I can't cope with being bullied at work

[Ginnyaletranger78]

This might be a bit of a long one.

I'm not in the UK.

I set up a charity shop over 10 years ago with my mother. A smallish shop, with a little café.

Five years ago, we moved premises because the landlord wanted to sell.

I took out a loan and bought another building, and we put the shop in there. I get the rent from the charity to pay back the loan. This was all done legally with a lawyer.

My mother then got ill. Very ill. I spent a year taking care of her, and I lost her. And I miss her so much. I don't know what to do.

During that time, with neither of us really present, the volunteers ran the show. I was still there to do all the admin and oversee things etc. but for the shop bit, I took a bit of aback seat because I was at the hospital all the time.

Neither my mum nor I ever took a salary. Nobody ever has. It was a project built on our love for what we do - the charity side of it. I also wanted her to have a goal during her retirement and something we could do together.

I have a team of 60-plus volunteers.

Since she died, I'm having huge issues. And I'm not sure I can cope much longer.

I have some excellent volunteers, amazing people who get on with things and have great ideas, but the vast majority of them don't speak the local language. So, we have a bit of a reputation of being "the English charity". I never wanted this, but that's just the way it's gone.

Over the last few months, I've tried to get a handle on things. I'm there every day, sorting, doing the displays... managing the place, taking over all the communication... I've put everything into it. We've expanded, we're attracting more people, we're making more money.

I have a child. I'm on my own. I also freelance for my "real job". I do this work in the mornings and evenings. I struggle for money very badly sometimes.

Every year, there is an AGM. During the AGM, the active members - the volunteers - get to see the accounts and are presented with a financial report. This has always happened. They also vote for who is on the committee. They always vote unanimously to keep me at the "head" of things.

Recently, though, a few have turned against me. They "don't know what's happening with the money" - even though they've all been told, they "don't like the décor in the tea room", they "don't want to have to speak local language", they "don't think volunteers should pay for cake". It just goes on and on and on. Every day. The talking, gossiping, nastiness, the cold shoulder. It's a toxic environment. I've taken some of them to one side and said I'd like to have a chat because if there's anything they don't understand about the accounts or about the work we do, I'm open to discussion. I've shown them the accounts. I even got an accountant to do everything for me and do monthly incomings, outgoings, keep hold of all receipts, etc., etc. I've tried to cover myself every which way.

They all get 50% off in the shop. They are NEVER asked to do anything. I always say that they can choose to do what they want - sorting, cleaning, the till, the displays, baking. I like them to enjoy what they're doing. To feel comfortable.

I regularly update what charity work has been achieved, how much has been donated etc. And I'm not on my own. There's a committee of five people who make these decisions.

In January, I asked the committee if I could start being paid. I'm in there every day, running it. There are no members of staff. As the "president of the association", I can be compensated 3/4 of the minimum wage. I asked for 1/2. I'm spending 20 odd hours a week there, plus all the extra I do on the cat front outside shop hours. They agreed and voted on it. In January. I haven't taken any of it yet because I wanted to clear some of our bills first.

I think this "wage" thing is what's caused the problem. But I'm struggling to keep a roof over my head and putting all this time into the charity. Any other shop would have a paid manager. I'm asking for HALF the minimum wage. But the volunteers don't seem to be happy about it.

Also, I think the fact that I bought the building has also caused an issue. But we're in the middle of nowhere. The building was worth next to nothing. And we'd have had nowhere to go if I hadn't done it. I wish I hadn't done it because I've messed up my own borrowing capacity in the meantime. It will be paid off in a few years.

Basically, the environment is toxic. I dread going in. I just hate it so much. It doesn't matter what I do or how pleasant I am, there are a handful of them who just want to make my life as uncomfortable as they can. And I don't know why.

I took the main "ringleaders" aside and said I wanted to iron out any issues they had...but it's not helped. I don't have a long list of rules. In fact, my only "rule" is that there's always someone present who speaks the local language. I even offered everyone some free sessions of language lessons.That went down like a lead balloon.

For context, I'm 20/30 years younger than the vast majority of them. I don't know if that has anything to do with it.

I need some advice. The stress is eating me alive. I can't focus on my "real job". I just spend all my time worrying, trying to make the shop better.

