To question school spending £20000 on event space in school car park…

[OrangeCrushing]

It’s an infants school, just set back from busy main road.

No gates.
Random cars regularly use car park to do 3 point turn.
Car park always full and then dubious parking.

Shed to one side (close to car park entrance) has been turned into an event space.

It’s not huge, maybe 10/15 children. But no outside space, and if door is open you wouldn’t want a child going outside into car park/near the main road without close supervision by an adult.

Think idea is to hire it out to generate more money for school.

I’ve been told that school can’t afford reading books/library books changed. So children get the same reading book 6 times or for two weeks in a row. Library is rarely used.
Money raised for event space has been raised by PTA, who are amazing and very well meaning.
However, I honestly don’t think we are going to see lots of new reading books, someone helping with library as a result.

It feels like the priorities are wrong?
I would have focused on securing the car park with gates first, ensuring reading resources are adequate - and then gradually putting additional funding towards the event space…

I’m sure and they wouldn’t.

It feels like the priorities are wrong?
I would have focused on securing the car park with gates first, ensuring reading resources are adequate

But they don’t have the funds for adequate reading resources, hence the revenue from the event space.

Was the same when my kids were at school. Schools (both public and private) would rent out facilities such as school halls. With public schools, it was so they could fund basic things such as reading resources. With private schools it’s maximising revenue which is expected under sound economic management. I recall school halls being rented outside school hours by local churches, dancing schools etc. School ovals/green space being rented out of hours for football clinics, youth athletics organisations etc.

You really can't.
And no Ofsted wont unless there are very serious, evidenced issues, mainly safeguarding.

Ofsted will only consider a complaint unless the school complaints procedure has been fully followed first.

In practice, OFSTED sometimes contact the LA and ask the questions. The LA will investigate on their behalf and send a report back.

An "event space" only large enough for 10-15 primary sized children, located next to an already-full carpark on a main road, so no additional nearby parking, is unlikely to be the big financial win they seem to think it is.

Do they have a business plan for this event space?

Ah, thank you. I missed that 😬

Presumably the school will be hiring it out in evenings and weekends when the school car park will be empty.

I can’t quite figure out the car park layout, though - @OrangeCrushing are you saying that the school car park isn’t gated off at all, so anyone could access the school during the day? That seems shocking given how schools usually have very tight security. Or is there a barrier/ gate between the school car park and the rest of the school buildings?

Safeguarding governors don’t normally see risk assessments.

The SEN issue is a different matter.

You say the SENCO said the school could not meet his needs before started. Those needs must have been written down by someone who already knew him, e.g. his nursery, and presumably the SENCO thought the school couldn’t provide whatever it was said he needed. Are the school meeting those needs now he is there?

If he is not getting the provision the school has said in writing he is getting, you certainly have a valid cause for complaint.

So easy to criticise from the sidelines, whilst not doing anything yourself.

Have you considered joining the PTA or standing as a governor? You really aren’t happy with the school so either get involved or move your child.

Why don’t you come up with a fundraiser idea for the library books and offer to help the PTA with its delivery? Most PTA’s have too few volunteers and too many armchair critics.

No gates - absolute madness, so dangerous. Our school even changed their wooden fence to a metal one following that horrific incident when a Range Rover drove into a school with a wooden fence last year and killed 2 little girls.

No but they seek assurance that the RA’s are in place and triangulate with the Health and Safety Adviser visit, school logs of accidents ( patterns and cause) and their own governor monitoring on site.

They can also ask questions to challenge policy and practice.

What are you suggesting? Financial corruption?
You'd better report this.

There is always a parent like this and they are generally the same ones who never ever attend the PTA committee meetings, where donations to the school are discussed and approved, by a quorum, as you have quite rightly pointed out. You would think if someone was concerned about PTA effectiveness/choices, they would make it a priority to attend meetings and advocate for themselves and their children? At the very least confirm for themselves that process was democratic.

I'm a safeguarding governor. Analysing accident trends etc are the province of the H&S governor.

I think the ship has sailed a little now. They would have spent ages campaigning for the funds for it, getting planning etc and then actually building it... what is raising an issue about it now it's already built going to do. You can't get the money back. Go and do some campaigns and raise money to buy some new books.

@OrangeCrushing - if it helps you get an idea of funding and why this might be a good idea, when Covid hit and our school primary had to stop hiring out its space to external users (evenings and weekends), the school had a shortfall of £12k.

the Slimming world group you are dismissive of- our local one hires a room from a nearby church. I know they pay £55 each week to hire it once, assuming they run it 50 weeks a year (they do run through school holidays but not Christmas) that £2,750 for one year for one evening booking. Let’s say the school gets 4 bookings a week for various clubs, that’s £11,000 a year. That’s 2 years and it’s paid for itself and if the posh shed lasts 10 years, from year 3 that’s a regular income for the school that the PTA doesn’t have to do anything to create.

4 bookings a week is perfectly reasonable, it may well end up more, our primary school has regular clubs paying to use the space 4 nights a week, one regular Saturday morning and on Saturday afternoons and anytime Sundays will do hires for parties.

this is before you factor in the benefit to the kids to have an extra space they can use for small group sessions.

Re PTA approving this spend. I agree it should be agreed and voted on by the committee. However £22k is a huge amount to spend and there is no clear benefit to the children in the school. I’ve volunteered on a PTA and, without a clear benefit to the children, would not have agreed to it. The PTA relies on parents supporting its events and if the money raised isn’t spent appropriately parents won’t attend events to raise further funds. We run voluntary donation schemes at some of my schools and the Heads consider carefully what we spend it on and it always something visible and that directly benefits children because we want to encourage future donations e.g laptops, playground equipment, improving facilities like libraries and classrooms. I can’t see how a shed that accommodates 10/15 children is going to be a hot rental property that will raise funds to pay back all the investment.

If you quoted people's posts instead of just tagging them, your thread would make more sense.

Don’t forget the additional costs associated with renting out premises. Schools have to consider insurance, opening, closing and administration time as well.

Op you can request copies of the PTA meeting minutes. Perhaps ask for these over the last 2 years and you’ll see and why how the discussion developed and how the decision was made. You can criticise the majority vote, but the only way to have an influence is to join.
the PTA whether a registered charity or not will have a frame work and memorandum, they are separate to the school and do not have to co tribute to what the school wants if they disagree and that is that, school can’t force them to fund anything ( although the PTA has to justify why they won’t)

Providing adequate books is a fundamental of a school.

If the school have any money to spend, books should come first. It’s quite easy to buy kids books cheaply second-hand online. The PTA could help with that. If they’ve got £10k for an event space, the books should come first.

Is it an academy @OrangeCrushing? Or part of the local education authority? If the latter, and there’s a bit of a cabal at the school, I’d speak to the LEA and ask what can be done about providing more books. What’s the blockage? Funds? Someone’s time?

My gripe with PTAs is that they’re now usually just a parent fundraising group when they should be a joint venture of teachers and parents focussing on how to make the fundamentals of the school better for every kid.

PTAs aren’t meant to fund the basics of a school