To think that having a mammogram carried out by a man is preferable to a long wait for an appointment.

[JudithOnHolidayAgain]

I know many people who wouldn't be here now without early detection of breast cancer due to the screening programme.
I have had a few myself.
It's not something I look forward to but it's a few minutes of discomfort that could save my life so I put up with it.
Given the choice I would prefer a woman carry it out as it is quite intrusive but as there is a shortage of female staff I would be ok with a male member of staff as long as there was a chaperone and Iwas told in advance.
If they do change the rules I think there should be a choice.

I don’t give a damn about someone’s gender. There are certain situations where I DO care about someone’s sex though. And yes, people absolutely ARE entitled to choose the sex of the person performing procedures on their bodies.

Well, that's just common sense, surely?! Nothing to do with "spin."
If you're cutting down your options of people who can see to you (which is your choice of course) it's common sense that it might take longer than someone who doesn't mind who they see.

Of course they are entitled to choose. When I book a GP appointment I can choose to see a female doctor. It might mean a slightly longer wait but I am given a choice. And women will be given a choice with mammograms too even if there are a small number of men also performing them. It’s not a well paid profession so there won’t be thousands of men keen to do the job but there might be some who can fill the critical gaps.

What IS common sense is ensuring that women have decent access to training for careers where ones sex may be important. For example, one could provide bursaries for female radiographers who wish to train specifically as a mammography radiographer.
What is NOT common sense is telling women who are unable to have a male radiographer carry out their mammogram - ‘Oh you silly woman, look at you now having to wait longer because you won’t allow a man to carry out an intimate procedure”. That smacks of the absolute opposite of inclusion.

No you can’t choose you can only request as several PPs have already stated.

If your GP practice is a male practice you can’t “choose” to see a woman GP (and not all practices are mixed sex among the doctors). In the same way that you can’t “choose” a women’s ward in a hospital - well not if you need treatment.

BTW you may have missed my question to you upthread. How many screening mammograms have you had yourself and how many of those were in the “cabin in the car park” type set up?

It's taking male radiographers out of other areas of need to do your mammogram. It does nothing to increase numbers in the profession overall.

"Choice" is a fine word but for people like me it translates as the choice to either screw up our courage to "make a fuss/be difficult" and ask for a female radiologist at booking (and possibly have to disclose difficult history as to why), or to put off booking. When we already have many reasons to put off booking. Or it translates as the choice to take it or leave it and have a long wait for another appointment if we want to be fussy.

Screening services are about getting the numbers through the door at a cohort level so factors that impact take up do matter, it shouldn't just be about "I'm alright Jack, devil take the hindmost".

Why don't they look first at how to increase radiographer numbers, how to retain more mid-career women by helping them combine work and family better etc, so we can all be seen in a timely way for screening and screening can continue to be staffed by women? Rather than scaring us that people will have long waits for screening mammograms unless men do them, which does nothing for overall staff shortages in the profession and presumably increases pressure and vacant posts in other places radiographers are needed? But does deter some women, even if it doesn't affect you personally.

yes to this but also it occurs to me that its not the "job" of women to work out how it can be made to work. Yes there will be women who say "I don't care about how it might work, I am just not accepting it" and that's fine. I do think though that what is missing in this conversation is what I will describe as "agreement on the line" That we don't have to work out how it might work but to set out our requirements for accepting it.....something like "women have an absolute right to require a female operative for screening mammograms and to not be disadvantaged in any way by doing so" Then its up to the NHS to work out how to implement in compliance.

I have not had a mammogram because I am not over 50. I have researched what they entail though and I am confident that I would be comfortable having a man perform one. Personally I don’t see them as anywhere near as intimate as anything where I’d have to undress from the waist down and even then I’d be okay with a man performing it (and I have experienced this a few times and it was fine).

You are greatly exaggerating this. There are currently 100% female staff. If they change the rule, it’s still going to be largely female - as I said I doubt there’s that many men really wanting to do the job as it doesn’t pay very well. I am confident they will allow women a choice to see a female if they are uncomfortable with a male. You can’t say they definitely won’t because it’s not happened yet so you’re just basing it on what you think will happen.

And yes if you have an all male GP practice then you can’t see a female doctor. Few practices are all male these days though and people have the option of registering somewhere else if they want to see a female doctor. Even the all male practices are likely to have a female nurse to do things like smears.

I know that you will now say that you live very remotely, don’t drive and the only GP surgery within a 50 mile radius to you is run by men only. For the vast majority of people, that’s not the case.

'have not had a mammogram because I am not over 50. I have researched what they entail though and I am confident that I would be comfortable having a man perform one.'

Perhaps come back and comment when you have.

Like many I've had tests, invasive procedures. I couldn't care less if a man did a smear test of performed a gynae procedure.

Mammograms are different believe me. You are topless, they are close up behind you whilst maninpulating and squashing your breasts into the apparatus. It is at best cringeworthy and an uncomfortable carry on. I'm not even a sa survivor and have no issue with male carers ets but mammograms? No.

Everyone should be able to receive care which is dignified, respectful and what you are comfortable with.