I used to think the patriarchy was our biggest worry, but women can be so unkind to other women. I'm in a desperate state. What can I do?

What country are you in, as that will decide what can be done legally?

I mean my first thought is get rid of the toxic people, but I have no idea if you can do that legally.

I don't know what the law is in your country but volunteers aren't usually protected under labour laws.

Give the trouble makers notice to leave.

I'd rather not say. Although, if anyone I know reads this, it's very outing.

If I "sack" them, I'll never hear the end of it. I think I could. Legally. They're volunteers. But there are loads of "expat" FB groups and they'd have a field day if I got rid of a load of elderly women. I can just imagine it.

If my mum was still here, she'd do it. She'd get rid. She'd be so upset that I'm living my life like this.

Not sure if I've got it in me to face the social consequences of getting rid of them. But maybe I need to woman up.

You can always stop and go do something else. It's not healthy for you to be in that environment, if they want to carry on let them but not with you or your money and time.

If you cannot get rid of the ringleaders they aren't ever going to let up on you.

Sounds like you've done an awful lot for other people, now it's time to look after yourself.

Just walk away and concentrate on your other job.

They've lost confidence in you for whatever reason and it's unlikely they'll ever come back from that.

If you won't deal with the problems then sell the business/premises and move on. You must have other income if you've been working for years with no salary, so all it adds to your life is stress.

I don't know if this is possible, but I'd implement a few key policies which include no gossiping and having to learn the local language. I'd take the staff on a team building day, explain why you set up the charity, and everything in this Mumsnet post while on the team building. You need to show them who you t and inspire them.

After the above I would then, simply say anyone that acts outside the key policies and is found to be undermining the charity, gossiping, not bothering to learn the language and not keeping me informed of concerns will be asked to leave because this a business built on love and kindness and you need people on board that share that vision and act as a team.

Get rid of the gossiping nasty ones or those who will not comply with the key policies.

If you know who the toxic are, and you "know" what they don't like, then implement some policies to make them leave if you really won't go through getting rid of them like mum would.

Easiest thing would be to confront the toxic, tell them they are creating toxic work environments and that's not how you want the charity to be so you're giving them notice you dont require their volunteering any more, thanks but no thanks, don't come back.

Toxic work environments are built by one bad apple, that turns a few more, then a few more... root them out before the whole basket is rotten.

Is it possible to separate the cage and the charity shop so that you concentrate on building up the cafe as for profit rather than a charity?

Would the building lease allow that?

I could try to put it up for sale.It would take a while. It's a funny old building. But what we actually do is a charity is what I live for. I love it. I've met a lot of very kind people. A lot of good friends. I would really like to pay the loan off and then keep going. I don't want these "b-words" to stop what my mum and I set up. We've done a lot of good in our own little, local way.

I don't have much income. I used to have a lot of clients as a freelancer, but AI had taken over what I do and I also lost a good few clients when I was taking care of my mum.

This shop is what I do and love. I'm proud of it.

I think I'm going to have to get rid of them. They're not going to change. There's nothing I can say or do to make them like me. They want me to carry on working for free and for them all to have free cake from the café. I worked out that it would be a loss of 400 quid a month if I was to give everyone a free piece of cake. It makes no sense. I pay for my cake! They get a discount. It's just little things like that. But LOADS of little things and it's day in, day out.

It also tends to be the ones who come and do two hours a week on the till who are complaining. I don't know how they think the shop happens. All the sorting, displaying, cleaning, taking stuff to the tip, recycling. I don't know how they think it all happens. It's a mammoth operation.

You need to find a way to get rid of people. It's your charity op, take a stand

I've learned the hard way to never take someone aside though - it makes it seem like you're being the bully

Always confront publicly

Sorry, I dont have much useful advice but have been bullied and sympathise

You need to pull up your bi girl pants and face them head on.
split up the bullies and implement a anti bullying policy.
sort Rita’s so they are not working together, if they don’t like it they can leave.
sort rota so everyone is doing different jobs and not one specific job.
if people don’t like it they can leave.
be friendly but professional.

