Woman refusing to pay bills when everyone else does

[jennylamb1]

In the hairdresser's a few weeks ago. A woman is telling the hairdresser that she doesn't pay any of her household bills (council tax, water, gas, electric) on principle. Saying that the council tax arrears letters are fake, that they make them up because when she went to court they hadn't sent a legal representative to defend themselves. Doesn't pay water bills because they can't cut you off because legally they can't. Talking about getting a new flat given to her with all new white goods etc (not sure how this came about, may have been homeless on the council's books if evicted). Sat there with lip fillers, nails done and a head full of expensive hair extensions.
It was annoying me because the hairdresser was 'oh, what are you like,' 'you crack me up,' this sort of thing as if it's OK, when plenty of honest people are getting stung by increased bills and paying their way, working families, pensioners etc. I get that she probably has a mountain of CCJs and a crap credit rating, but is this a thing now?

Yes definitely a thing. I know of a few people who move and don’t update their details on the new property and the debt lays unassigned as it has to be in someone’s name. They get lots of letters / people knocking on the door but they don’t engage and seem to know the law pretty well as to what they can / can’t get away with.

Are you fortunate to live in social housing ? Maybe never having to worry about eviction? Lucky you that your neighbours who like most people, pay their bills, are subsidising you - every single time you do not pay your way.
Well thanks…
Wish I could be so brazen ; might be able to afford a life instead of mere existence.

She’s probably homeless and able to put on a front - or has another source of income

She sounds a bit nuts.

This, I know people who didn't pay their bills due to addiction issues, they ended up homeless.

You can indeed try to avoid paying bills but the impact on other areas of your life quickly hits.

You will soon find you can't:

• get a phone contract
• get a credit card or store card
• have an instalment plan on almost anything you buy like a sofa or car

With electricity & gas you will be put on a prepayment meter which factors in a continuous repayment of your debt. Eg you add a fiver, you get £4 of top up and the other pound will go on your bill. You might be being charged interest on the debt so could be trapped paying this for an incredible amount of time.

With council tax bailiffs will eventually attend the property and seize possessions.

You will never get a mortgage.

I suspect the people who do this are trapped in a poverty cycle anyway where they receive only benefits and are completely fucked when their kids leave home & their entitlements reduce.

the hair dresser isn't going to risk losing a customer by calling her out on her bad behaviour is she? she's just going to go home and tell her husband about the "idiot who spent £130 on her hair today but doesn't even pay her bills! Can you believe it John?"

Everyone around her is thinking the same but they won't say it to her because she's obviously an idiot.
I used to work with someone like this, fake everything that cost a fortune but moaning about the price of bread and telling me of her tales of nicking from the self scan... everyone at work thought the same but she'd carry on all justified because who's going to call her out at work and risk an awkward or hostile work environment forever after?

I think its annoying but you have to laugh and just think some people, eh? what are they like.

The joke on here is that if someone like this goes to prison, she ends up being one of the statistics often quoted here that lots of women are in prison for financial debt issues. Making out they're victims.

She is either a fantasist or she's got court records as long as your arm, probably got MH or other comorbid disorders, sounds like those 'freeman of the land' types who dont pay their mortgages and then get made homeless and claim victim status

Hairdresser is just saying what she needs to say to keep the peace. I saw a rather unpleasant man in front of me in the supermarket the other day, doing all the usual 'bantz' to the woman on the checkout, who was just trying to engage and keep the peace, he was filthy and was buying all the cut price items but going on about how he has just bought a yacht for 150k cash. Yeah right!!

Good luck with not paying your council tax. They are on your back straight away.

I’m sure the hairdresser thought she was a dick but as she actually has to pay her bills, I imagine she was trying not to upset a customer.

OK it's shocking and?

Yes, there's a very good reason why they send you a council tax 'demand' and not an 'invoice'.

Along with your mortgage or rent, it's considered a priority debt - not because of its inherent importance (i.e. paying your mortgage keeps the roof over your head) but because of how voracious councils become if you don't pay it.

