to wonder why Lent fasting has become so diluted?

[Wonderingwhyyy]

I was talking to a Christian who told me she fasts the traditional way in Lent. No food or water from sunrise to sunset. She was the first I had met who actually abstains from food and drink for a significant period of time.

Other Christians I know choose to give up one food e.g. chocolate, wine, tea, coffee. One Christian told me she gave up Facebook for Lent.

The Christian who said she fasted the traditional way told me she gained many benefits such as spiritual closeness to God, self discipline, greater self control.

It did make sense. Giving up Facebook doesn't seem likely to bring many benefits although may it did for that one person.

I wonder why it became diluted and whether Christianity has lost its followers by allowing most things it did not used to.

@Sifflet Nobody on Mumsnet is “buttonholing” you.

Does anyone really do this? I'm not religious myself but went to CofE schools and my best friend's family attended church, and I never heard of it. The most anyone I knew ever did for Lent was to give up chocolate. Or attempt to.

I wonder how you get this idea. Most Christians will not announce that they are fasting as we are instructed to do it 'in secret' and not draw attention to ourselves ...

Matt 6:16 When you fast, do not look somber as the hypocrites do, for they disfigure their faces to show others they are fasting. Matt 6:16-18 But when you fast, put oil on your head and wash your face, so that it will not be obvious to others that you are fasting, but only to your Father, who is unseen; and your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.

To give something up for Lent is more of a Catholic tradition and represents the 40 days that the Messiah spent in the desert praying and fasting, prior to His crucifixion and resurrection.

My understanding is that you give up the thing that has most got a hold on you (which is taking up the space that God should have in your head/life).

So you might give up gaming, sweets, swearing, or ... social media/chat sites.

The idea is you turn back to spiritual engagement and meditate afresh on being a good Christian in whatever way you most need to.

I'm 70 and used to go to Church (CofE) and have never heard of this extreme fasting either.

Ive been a Christian my whole life - times I’ve fasted for lent-0
i think its more a Catholic thing

besides whilst Christian’s do fast, they do it quietly and discreetly so you’d never know and it’s unlikely to be at lent anyway.

When I was a child and at a religious school we were incited to give something up for Lent (sweets, chocolate or something else indulgent). I think that being disciplined for a defined period of time is probably quite a good idea though it's far easier to do this if everyone around you also does.

Ok, Replace ‘buttonholing’ with ‘Grandstanding about things they clearly know nothing about on the internet’.

I'm wondering whyyy you care so much, if you aren't a Christian yourself...

I've never heard of this, but even if it used to be common practice, so what? It's not particularly healthy, so I think the modern practice is better. Tbh, for some people giving up FB is much more of a sacrifice (and probably healthier, too) than giving up chocolate or alcohol.

Many people dismiss faith, religion, a relationship with God, as having a sky-daddy that is watching your every move and will punish you. I don't think there's much to be gained by that view.

@Bizjustgotreal I agree 100% with this point. People are very dismissive of faith making these silly comments about sky fairies etc.

My mum is an Anglican abroad and she fasts similar to the way you described: no food during the day, though I am unsure about water. When I’ve mentioned it here in the UK to people talking about giving up X for Lent, I always received confused or surprised looks. So I just assumed it was a specific thing to where my mum is from (non-western country) and people here had never done it. Interesting to find out that’s not the case!

My Catholic grandmother always ate fish on Fridays, and school dinners at my C of E primary school used to be fish and chips on Fridays. That’s the only Christian dietary rule I’ve ever heard of.

I went to a convent school - run by nuns - in the late 60s (not Catholic but parents preferred the school) - for the nuns there was observance of Lent with more prayers, plain food with no treats, particularly Fridays when I think a bare minimum was eaten and meat avoided - pupils often gave up sweets/chocolate and also attended additional church services - but there was absolutely no fasting as you describe, and I think nuns and catholic friends' families in that time certainly observed according to their church traditional beliefs.
More widely this is why pancakes - use flour, butter, sugar (luxury goods) up the day prior to Lent, as during Lent they'd be avoided. I feel this must be a very specific to a small location/church/individual interpretation.
I think overall Lent is less observed in terms of eating plainly/praying more, due to less religious observance generally, but not because those still observing can't be fussed with daylight complete fasting.

