To want to split with DH after 25 years together?

[stoviesfortea]

I have had thoughts of leaving DH on and off throughout our marriage but it’s always been too difficult. Kids too young, finances etc. We are very different and I actually don’t know why we even got together. It feels like it just happened and now 25 years later and 18 years of marriage, here I am.

We generally get on and have had many good times but the same old arguments and clashes come up time and time again. It’s hard to get compromises and when we argue we both just seethe and hold resentment, push it away, ignore it and then things go back to normal. But then a few months later the arguments appear again.

A big issue is I think DH has ASD (which he doesn’t believe) as one of the things we’ve always clashed over is his avoidance of people and socialising, I can count on one hand the amount of times he’s gone out with me and my friends in the 25 years together. We do separate activities and I actually avoid going out with him as he’s so awkward if we bump into anyone. I have learned to live an essentially separate life apart from the things we do at home with the kids. I’m actually fine having this sort of life so a life without him might not feel much different. He also lacks empathy and insight and this really gets to me.

The latest argument was that he blew up when I said I wanted our kitchen done up (it’s literally falling apart) and he said no as has a total issue with workmen being in the house. We’ve had house stuff done over the years but he’s always said it’s ‘hell’ and has major issues with workmen being in our house.

We are also clashing over money. We’ve always been independent finance wise (own accounts but have a joint account too and split all bills), fairly comfortable (not rich but not poor) and mortgage now paid off. I recently got a decent amount of money so we can totally afford to do the house up and go on some nice holidays. Although I’ve said this is essentially family money he has this weird male pride thing where he says HE can’t afford these things so we can’t do them. Even though the money is sitting there! It’s bloody bizarre and feels a bit controlling. We had a huge argument over this with me saying I’ll pay for holidays and the kitchen and he’s saying they don’t need done and he can’t afford them anyway. AIBU to think that’s weird?!

We also clash over sex- he would happily do it every night whereas I cannot be arsed. We do have sex about once a week but if there’s a gap of even a few weeks he goes in a weird mood and we’ve had major arguments about this in the past.

He also says I constantly nag but he is so untidy and messy and I’m sick of running about after him and our kids. We have 2 daughters who are nearing the end of school and the thought of them going off to uni and me being with DH for another 18 years does not fill me with joy, the opposite in fact 😢

He has some pluses too but the minuses always seem to trump these.

I’ve said before we should split but I’ve never followed through with it. This time though feels different as the kids are older, I think they’d be OK and maybe not majorly surprised, I could potentially buy him out of the house, and I am getting no younger (we are in our 50’s)

AIBU to finally split?!!

Be wary of finding excuses to stay - which is fine if it gives you more time to work stuff out. Just hold onto all the reasons to leave because he's going to suck the life out of you. Don't let another 5 years slide by.

@stoviesfortea gosh I feel for you. I could have written your thread word for word. This was me in 2021. All the things you described.
When I snapped and ended it, he immediately went into “hyper cleaning and task mode”, but it was too late.
The new kitchen I had been asking for over 20 years, is now in situ in my former marital home, but chosen by my ex-MIL no doubt.

My exDH is loads happier, as am I. It was very painful to split but I seem to have trained him up for his new GF.

A weight of resentment was lifted from me when I moved out. We parent better, now we are 50/50 and communicate much more effectively about the kids. Yes there are still things about him that exasperate me but it’s no longer my problem.

I’m sure I will continue to have bouts of guilt but my life is so much calmer in my own space, how I like it. It’s tidy, decorated to my taste and of jobs need doing, they get sorted.

There is hope. It’s hard and upsetting but for your long term sanity and happiness, it may be the right decision.

Thanks, when folk say ‘get your financial papers’ what does that actually include / mean?

We have a lawyer who made our wills only last year. My thought process during that was telling too as I kept thinking ‘what if I die, he’s gets all the inheritance and doesn’t pass any to the girls?’. I only say this cos he has a thing about how his parents didn’t help him financially so he’s not going to do that for our kids after they are 18. I have saved money monthly their wholes lives for them and they both have child trust funds they will get when they are 18. He has literally put nothing in towards it. I’ve actually put the kids names as my beneficiaries for my pension and I haven’t told him 😳

We are quite separate with money and always have been so I am hoping that will make life easier. Good idea to run it all by a solicitor though as I’ve no idea how the legal system views it.

