NEIGHBOUR CROSSED THE BOUNDARY BEFORE EXCHANGE

[MummyToBeAgain1]

Hi

I need some advice please.

We're buying a semi detached property and due to exchange and complete in a week or 2.

Over the weekend we drove past the property to find a fence being built between our garden and the property on the right. I suspected they had come in to our garden at a glance so drove past again yesterday.

The fence had fully been up and clearly it crossed in to our garden (to be). I've attached a quick drawing which shows what I mean. The red line is the fence the neighbour has put up.

Just for some context this is a auction property as the owner has died and the children wanted a quick sale. This means that we have a deadline for completition which makes things more stressful.

What do we do now?

Tia

It doesn't need to go to the neighbours. You register a transfer of part and the strip would stay in the sellers legal ownership. It is up to them and the neighbours to then transfer ownership. Do not give it to the neighbours in your transaction as they do not have legal title ownership.

The thing is though we've accepted exactly this. The reduction includes the costs of getting it changed on Land Reg and the legal costs involved.

Effectively, the neighbours are getting it for free but that should be a thought for the seller - Not me. I'm buying the property without the strip of land and I'm happy to change it on Land Reg after.

The change was only made a few weeks ago - after the auction date - there was no dispute prior and things were how they should have been.

Why would I go through that extra drama when the seller has already provided us with a reduction which reflects the costs to register a new boundary.

In regards to it being a small strip that we wouldn't need to update it on deeds - I assume this would be confirmed by a surveyor coming out?

Because legally the land is still yours regardless of the reduction.

The land hasn't been sold to the neighbours. Nothing related has been written in the sales contract and I haven't started the Land reg part yet.

I need further advice before proceeding.

@MummyToBeAgain1 i appreciate you are happy with your resolution and desperately want the house but I would be very cautious about the onus being on you of re-registering the boundary post purchase. As you know, the red line on the plan registered at the LR is only valid to within +/- 0.5m. When any party attempts to change the boundary line a notification is served by the LR on both parties so that both parties agree it before it is changed. It is not a process only the owner of your house has control of. If this is not sorted before you become the owner you are vulnerable to the neighbours (who have not behaved honourably up to this point) not agreeing the new line - maybe claiming more land is theirs or worse. I’m not wholly certain from your recent posts that the process of ‘simply’ re-registering the land has been made very clear to you. Please check that your solicitor has made provision to protect your interests in the event of this possibility. You do not need to buy a house which has a boundary dispute - your neighbours will dictate if you can ever sell it.

I totally get your point and I admire your peace with this situation. You have found a resolution you are happy with and that's awesome.

But I do think a valid point is the 10k reduction which will cover land registry costs, but what about land value? It's been reduced. And compensation for the whole sorry episode. That could be argued and you could ask the neighbours to register and pay costs... because they stole land. It's free to them. If they want it legally they pay the cost of registry or tell them the new fence comes down. And if that doesn't deter them... Your call.

👏🏻

I’m glad you’ve come to a resolution you’re happy with OP.

As someone said above - you’ll just have a transfer of part of your title. The remaining part will stay with the vendors and eventually the NDN can do an application for adverse possession if they want to - or the title will stay messy for a long time - it’s not unheard of and won’t affect you practically, it might cause issues for the NDN when/if they come to sell though - they’ll have this whole scenario again. Plus at that stage simply returning it won’t be an option as the slither of land will belong to the current vendor of your property, not you.

What are you talking about Op is going to take a transfer of part of the title.

OP I appreciate you’re content with your resolution but I suspect this is more due to the relief of getting the issue sorted in time to meet your deadline, rather than actually being happy with the result.

I hope that in a few months when you’ve settled in and the stress has lessened, you’ll find your anger and refer back to the many very helpful posts on here. Your neighbours are thieves, it’s really that simple.

No, she isn’t. The solution is that the land transfers with the boundaries as they were before the land grab took place and then she has agreed to change that boundary once she is the owner. I am just pointing out to her the process by which the land registry manages that change.

Sorry I misunderstood.

Do you have a lender OP? As that absolutely wouldn’t be acceptable to them.

I don’t understand giving up any property to thieves.

OP you need a different solicitor.