I work in radiotherapy and men and women are involved in set ups, not many women patients would decline treatment from a man, and there is a certain amount of manipulation to get breast into correct position for treatment. Occasionally some women request only female radiographers which we do try to accommodate.

If I was a patient I would be happy being treated by either, however we do have more female rads in our dept

Yeah no the thing is I don’t believe you. Or rather I believe you think they are different but I do not share that belief and nor will I when I have a mammogram. I also know plenty of over 50s who don’t share your view of them being different and more intrusive than eg a pelvic exam. My mum says they are routine and not a big deal. So your view is not universal.
I fully respect your right to have a woman perform them. But please don’t patronise me and suggest I can’t think for myself or that I will definitely change my mind once I have a mammogram. I won’t.

It's criminal negligence (imo) that you can't get a mammogram in the UK til you're 50. I'm fucking shocked to learn that! How is that even allowed to be happen and why hasn't someone in the medical establishment challenged this? Many times it's far too late then. It is 40 in Australia and I even think that's far too late as lots of breast cancers occur in your 30s. Belinda Emmett, who was in Home and Away going back around 20 years got breast cancer at aged 24 (yes, twenty-four). It came back again later. Then finally, bone cancer. She died many years back well before she was 40.

Shannen Doherty from BH90210 got her breast cancer in her 30s.

And yes I had gathered that you are topless during a mammogram. It won’t come as a shock to me. I am okay with being topless in front of a man who is manipulating my breast tissue into place. I am also okay with being bottomless in front of a man examining my cervix with his hand. To me, the second one is way more invasive but I accept that everyone is different.

So you have made a huge number of posts hectoring women on the subject and you have precisely zero experience of that subject but you have read the book?

Fuck me, I’ve spent a lifetime experience mansplaining, mostly its been from actual men.

All the whataboutery - bottom line, we don’t have a choice beyond take it or leave it. We can only express a preference.

My GP practice has both sex GPs. My neighbour's practice is two men. You can’t change practice in this area - you can ask but none of the practices are taking new patients. This is in a busy urban area and its pretty much impossible to change GP. In rural areas its even harder to change GPs or exercise the mythical choice.

Stop spouting propaganda based on “what you have read” and try listening to women who have experienced the practicalities of your theoretical knowledge. “Choice” is completely illusory where one of those choices doesn’t actually exist.

They are routine and not a big deal if your mammographer is female. If you asked your mother if she'd like a male mammographer basically hugging her from behind as he moves her breast on the plate and against the border and manipulating her arms at an angle on the machine which basically means she is smushed topless into his chest, she would have a completely and utterly different view, 100%.

I think they say that cancers in younger women aren’t always likely to show on a mammogram as they have denser breast tissue and often as they are fast growing women might be reassured by a clear result but then find a lump a few months later. But obviously the countries with a 40 limit find that they do help.
I think someone said that tissue gets denser with age but the opposite is true.

I think you need to have one before you can comment. What is it you think happens? I had this image of standing in front to the scanner and it being over in seconds, like an xray. It's not that!

You can only get mammograms under 50 in England if you have a family history of high risk (and in most areas it needs to be quite high to qualify). Otherwise you have to pay privately until you qualify at 50.

The system is quite patchy and not always easy to access. There are many, many things which could be done to improve uptake and success as well as staff recruitment before defaulting to male mammographers. In my area the bigger problem is getting women to attend at all, that will worsen if they can’t guarantee female care (a concern expressed by the cancer charities).

I doubt it but I will ask her. She’s had various procedures that are quite invasive performed by men. I don’t think she gives a shit. You can’t 100% speak for my mother or any other woman. There are plenty of women on her who have had mammograms who do not mind if a man performed them. So how you can confidently say what a woman you’ve never met would choose I have no clue.

I cannot wait for these ignorant posters to have their mammogram! I cannot wait! We know they will change their mind when they have it, but we also know they will never come back on here and admit we were right.

I wonder what response someone would get if they didn't want treatment from someone of a specific race, because of some bad experience they had previously endured which made them feel uncomfortable or vulnerable.

🤦‍♀️

I would not want a man, straight gay or trans to do a mammogram or a smear/vaginal exam.
I would be happy for woman to do a mammogram/vaginal exam, whether straight or lesbian. But not trans if they appeared male eg beard and muscular like a man.

Wow. Comparing women's sex-based needs and rights to racism. Charming! What a vile and disgusting comparison, @Moonmelodies .

Lol no I don’t think that. The radiographer pulls your breast into place and places it on a plate and it’s then squashed down by another plate. That involves standing close but not “hugging from behind” or doesn’t have to be anyway. They need to pull breast tissue away from the chest wall to get an accurate image. They then step away and get the image and it’s repeated on the other breast. I am not an imbecile. I know what it entails. Still okay with a man doing it if he’s a healthcare professional. Also okay with man doing pelvic exam (literal hand up vagina) or rectal exam (literal hand up butt). I know many women wouldn’t be. I’m not one. I do not feel any distinction between male or female healthcare workers.