jason had killed her at all believable and then lo and behold....her dad signed a statement saying that Tom was lying. It is such a horrific lie to tell.

The tapes don't sound great, I think Jason sounds extremely frustrated in them and they're both talking to one another like crap. But considering he didn't know he was being recorded and she did and that is the worst they picked up I just don't find her domestic abuse story credible. This was a failing relationship, he was clearly planning to take the children back to Ireland and she clearly snapped. I think she found out he was leaving and couldn't bear the thought of the children being taken away.

There are just too many lies from Molly and her dad.

They say Jason was drunk that night...... toxicology proves he wasn't.

They say the in laws had come up for a planned visit.....but they actually cancelled plans last minute to travel up.

Molly tells people that she gave birth to Sarah.....she didn't.

Molly tells people her sister died of cancer......another lie.

Molly says that she was the children's godmother and a friend of Mags.......she wasn't, she was the au pair.

Molly says the children have been used as weapons. But leaked the recording of Jack calling her to say he loved her to the press. That was a callous, manipulative thing to do to a little kid.

They say they gave Jason CPR but the 911 call handler didn't think it sounded like they were doing it and his body was so cold when paramedics arrived that they had to question the time of death. It just raises way too many red flags.

The language Jack used in his first interview. He said "my dad was physically and verbally abusive." He was 10. DD is a bright child and a very similar age and I do not believe she would use language like that. It very much came off as coached.

I feel so, so sorry for Jack and Sarah. Those poor kids have had so much trauma. It seems like their Auntie and Uncle have done an amazing job giving them a stable family and I cheered when the Uncle said they got the kids immediately into counselling. They just seemed to genuinely want what was best for them whereas Molly seemed to only care about herself.

I also thought the urine thing didn’t prove anything. If she’d lost control of her bladder there’d have been much more urine, she’d likely have smelt of it and I’m sure she’d have asked to change her clothing and mentioned it herself. There would also have been evidence of it on the floor at the scene of the ‘strangling’. The amount just looked like a bit of bladder leakage rather than a loss of control.

I thought the tapes also didn’t prove anything. She was aware she was being taped so was able to keep calm and appear reasonable. He didn’t say anything abusive or call her names and they just supported his legitimate concerns that she was trying to alienate the children from him and ultimately take them from him. Also as pointed out by another poster where were the tapes of the night of the murder?

It seemed the marriage was in trouble and Jason wanted to return to Ireland without her so it was in her interests to badmouth him to others to lay the grounds for a custody battle. Although I would have thought she wouldn’t have a cat in hells chance of getting custody of children she had no biological connection to. The father tried to say not letting her adopt children was an example of Jason’s controlling behaviour but from everything I heard he had very legitimate concerns about Molly and clearly realised he’d made a mistake in marrying her. There was evidence from other people of her verbally abusing him in public.

The one thing that I couldn't understand was why she had a cinderblock on her nightstand? The story that she was going to paint some bricks with the kids didn't add up to me. Wouldn't they be in the garage, garden or at least the kitchen? And why just one in the bedroom?

I watched this and felt sick to my stomach. I feel for Jack and Sarah losing both parents but thank god for their aunt and uncle. I sincerely hope they find peace.

Molly and her dad are just not credible people, he's a cold liar and she's a nut job. They're convincing nobody. The only good thing about this programme is that more people can see what they are and give them a wide bearth.

So

After watching this, I 100% believe that Molly has some type of personality disorder. She is most definitely a narcissist.

My hunch is that she became weirdly obsessed with these children, and having this picture perfect life. She wanted to be painted as a victim.
I think Jason was making immediate plans to leave that fateful day (perhaps after another argument), where she then called her parents up to try and put a stop to him leaving and have them as witnesses to his "behaviour" (that she provoked beforehand).
I think at some point, Molly had tried to drug Jason with sleeping pills to delay him leaving that night.
In a fit of rage, I think Molly struck Jason with a cinderblock (from behind) and had killed him with repeated strikes. I think the dad used the bat and struck a few times afterwards to build a self defence story to try and get his daughter off the hook for murder.
The marks on her neck, I think were self inflicted (easily done really with enough force) and the urine mark shows a loss of bladder control (not full incontinence) which can be explained by excessive drinking (on her part) or even exilheration/fear of actually carrying out the act. If she had complete loss of control of her bladder, there would be an obvious smell and there would be a LOT more. E.g. my pelvic floor is weak and if I drink a bit and sneeze, I can leak too!

They both disgust me.

Those poor children lost so much and in such a short space of time. The fact they’ve grown up to be such wonderful people is a credit to their family who raised them and how strong they are.

In contrast, you look at Molly Martens and her apparently normal upbringing with a “normal” family and look at what she turned out to be: a violent, selfish, manipulative proven liar. Of course, those things don’t mean she can’t be the victim of domestic abuse but those recordings of Jason and Molly arguing don’t really prove much imo. No, Jason doesn’t come across well in them but from personal experience being a toxic relationship doesn’t help make you a reasonable and measured person.
But then again, Molly’s father is a liar too.

I’m really shocked that the Martens had their convictions overturned and are now out of prison- even if Jason’s death had been in self defence (I don’t believe it was) it was overkill- he was dead long before they stopped hitting him with the brick and baseball bat. I’m not sure how old Molly is now but I sincerely hope she does not go on to have children of her own at any point. She is a dangerous narcissist.

Absolutely, everything upthread!
I could not get my head around how these bloody psychopaths had managed to manipulate the justice systems so much in their favour that they got released!
Her motives were clear as day, the many inconsistencies and lies from both her and her father were also paper-thin. But the biggest thing that struck me is the manner of the killing, which there's ZERO dispute over - Extreme and Excessive, Malicious and nothing to do with self defense.
IMO, there's no need for tooing and froing much over the rest, when they had this kind of evidence, a man beaten to a pulp by countless strikes. How just how did anyone in the courtroom think they were innocent?!
Disgusting lies about Mag's dad. And dont get me started on the urine BS or the tiny scratch on her neck "indicating strangulation"🙄