Good God, he just gets worse and worse, OP. Please take the good advice on here.

See your lawyer Op, you can find out whether you need to redo your will and what paperwork you'd need for divorce. Even if you don't want to start yet it's good to know where you stand. If you have any life insurance you might want to change that too

I would suggest that you find a different lawyer to your family lawyer. When it comes to divorce, you need a ruthless no-nonsense divorce lawyer. (Often referred to her as a SHL, or Shit Hot Lawyer.)

I was an idiot and didn't do this, so ended up with a wet flannel of a lawyer who advise me very badly. Back then I was still of the "trying to be nice" mindset. Big mistake. It cost me dearly.

Financial papers means, for example...
Pension
Bank accounts
Savings
Land registry documents (you can get a copy from the land registry online for a few quid)
Marriage certificate
Birth certificates
Passports (you can't hire a lawyer without a passport)
Life insurances
Proof of any other assets / debts (for both of you)
Copy of your current wills

Being efficient in your briefing helps to keep costs down. Lawyers are expensive, but necessary.

Something else: Any law firm you contact about representing you in your divorce will not be able to act for your husband. A friend of mine who divorced her total shit head DH made a point to meet with every half-decent law firm within a 30 mile radius simply to throw a spanner in his works.

I'm well aware that I will be the only one with this opinion...
You know your husband loves you, you have been together a long time and have children together. You say he's a great Dad.
Nevertheless the MN hounds are baying in unison "LTB".
Please do remember that another rule of MN is that no one takes it seriously and people don't give the advice they would follow IRL . ( See recent post!). Most people think the posts are made up anyway.
It's well known that love is very hard to find. Also, you presumably made marriage vows?
I sincerely hope you won't give this advice to LTB more notice than it merits.
Have you thought about marriage counselling with a properly qualified professional?

Marriage is a legal contract, nothing more or less. ‘Having some good times’ is not a valid reason to stay with someone who’s making not only the op miserable in general, but their entire family. He may still love her, but it doesn’t read like the op is still in love with him. Why live a life of compromise when the op has many years ahead to find someone who doesn’t suck the joy out of her life? Is she meant to become a hermit like him? And the most important factor you’re missing is the fact the op suspects he’s autistic, with all due respect you very likely don’t know how difficult it can be living with middle aged men with undiagnosed ASD. It’s already having a severe impact on her life and not only that won’t change, it will get worse. No counselling will change that. I hope the op doesn’t give ‘stay with him’ anymore merit than it deserves, especially when she’s looking forward to her freedom of this prison sentence of a marriage.

^^ vis-a-vis this post, yes of course marriage counselling is an option, but only when both people want to remain married.

Usually in cases of divorce, there is one party who doesn't want the marriage to end. This is the issue that causes conflict in the divorce process. The person who doesn't "want" the divorce is upset, then gets angry, then all the mess starts.

HOWEVER - this is not the dark ages. Women do not have to remain in an unhappy or unsatisfactory marriage. After sacrificing themselves for so many years with a thousand compromises and raising their children, it is not unreasonable to decide that the rest of their life will be lived on their own terms, not someone else's.

I’ll also add to the post I quoted and to the op - I’m not saying her husband doesn’t love her, but it’s more likely he’s worried about losing his ‘anchor point’. If he is possibly autistic, the op will represent the centre of his ‘routine’ if that makes sense, and the fear of losing her/the marriage is far more to do with his sense of peace than with this being a great love worth saving. He’s happy to carry on because it’s safe and what he knows even if it’s making the op/both of them miserable. It’s actually quite selfish (even unintentionally) to use his emotional dysregulation as a reason to stay.

