Older kids rear-facing - link to gallery

[MissHH]

I see some people think that RF is only for little kids and believes that it is not enough room for RF seats past the babystage. That is not true.

Lots of pictures hereforum.nybaktmamma.com/showthread.php?t=524428 are some pictures of kids all the way up till over 6 YRS rear-facing.

Heresikringavbarnibil.blogspot.com/2007/10/biler-med-plass-til-tre-barneseter.html is some pictures of three carseats in normal familiy cars(smallest one is a VW Polo).

But also, just to say again, that a child in a carseat, RF or FF is sooooo much safer than an unrestained child, or a child in an incorrectly fitted seat.

I don't think the child looks uncomfortable though...he is lounging about, isn't it!

I think what children would probably do, is they would sit cross legged...

Pixiepants: That is actually me there on car seat.org :D

Longer children can cross their legs too. Although adults might find this uncomfortable, children don't!

Hi HH, Nice to 'see' you.

themildmanneredjanitor: There is a six year old RF in that gallery, but there isn't many six YR olds RF here in Norway either.

The most important thing is to keep them RF for as long as it is possible for you.

My boy is soon to be three. He weighs abt. 31 pounds and 37 inches, I believe he can sit RF in our VW Golf for at least another three years. Since I got the opportunity to keep him that way I will do so until we meet problems.

well...I think most children are quite comfortable in positions that most adults (unless they are yogis, lol) would find uncomfortable...I know many children who will sit happily with their legs underneath them in some weird way (not in a car now) and that find that rather comfortable...now me...I probably would break my knees or something trying to copy it!
I really don't think that crosslegged sitting is uncomfortable to most children...

But newborns are better than anyone at letting you know if they're not happy/comfortable, as are babies and children generally.

themildmanneredjanitor: I think you are putting words in my mouth here. As I have said in the previous thread the child will let you know if it experiences any pain. But I will not turn my kid around until that problem occur. No need to take the sorrow in advance. Of course I won't inflict my child pain by RF, but ATM he is very happy RF.

This was my key point:
The most important thing is to keep them RF for as long as it is possible for you and of course your child.

And the whole point here is to inform that older kids bigger, than babies, can RF. The point is not six yr olds

3&nomore, I scrolled down that last link and the stats are shocking, children hurt or killed in accidents here compared to in Sweden...I think that should be enough to make anyone go for RF imo.

Can you say which seats are available here again, for those of us who can't find the info?

I've just scanned the thread, watched the you tube video...very interesting, thanks for sharing. I have never seen these bigger RF seats before, but have always been at people desperate to turn their 6 months old babies around.

I'm not sure, perhaps I missed it in my scanning...but where can you get these seats? Can they be ordered online from the UK?

Miss HH - can you explain the stats better to me please? That Sweden vs GB link... the stats could be misleading because per 100,000 capita isn't a true reflection of how many children per crash die Sweden vs GB. Therefore, it is entirely possible (given crowding, size of motorways, driving safety overall, population density) that Sweden has fewer crashes per capita than GB and therefore inevitably fewer child fatalities? If however there are fewer child fatalities per crash in RF (Sweden) than FF (GB) then of course RF makes perfect sense and we should do what we can to bring that about within the UK. However, I too would struggle with the space issue. We drive an Octavia and both DH and I (both comfortably over 6ft) whether driving or passenger need the front seats on their back runners, how do the seats fit? But predominantly my question is clarifying the stats please!

Hi Christiania, Try here for starters. If you live far away from Milton Keynes they do mail order.

Also try your local Volvo dealer, as the one near me in Bristol can order in two types, Britax fixway-Iso-fix and there own model-belt restained).

If you feel strongly call the Britax Helpline 01264 386034 Option 4 (who will direct you to In-Car Safety). When I spoke to them last week I was told that they put a RF on sale generally in the UK 5(?) years ago but no-one wanted it. When I asked where it was sold and how it was marketed the person I spoke to couldn't answer, and the person who could has yet to return my call .

Britax manufacture there RF in Andover, but these are for the Scandinavian market and not available in the UK. Instead In-Car Safety "IMPORT" goods produced in the UK for the UK market...get that!

Sorry for long post.

Also try www.racaro-seats.co.uk as I think they might have some for mail order soon.

Just be sure on the fitting front if you do find one that suits.

And finally here for anything else.

Did someone say you can't use them in a van/people mover?

Weegle, during 2007 only 2 children died in car accidents in Sweden. One drowned as the car ended up in water, and the other died in a side collision at 90 km/h. Before these two deaths at the end of the year, there had been a 17 month long period without a single child dying in Sweden. That is as close to zero tolerance as you can get...

According to the AA, 22 children die in car crashes in the UK every year. Every single child that can be saved simply by using a RF seat is worth all the effort. And it is such a simple thing as well. The products are already out there. If I showed any parent 2 prams and said that one of them was 5 times safer than the other, I have no doubt which one they would buy. Same with any other baby product I can think of. Now we have that situation for car seats. The OP of this thread has put two products in front of all of us and said "this one is 5 times safer for your child than the other one, which one would you choose". What Pixiepants, MissHH and I are all arguing for is for these products to be generally available to all parents in the UK, in the usual high street shops, so that all parents can make an informed decision and buy whatever product they want. But the choice has to be available.

Thank you for your great answer, MrsAkin!

Astrophe, Don't think there's any reason not to use them in people carriers etc...just as you would a FF.

Mrs Aki, that still doesn't address Weegle's point, perhaps there are simply very few major crashes in Sweden involving family cars?

The population of Sweden is, IIRC, less than 20% of the size of the UK and Sweden is bigger allowing for a less densely populated country! So it would be very surprising if the deaths were comparable.

I see your point Mrs HH and Mrs Aki but as Upwind says it doesn't actually address the stats... if there are fewer crashes in Sweden full stop then it stands to reason there will be fewer child fatalities. I am not arguing against you BTW, just merely trying to understand the statistics and see exactly how much safer rear facing is. I would whole-heartedly support a campaign to get RF seats more widely available and accepted in the UK if that discrepancy is statistics is a true reflection of deaths per crash. I hope I've explained that ok, I haven't slept well so maybe not?!

Thanks for the link, Pixie - they have some great other bits and bobs on there, sadly can't stretch to the prices for the car seats though if we were starting from scratch we might.
Will keep it bookmarked anyway