I’d hold a staff meeting and lay it on the line. Front up to the bullies, tell them this is your charity, your shop, and you’ve run it successfully for a long time. Tell them you won’t stand for the behaviour, these are the rules and if anyone has a problem with that, they are welcome to go and volunteer somewhere else.

Or, hire a manager for 6 months. Have them go in and sort it all out whilst you step away and get back on your feet. Let them know what the problems are and who is the issue. Tell them what you want from the situation and have them sort it out.

It won’t change unless you change it. It’s hard to stand up to bullying, but in this situation you hold all the cards. You have the power. If the FB expat chat gets a hold of it, tell your story on there. I guarantee if people know these women, they will know what they are like. It will be a storm in a teacup and will soon blow over.

I suspect you’re in this position exactly because you just let them do whatever they like. They see you as a pushover because you haven’t demonstrated any managerial skills.

Just get rid of the troublemakers. It’s really that simple. Any fall out from it would be better than the current situation and it would only be temporary anyway - currently this is permanent while you won’t get rid.

I really feel for you, but I also think there are a lot of blurred lines here and I can see why that's hard for everyone. It is always hard being the only paid one if everyone else is volunteering, as they expect to 'see' the difference in your availability etc. I think taking a half salary (I know you say the law where you are doesn't allow the full) puts you in a no-man's-land where you still see it as something you're doing essentially as goodwill but they see you as paid and not, as they are, doing it purely voluntarily. It's also unfortunate that this wasn't the arrangement from the start, as they will expect to see what has changed with your status as paid. It's also really unfortunate timing that this has followed on from a period where you, completely understandably, had to step back a lot, so - as they will see it - they had to do all that you do now. And now you're back, changing everything - perhaps therefore implicitly criticising what they did in your absence - and taking money for it. I'm not saying this to be nasty, but because I do see how this has become quite a messy situation all now.

Do they know that the rent from the charity only covers the loan for the building? And what's the plan for the building - will it be yours or the charity's when it's paid off?

It also sounds like it's become a bit of a 'social/companionship' centre for them. In practice, a lot of charity initiatives have this as a bit of a secondary charitable benefit - that as well as the actual charity recipients, it's also a service to the perhaps more lonely or isolated among the volunteers. This can be a really good and nice thing in and of itself, but it is also hard to manage. Realistically, managing volunteers is a lot harder than managing paid staff. Also, when people feel that they've given their time freely they will always feel they have more right to have a say over what they do, and what is done.

If the cakes are baked by volunteers, I don't think it's crazy that they think they should be able to have a slice at the end of their shift. But are there other ways to handle this - do you not have cake that sometimes would need to be thrown away because it's been out too long? Could that not be their 'perk'?

Firstly, take the money that has been approved for your pay. You can ( and should) backdate it to when it was approved. You seem to be thinking that your wellbeing ranks last on any list of priorities, and even though your pay had been agreed by a committee of several people, you are still for some reason thinking you don't deserve it. You recognise that it is only half of NMW, you were entitled to 3/4 but have volunteered to only take half, you are undervaluing yourself. If you undervalue yourself, don't be surprised that others do too.
Secondly, your paying job should be the most important to you, and you should prioritise it . Do you really need to be present in the shop every day?
Thirdly, you took a loan to buy this place so presumably it has some value. Think about selling it. Tell the current committee that circumstances have changed and that you are no longer willing or able to commit to the charity and that they should focus and deciding how they want to proceed - they can buy you out and take over the loan, or you will sell it on the open market, but that you will divesting yourself of all interest in it from x date.
You've done your share, you helped your mum, now it's time to move on.

You need a clear volunteer policy, Job description and codes of conduct and expectations just like you would
for employees. The vols are used to running the show and you aren’t going to be able to sort this out without bashing a few heads. Could you step back and the charity get a paid manager in? Especially if the charity is doing well.