The change was only made a few weeks ago - after the auction date - there was no dispute prior and things were how they should have been

That makes sense, @MummyToBeAgain1, but there'll be one now unless you simply ignore the whole thing and let tthe CF neighbour carry on with what's yours

It's good that "Nothing related has been written in the sales contract" though, in that there's nothing to stop you simply taking back the land and hoping the CF - knowing perfectly well what they did - doesn't make an issue of it

OP you need a different solicitor

Edited to add or even a solicitor at all perhaps, since OP's not said if whoever's doing the work is an actual solicitor or one of these "conveyancers"

@MummyToBeAgain1 I despair of trying to give you advice because you are not prepared to listen to your rights! the land has not be purchased by the cf neighbour. they know they are trying to steal the land! you have the right to take it back, no matter what you pay to the vendor!! stop being a sap and get on with it! you dont need to contact land registry. you need to demolish the cf fence and take your land back. it doesnt matter how much cf paid for their fence!! they knew they were doing wrong!

That is a really good point @Netaporter and others

Reading this again it does sound like you are buying the whole plot complete with disputed bit, then agreeing to split the plot into 2 pieces. But who will own the disputed bit before and after you do the split? I can't imagine the sellers will be interested in keeping it or "getting it back" themselves and as you say there is no question of actually giving it to the neighbour.

It looks to me that you will be splitting the plot basically for your own convenience so you have one plot with your house on that is "free of dispute" so you can sell it, and a separate ransom strip that you own the title to but your neighbour is squatting on. Does that sound right?But if that is the case why does your agreement to split the land need to be part of the deal with the vendor at all?

I would wait until the property is yours absolutely then send a surveyor and have the neighbours prove where their boundary is. They shouldn’t be getting the land for free, or at all.

Well OP, if you are happy with the situation then that is really all that matters.

I personally think this could potentially get very messy and extremely costly.....

I'm now off to do my shopping - and if anyone wants to dip into my trolley when I have paid for everything, I'll just let them, as this seems to be acceptable to let people help themselves to something that isn't rightfully theirs......

Why would you knowingly inherit an unauthorised occupier?

I understand why OP wants to move on, but we’ve twice had issues with land that has made me realise how important it is to have clarity in deeds. In the first case, a tiny strip of land (1m wide) on one section of our property, with dubious ownership, required us to pay for insurance when we sold our property to cover the buyer … in case someone came back to claim that strip after we sold it to them. The second, a strip of land that is ours, but next to the neighbours house. We’ve had to send them copies of our deeds to stop them building on it.

OP might have resolved an issue to her satisfaction, but it could flare up again when either she or the neighbour sells their property in the future and a third party is involved.

@Netaporter As you know, the red line on the plan registered at the LR is only valid to within +/- 0.5m.

As far as I remember from the OP's early posts, the strip might fall within this as being less than half a metre wide along the length of part of the garden. Is that correct, OP?

I understand that you wanted to take the pragmatic approach to get the sale over the line on a house you love and with the time pressures of completion and having to move from your current home, @MummyToBeAgain1 . I also understand that you didn't want to risk losing any money, be involved in a protracted process in dispute with the auctioneers, agents and seller, and have therefore negotiated a discount instead. I can see that you want to proceed with positivity and I wish you every happiness in your new home. At the same time:

I need further advice before proceeding.
Yes, you most certainly do.

I want you to ask yourself these very simple questions: Why have the neighbours stolen that particular strip of land? Why do they want and need it so much that they are prepared to blatantly steal it and put up a very substantial and expensive fence to secure it for themselves? It is quite an extreme thing to do and something most of us wouldn't do.

In the cases I have known where similar has happened, it is because they want to build or extend on their plot but haven't quite got enough room for what they want to do. That strip of land juts out into your garden and towards your house, if your diagram is correct. How would you feel if they use it in future to enable them to, for example, build an extension, a garage with a room over, an outdoor bar and hot tub area, a home office or gym, an annexe for a family member or to let out, a workshop, a septic tank, oil tank or heat pump? You might think that you wouldn't mind but the reality is most of us would mind when all those things can result in increased noise, windows opening out into your garden, and loss of light and privacy. What if it turns out that you need that land for something unforeseen in the future?

My advice would be to move in, let the dust settle and get over this unexpectedly stressful buying process. Later on you will be able to seek advice and think more clearly beyond the relief at getting over the line, having your new home and at a discount. Personally I would not be assigning the land to the neighbours via the Land Registry process. As a first stage, I suggest writing to them when you have settled in informing them that you are the new owners of the house, they were observed on x date by witnesses and instructing them to remove the fence and reinstate the boundary within 14 days.

One thing that struck me is that absolutely nobody seems to have spoken to or written to the neighbours about what they have done. They must be laughing up their sleeves.