Not that I'm saying they shouldn't be keen to recover it, mind; although it must stick in the craw if you live somewhere like Birmingham and they demand a massive increase but they still can't even empty your bin.

There is only so long you can not pay rent for. They will start eviction proceedings.

Infuriating but really I just feel sorry for people like that, they are low lives, they contribute to nothing

I don’t blame the hairdresser for her reaction though, she had to be polite to her customer, the hairdresser works and (I presume) pays taxes so I’m sure she wasn’t thrilled to hear about this sponging attitude either but couldn’t voice her opinion for fear of offending a customer

I once knew of someone who would not pay council tax and would not go on the electoral roll.

Anyway, she started off being all boastful about it - lots of moral high-ground stuff about being off-grid 🙄 although it was never really explained how she was off-grid while living in a house with all the utilities connected🤔

The last I heard was her moaning that the council were taking her to court.

Talking about getting a new flat given to her with all new white goods etc

Nah she didnae

Using ancient, now repealed laws, ancient maritme law (on dry land), misquoting the Magna Carta.

The whole Freeman of the Land/Sovereign Citizen/Private Citizen 'movement' is insane

Because money isn't made of actual gold (the notes state they will pay the bearer), because your name isn't you and because of a whole assortment of made up, pseudo-legal twattery, copied from SM and websites, the dopey fuckers call us 'sheeple' and fail to see why the laws that we adhere to apply to them at all

The Internet has a lot to answer for

The odd thing about all this, is that they pick and choose which laws they want to ignore

Retail goods and services, to proprietors who pay business tax, lease and mortgages, do their VAT and pay for goods and services themselves, no problem

Anything to do with a corporation or 'gub'nent', then no. They won't

Total hypocrisy

Things might have changed but I worked for a local authority (in Scotland) between 2010-15 in insurance and claims. If a claim was upheld, we would check for council tax arrears and any pay out would be offset against the debt.

It wasn’t uncommon for people to have some arrears but there were instances where tens of thousands of pounds of debt were accrued over many years and several addresses. It was mind boggling. They’d inevitably be indignant that they weren’t going to receive a pay out because they were paying back the arrears at £1 a month. On the other hand, a colleague at the time was late with one payment and was sent a letter threatening to arrest her wages.

ETA - in Scotland (at least then) if you were reliant on benefits, they would cover most of your council tax but there was a water and sewerage element that you were responsible for. A lot of those in arrears claimed not to be aware of this.

Yeah she’s talking crap.

Some people spout this stuff because they think it makes them sound cool and edgy. When in fact she’s probably insecure - hence all the beauty work

It's true.
We don't actually have to pay for anything like council tax, water, TV etc etc. I know people who don't pay. I think it's too much for me to keep on top of as there are processes and I'll get muddled up

She's either lying or she's a fantasist. There's no way that she'd be able to get away with never paying a utility bill,or council tax. They'd catch up with her eventually and send the bailiffs or debt collectors round.

Are you ripping the piss?

For any service you receive, there must be payment

Gas, electricity, water, telephone, pension, health, benefits, council services all require payment

I suspect @MusicMakesItAllBetter has been taken in by Sovereign Citizen, Freeman on the Land or similar. They tell you that you don't have to pay these things, but the processes they set out for avoiding payment are complicated. When people fail, they often think it is because they haven't followed the process correctly. The reality, of course, is that there is no such process. You do have to pay council tax, water, tv, etc. These things are not optional.

What did you expect the hairdresser to say? Get into a debate with her about the immortality of not paying bills? She isn’t going to, is she? She’s just keeping the peace, it’s not her problem. If the woman isn’t lying then she’s an idiot and it will catch up with her eventually. Just concentrate on your own life.

I know numerous people who don’t pay for water, I don’t want to pay for it either. In 2010 I was paying £7.50 a month not they want £190 a month and that’s billed. I’ve requested a meter but I’m waiting on that. No way should I have to pay that amount when I’m so careful with my water usage