You sound lovely OP x

Op, lots of good advice. I think that rather than taking lots of people off to the side for a chat, use the trusted committee to put together an email to all volunteers outlining exactly what is happening, the rules etc for volunteers. You will need to refresh all of the policies and send them round to everyone to be clear. You can also include things like a code of conduct (eg. Everyone treating each others with respect etc). You can say that anyone who is not fully compliant with the code of conduct will be asked to step away from volunteering by the Committee. The most important thing is that the message is coming from the whole committee and that you stick to the plan.
Good luck - you can do this x

I worked in an industry which attracts a lot of volunteers. Increasingly we had volunteer managers.
Like PP mentioned there was contracts and codes of conduct. They were all their on fixed terms as well, I’ve had experience of volunteers who do nothing but come for years and won’t leave. Friends have dealt with volunteers who think they are in charge somehow and bully good volunteers out. It can easily become toxic and you are not unusual.

Id employ someone, close up for a month and reopen under new rules. I’d stop the staff discount as well and you might get rid of a few that way. you don’t need someone full time but every issue can be pushed back to them.
They can have specific volunteer meet ups with cake a couple of times a years, not cake monthly.

I didn't want to read and run. I'm sorry to hear this is happening to you. Friends of mine ran a very success charity in a european country which gave so much to the community but ended up having to shut down after several years as a few negative (jealous?) people started spreading rumours that the money wasn't given to charity etc. My friends poured their heart and soul into raising money, put hours of effort in but local people turned on them. Very sad. I hope you can find a way through, starting with the transparency that already exists. Do you have a process for terminating volunteers - it sounds like a few people should no longer being involved.

I agree with your suggestions I've worked for 3 charities managed teams of volunteers and volunteered for more and not one received free stuff or staff discounts. Some people just take the piss, part of the best experience of being a volunteer is working within the community and feeling appreciated for what you contribute not free cake and staff discounts.

I also know to not ask for their advice on anything, those who do the least hours often have the most to say about how the place is run. You can listen to them and take suggestions from them but you OP are the decision maker not them.

The people riding roughshod over you won't like anything you say or do, however they will be making the lives of the other volunteers a misery while they are there. Your charity is not there to serve the volunteers, it's there to serve the cause. You are free to defend yourself on that and any other point at any time if they start up on SM.

Talk to the committee and agree some actions. First, a verbal warning, then written. Then it it doesn't stop they'll be asked to leave. If you hear anything take it to the committee and agree next steps. Then you can say it's the committee's decision. They need to go.

This.

As PP said, there are some people who come to have contempt for people who fail to set boundaries and stand up to them.

Community and volunteering events do seem to attract bullies. A minority, but they are definitely there and try to become Queen/King of whatever group they are involved in.

Thank you all. There are some good tips here. I've always tried to keep from "debate" on SM. I hate it. So, our charity FB page is very upbeat and positive.
Since coming on in January as a "paid" manager - even though I've not taken the money yet, I've changed the shop around. Each room has been given a makeover. I've changed all communication to ONLY in the local language - and I think it's made a massive difference to the algorithms. I don't know how these things work, but so many new, local people are discovering us. I'm in for 16 hours a week sorting, doing the display, talking to customers, moving stuff... I've put a lot of effort in. I was always just "paperwork" person before. I think this is maybe what they don't like.

The building will be mine one day. But before we moved from the old place, we all voted on it - a member-wide vote. And it was agreed. Someone has to own the building. It just happens to be me because we're very rural... and the charity wasn't in a position to buy at the time. I took the personal risk of taking it on. I ask for below market value in the rent. It just about covers the loan and the taxes I have to pay. I make nothing from it. But yes, one day I'll have a big unsellable building!

On the cake front, the "rule" is that at the end of the day, if there's cake left, volunteers can take it home. But if you want to pop in on a day when you're not working and eat cake, or you want cake at the beginning of your shift to take home, then you have to pay for it. Spare, unusable cake at the end of the day is given away to anyone who wants it. Tea and coffee is free all day for volunteers. They get first "dibs" on what comes in the shop. And I don't mind that. They don't take the mick to be honest.

I should have taken money from the beginning. I imagine most of our customers have always assumed it's my job.

I think I'm of a sensitive nature and I'm not very good at being a boss. I really do need to lay some ground rules and get rid of the bad apples. I'm going to draft a letter to the committee this evening about putting in place some house rules. I can't go on living like this.

The idea of a manager for a couple of months is actually not bad. But, part of me also wants to sort this out for myself. For my mum. I can't let ten years of hard work be destroyed by a handful of bullies. I really do need to get a grip.