AIBU to think getting into teaching should be easier?

[LavenderFields7]

My friend has a PhD in stem, is trying to get into teaching A-levels at local school but everywhere wants PGCE. AIBU to think it’s ridiculous to want someone so qualified to have to study another year, fork out £10,000 and work unpaid for a year? She has a Level 3 teaching qualification and has taught uni level students.

A PHD doesn't mean you can teach

Plenty of salaried training for science subjects.

https://www.unitedteaching.org.uk/become-a-teacher/what-you-can-teach/train-to-teach-science

Iv never seen a school that just has teachers for A levels. A college yes but a school will want gcse and a-levels

And @LavenderFields7 is so interested in seeking advice on behalf of her ‘friend’ that she hasn't returned after the first post this morning.

Don't bother wasting your time PP’s, OP isn't.

I do only teach A-level but a) that could change and I wouldn't be able to do a lot about it until the next academic year; b) I teach a subject that's often only offered at A-level; and c) I worked up to my ideal situation over a number of years.

Your friend would definitely need to teach GCSE to get QTS as the government requires teaching two adjacent key stages; she could be asked to teach any science; her timetable might well be filled with some KS3 lessons (possibly Maths as well as science); she'd have to do some pastoral stuff such as lead a tutor group.

None of that is necessarily a bad thing.

I had a ball for a few years teaching my second subject to y7 and 8. I felt free to experiment and there wasn't the pressure of my whole timetable being exam classes.

You need to play the long game with teaching.

A waste of time for whom?

See many posts above about how outdated that advice is.

Mine, for me

But possibly- even probably- not for someone with an ambition to teach in the UK and beyond.

Can assure you that my PGCE students do not find it a waste of time, because they are being trained by me.

As a primary teacher, almost everything I have thought about replying has been mentioned. It’s great to see teachers being valued like this on the thread… if only this was more commonplace!
My DH holds a far more senior role than I do, a better class of degree by a long way and earns a lot more than me- would I want him teaching my children? Absolutely not! I am far better at it than he would be (if our education remains the same!) because I’ve got a whole degree in it!
The whole ‘those who can’t, teach’ view is so frustrating! Yes, sometimes I need to refresh my memory on topics or events that I’m going to deliver on, but my job is about so much more than just telling the children facts. It’s also about far more than you could ever learn in a lecture theatre or seminar… my most valuable lessons have been learned on the ground and hands on, through real life experiences.

DH has a PhD and taught undergraduates, he’s not suitable to teach a level students.

Everyone I know who teaches a level teaches another subject but their own. The teaching is the skilled bit, they don’t need to understand it to PhD level, just be ahead of the students.

A pgce teaches you how to teach. Having qualifications in a subject isn't enough

I'm an A-level teacher delivering a post-16 specialist subject in an academy. We recently interviewed for a new staff member and due to our status as an academy, we can choose to recruit unqualified teachers. We took a punt on interviewing a PhD student/uni lecturer, along with a current PGCE trainee. As part of the process they each had to deliver a lesson (standard practice in teaching interviews). Despite all of their academic knowledge and wisdom, the PhD candidate's lesson was horrendous compared to the trainee. The PhD person literally stood in one spot in the room and talked at my class of 16 year olds for 45 minutes as they sat there, glazed over and bored out of their minds. The PGCE student used age-appropriate pedagogical strategies to engage the class, and despite clearly having significantly less knowledge of the subject matter, my student learned far more from their lesson. So yes, YABVU to assume someone will be a good teacher just because they're book smart!

Your last sentence unfortunately sums up many people’s views on teaching.

The OP’s friend needs to do some more research as many people have pointed out that there are many different ways to get into teaching. She definitely needs to either apply to a sixth form college if she only wants to teach 16+ students. Like previous posters have mentioned everyone would like to teach A level so it’s unlikely that she would be allowed to only teach A level in a 11-19 setting because practically there won’t be enough hours to make up a full timetable and schools are unlikely to give all their A level teaching to just one teacher.
Hopefully she will realise that teaching is a skill and although subject knowledge is important it is still important to learn the skills needed to teach. The fact that new teachers are now not fully qualified for two years after gaining their QTS shows you how vigorous the training is.
Good luck to her but really she needs to change her approach to the whole situation if she wants to gain employment.
I find it sad that private schools have lower standards and are happily employing unqualified teachers.

Yabu

However there are lots of schemes to get PhD students into teaching or to work on the job like teach first so she can get paid while training

An independent school might take her on without training if they're desperate

Fir crying out loud....they largely now do not!! Agree with everything else you said but that. I've worked in PS since 2004..the older generation of unqualified staff have aged out (most of them fantastic teachers actually, albeit in the more traditional and formal environment you find in PS) and nowadays, any new teacher taken on without QTS gets put on a qualifying course straightaway and is monitored and mentored internally. I've only known one such who left after a year where it was clear that their Oxbridge degree dud not qualify them to deal with 9F on a wet Friday. Please can this idea about PS employing unqualified staff routinely be put to rest.

www.ucas.com/teaching-option/researchers-schools-including-maths-and-physics-chairs-programme

Repeating as this thread is a waste of time.

Do these people get paid to post, to increase ‘clicks’ and advertising revenue?

Or just another teacher bashing thread?

This, plus there are some schools who offer teacher training whilst employed.

@ReadTheBlurb out of interest what did they do

It's always via an externally provided scheme, however - it has to be in order for QTS to be awarded.

If you think reputable private schools employ unqualified staff any more than state schools do, you'll find the private ones generally list all staff, with qualifications and often universities, on their websites (it's a sales point especially when they've been to Oxbridge) but state schools generally just list senior staff and heads of departments, if that, and don't generally list qualifications or place of study.

Draw from that what conclusions you will.

Do you mean what did they do in their lesson? If so, they stood at the front of the classroom, with a script in their hand, and read from it, like you might see in a university lecture (though actually even as a uni student I only remember the most old-school of lecturers doing this). Not a single activity, no questions to check for understanding, no dialogue with students at all. I've never seen a sixth form lesson like it in the 15 years I've been an educator! They had literally no understanding at all of how to teach to non-adults.

Sadly, I have seen a few of those where the adult had come from a 6th form college background.