To think there isn’t a lot of forgiveness if you mess up?

[MyAmusedOpalCrab]

It feels like if you make a mistake - whether at work, in friendships, or even just in life in general - people are quick to judge and slow to forgive. One wrong move can follow you for years, and sometimes, no matter how much you try to make amends or improve, the mistake sticks with you.

Have we become too unforgiving as a society? Should people be given more grace or is it fair that actions have lasting consequences?

I agree with you OP.

It seems that making a mistake really alters people's perception of you for ever.
I know that in some cases this is justified if it is a serious mistake that reveals a deep flaw in your character and judgement.

But often mistakes that are born out of circumstances and which don't have bad consequences for other people/ things still make people view you differently.

And often people don't seem to have any capacity for empathy or understanding.

And some take an active pleasure in the fact you have messed up.

No I think it’s good to believe who people are. Most people don’t create mayhem for others. It’s very very sensible to ring fence the bad uns.

I don't think that people holding things against you is anything new. If anything, I find this society more tolerant than the society that existed when I was a much younger woman. That said, yes, everyone deserves some grace and understanding, except for the usual suspects eg Trump, abusers etc.

I don't think it's the mistakes that stay with you, it's how you deal with things afterwards. I find if you take responsibility and make amends as well as you possibly can, most people will move on.

Although by mistakes, do you mean poor decisions that you knew would harm people, but hoped to get away with because no one would find out?

I haven't experienced this, but I have experienced people being unable to genuinely apologise.

I don’t recognise this with work and friends at all. But I think people are becoming less forgiving of mistakes their own parents have made. There’s constant advice on here to cut contact with parents who are difficult and that seems new. When I was young people were supposed to respect their parents no matter what.

I’m not sure whether this is a good or a bad thing. It’s good that people are less willing to put up with behaviour that hurts them, but there is also a lot of loneliness around.

My husband uses the phrase "it was a mistake" to try and dismiss behaviour over which he had complete control, that has significant negative consequences for others. To me a mistake is adding some numbers up incorrectly, a misspelled word, or taking the wrong exit on the roundabout. So I guess it depends on what you mean by mistake.

This.
I was deeply hurt by a friend back in November. She knew me better than I knew myself and she humiliated me in the worst way she could. I have been so upset since and it has changed me.
A mutual party recently told me that she too is upset. She has made herself ill since this happened.
But I have not had an apology. I would be open to one. I would listen and respect the balls it would take to say sorry. But how can I assume repentance if she says nothing

Yes, I agree. There can be a lot of reasons why people make mistakes and people generally aren’t interested in the back story because they are too focused on themselves.

It depends on the mistake and the impact really.

I don’t recognise this in day to day life.

People make mistakes, apologise, change their behaviour and people move on.

If someone has inflicted considerable harm, then yes, there can be consequences. Some harms you just can’t come back from. Others are the same thing repeated over and over, so apologies are meaningless.

But mostly, mess up, recognise it, apologise and fix it, and that is that.

I agree that how we handle things afterwards really does matter and I think most people want to believe that taking responsibility and trying to make things right should count for something. But I’ve also seen (and experienced) situations where even when someone genuinely owns up, apologises, and tries to improve, they’re still permanently marked by the mistake. Sometimes it’s not about intent - it’s about how willing others are to let go.

And no, I wasn’t talking about deliberately harmful decisions or secret betrayals - more about human error, poor judgement in a difficult moment or saying/doing something clumsy that lands badly. Stuff that’s not malicious but still gets held against you long after the apology.

I like to think I’m forgiving. I’ve had to learn to be and I think maturity and growing up has a lot to do with it. Im hardly perfect! I also have learned that it’s possible to forgive people but reduce contact with them.

Probably a hugely unpopular thing to say here but I’m a Catholic (who’s recently begun practising again) and much of the sermons at my local chapel are just about being a decent person and treating your neighbours well. It’s definitely given me pause for thought in how I treat others who've made mistakes.

It depends. I think some people are naturally inclined to forgive and forget, particularly if they like the person and enjoy their company. Others will find it harder to forget even if they try and and as you say, some will alter their view of someone permanently.

I did some wild/stupid/thoughtless things in my teenage years and it feels like my parents never forgave me. I'm 50 now and still feel as if they view me as a disappointment who let them down.