I don't really know any proper practising christians. The people i know who give up chocolate/booze/sugar etc for lent are not really religious, some will write Christian on a census form out of habit, others because they were christened as a baby. They aren't churchgoers and their knowledge of Christianity has mainly come from school RE lessons.

This is why I don’t like Christianity. If the person is getting spiritual benefits from fasting, which they feel helps they life and faith, then fabulous and I am genuinely pleased for them and would have been interested in their experiences. I dislike the suggestions that 1. If they are doing why isn’t everyone and we are just not good enough Christian’s and 2. Was the person is doing is not proper Christianity and therefore they are a bad Christian. Christians often comes across as judgemental of others and not necessarily people I feel would help me be a better person.

I was brought up catholic (not one now) and we were just giving up one thing for lent and that was the late 60s so it’s not just a current thing. I never once managed it though. If there is a god I doubt he’d really care about people fasting.

I would question if laughing at the faith practices of other Christians really falls well into the Lent fasting tradition around repentance and considering how one should change to be closer to Jesus, though I guess it could also be considered a dilution of traditions of those few Christian groups which hold that type of fast so strictly which traditionally have recommended shunning/excluding or even excommunication for not keeping the fast.

Like all faith practices, Christian ones vary over time, place, other parts of the culture, and individual. I have a theory that both "dilutions" are related, that those who found themselves excluded/excommunicated found community in other groups, leading to growth away from it towards more moderate practices. The Reformation also brought out a shift within Western Christian practices that focused more on faith and religion being internal-focused.

The other faiths you mentioned also have diversity that it is unhelpful to dismiss as if Christianity is unique in having a diversity of opinions in religious practice. Across faiths, there are people who do not or partially fast, whose fasts take on very different appearances, and most faiths are very clear about the a long list of exceptions for health or other reasons even for the more devout.

I have a theology degree and a master's in medieval history. OP, fasting as in total abstention from all food and water has never been a "thing" for Christians other than very occasional monks or mystics. The medieval, pre Reformation rules were as I and others have described. Not sure why you're so determined to take your friend's word as "gospel" (see what I did there) 🤣

I was brought up Catholic, family are all catholic.

i was always taught for Lent you gave up something you liked- so chocolate is common, alcohol, bread, whatever. Not complete fasting but missing out.

at the end of lent you donate the money you saved on your chocolate bars to charity.

i have never heard of fasting sunrise to sunset except Ramadan. There was no massive Easter feast or breaking of fasts either.

the only time “fasting” came up in Catholicism was before mass. We were taught to fast an hour before mass/taking communion. My dad’s generation it was fasting from the night before.

Christianity is dying out in this country. I do think in the future, Islam will be the main religion in England

Traditional according to who? My mother was a devout Catholic who died in her 80s, she never did this. I doubt it’s been done like that in this country since the time of the puritans.

Christianity is a separate religion, so there would be differences.

Your friend sounds very extreme and unhealthy.

I don’t see how doing a starvation fast will help her spirituality? Probably just make her ill.

The friend that gave up Facebook might grow in her spirituality as she has more time for other things. Lent is also a good time to take up good habits and kick bad ones.

It isn’t a competition to see who can give up the hardest thing. Sounds like Facebook Friend will gain much more from this Lent than Starvation Friend.

I was raised Irish Catholic and I remember from 70’s onwards us all giving up 1 thinks for lent. I remember o er the years it being biscuits, chocolate etc.

We have never had a complete fast in the Catholic Church- are you sure you are talking about the correct denomination of your religion?

From a quick Google, some Christians in the Early Christian period did observe a fast from sunrise to sunset.

The Early Christian period ended in 325 AD.

This is how she does Lent. Not how Lent is done. Sounds to me like you don’t know much about Lent and have just swallowed what she’s said as an accepted fact.

Whats your source for this being how Lent was done historically? How far back in history are you talking about?