In contrast my husband's best friend can be incredibly rude and selfish but people seem to forgive him anything because he's naturally charismatic and fun company most of the time.

Surely it depends on the mistake?
While apologising and taking responsibility can go a long way, some things are too big to simply be forgotten just because you said sorry.

I think we need some examples.
I find most mistakes are totally foreseeable with a bit if common sense. Unfortunately that’s in short supply.

I only struggle with forgiveness if the person doesn’t apologise or show they are sorry. I know some people (my mother) never use the word sorry. And some people say “I’m sorry BUT …..”, then project the mistake onto me and try to twist it into my fault. Those sorts of people I do hold grudges against!

I also find generally in life if a good person makes one mistake they are sometimes ostracised for it and all of the good is forgotten, where as if a bad person actually does one thing good for a change they are treated like a saint and people are expected to just forget all of the wrong they have done.

Ir all depends on the mistake doesn't it? There is a huge difference in between forgetting something and manslaughter. And people perceive things differently, my small slight could be your unforgivable trespass.
Add in social media, and some events will haunt you forever, forgiveness or no.

I dislike being told to forgive and forget. No one should be allowed to use that phrase about their own actions.

Absolutely, I’m with you that some mistakes are too big to be brushed aside and forgiveness doesn’t always mean forgetting or removing all consequences. I guess I’m thinking more about the grey area stuff - the mistakes that weren’t malicious, just clumsy, reactive, or made under pressure. The kind that people can and do grow from.

It just feels like even when someone shows genuine remorse and change, the mistake still defines them - especially in workplaces or social groups. I think there’s a difference between accountability and permanent stigma.

Some people describe things as “mistakes” when they are really not - affairs and infidelities for example. They are calculated bad behaviour.

My DH has made a massive, marriage-ending mistake. I’m devastated of course but I also feel a huge amount of empathy for him and his regret. None of my friends will ever know what he did because he would then always be tarred with THAT brush. The punishment would not fit the crime.

We might need some concrete examples. Mainly because I don’t recognise your experience in my day to day life. Silly daft things happen all the time in my workplace and friendship circles, but everyone moves on pretty quickly and it becomes the thing we laugh about . The things that aren’t forgotten tend to be pretty big ones or repeat offences , and while (most) everyone is civil and polite , yes the issue is still “there”.

I think forgiveness massively depends on whether the person making the mistake is truly sorry. Often they’re not and just sorry they were caught out.

It's worth remembering that historically speaking, the concept of genuine forgiveness, redemption, and the possibility of 'moving on' is an unusual one. Most cultures across history have required atonement / retribution for wrongdoing, without a mechanism for genuine forgiveness.

Our concepts of forgiveness in the West are unavoidably bound up in our Christian heritage, in the belief that everyone is a recipient of undeserved mercy, and so we should forgive others freely and not demand personal retribution.

As we have secularised and moved away from this understanding, I think there is increasing confusion about when and how to forgive, and an increasing return to the demand for public atonement. There is no obvious way for wrongdoers to be redeemed (just think about how some people have had careers and reputations ruined by public shaming).

Also, without a foundational belief that we will one day answer for everything we have done, and face judgment for it, there's just less of an incentive to try to treat each other decently. We are more likely to do what we think looks good in the eyes of others, and / or do wrong if we think we can get away without anyone catching us. Sure a belief in divine judgment is scary, but it also acts as a deterrent to lots of behaviour that people today think they can get away with.

I’m finding this an interesting discussion.

I have spent years accepting poor behaviour from others, always making excuses and feeling shit about myself because I couldn’t get them to treat me better. Then one day during Covid a colleague shouted at me, and then sent me a long message explaining why she was right to shout at me. It was a revelation. This could only happen because I continually forgave people’s behaviour, seeing it as just mistaken and not what it actually was, selfish fuckerry

So I stopped. I now I take a moment, think about their actions, and do what suits me. If I think it was a mistake and the person meets me half way with an apology I will 100% forgive. If they act entitled to treat me like shit, nope, that’s a sign to move on.

I didn’t forgive a friend for something recently. She behaved in an unkind way, disappeared for 6 months and then came back as if nothing had happened. When I challenged this she didn’t think she had behaved badly, that I didn’t deserve an explanation for her behaviour and couldn’t understand why I would want or need one.

so I didn’t forgive. She was going through a tough time, I was empathetic but while people are responsible for their actions we are also responsible for how we let people treat us.