"Marriage is a legal contract, nothing more or less".
Er, no.
You're demonstrably wrong about this. It can't be just that when there are children involved.
It isn't a crime to be ASD. Of course DH owes her the best he can offer but OP owes him a great deal too, as well as to their children.
I can't be bothered to get into emotive language about prisons, supposed future happiness, etcetera.
I'm sure that with the appropriate support OP's DH could make an adequate spouse. She can always make up for deficits by getting out more, whatever.

The children involved are adults or months away from legally being one. There is no childcare or maintenance needing to be arranged and the op has said that her husband will unlikely pass down inheritance to them which she wants to do. So she’s actually protecting some of their possible future inheritance somewhat by leaving as he could no longer inherit as a spouse.

You say that you won’t get involved in emotive language and yet suggest that the op ‘owes’ her husband something for the simple fact they’ve been married years and share children? Absolutely not, her existence doesn’t belong to him and this family life - especially when children they share are now naturally moving on with their lives.

And he won’t make an ‘adequate spouse’. You are again coming from an emotive place and I’m speaking from full experience (almost word for word of the OP’s current life). It will not change and that will become even more apparent once the last child has left home. Why on earth should the op waste her energy ‘supporting him’ or handholding him through being a good husband rather than enjoying her own life now that the days of full on parenting are done? She’s not going to move from parenting her children to parenting him.

The op has evidently made up her mind. That fact she says she will miss the children but wouldn’t miss him if he left speaks volumes. No one here has planted the idea in her head.

"Adequate spouse' and 'owing' are not emotive language. They refer to the obligations of marriage. This isn't my idea. Marriage is a social institution for the protection of all within it, even the OP's DH. I'm sure some ND people on this thread would agree that DH shouldn't be chucked away like a discarded toy because he functions differently.
You're for some reason assuming that I don't know anything about these situations. It's possible to have lived experience and still differ in one's understanding of personal responsibility.
Children don't stop needing love and care once they turn 18, or at least, not in my world.
Of course OP will do what's right for her. I'm trying to rectify an imbalance in perspective, for the sake of a meaningful discussion.

It’s not about ‘functioning differently’, I’m ND myself and range from having quirks to straight out irritating behaviour. This is beyond that, and again is often something that’s coming out more in relationships with middle aged men who are undiagnosed - there’s a very long running thread about it on the Relationships forum. Many things are impossible to live with/put up with and because they refuse to recognise this and have had no adequate support from an early age find it impossible to change these poor behaviours. Why on earth should the op have to live with a messy, bad tempered, closed off man who she doesn’t love and gets guilted into having sex with when she doesn’t want to? There is no obligation there simply for the fact that they have a marriage contract. And of course the children still need love and support post 18, and again it reads like that would be given far better as separated parents than together if you’ve actually read all of the OP’s posts. The children already don’t enjoy bringing friends around anymore due to their dad, what will it be like when they have their own families?

I think it’s quite risky to talk about obligations of marriage and indicating that marriage has to be for life. A marriage should be overall mutually beneficial, this marriage is completely one sided. OPs husband gets to live exactly how he’s comfortable living but it’s at the expense of his wife and children’s wellbeing. OP doesn’t owe her husband a marriage that is entirely on his terms.

OP, I think it's pretty clear you're emotionally checked out and now it's just a matter of time. I think that's a good thing.

Unfortunately, whether because of ND or just because he's a bit of a twat, I think the reality is that this relationship is actually emotionally abusive on his part. He demonstrates very little respect for you in terms of trying t understand or make your life easier. He only agrees to things you want when he realises that it's a dealbreaker for you. He claims you are "controlling" when you make perfrectly reasonable requests - eg don't pee on the floor - which is a brilliant control tactic in itself, particularly for women who have been socialised to believe that we should always compromise and accomodate other people.

So basically, he does the bare mimimum to keep you in his life. I don't think that's love. It's probably more like comfort and familiarity and, frankly, a regular sexual partner.

You say he's a good dad and I hope that there are good factors because they're not entirely clear - your children are already avoiding the house because they don't want their friends coming round. That says something very telling to me. ditto partners. The money thing - well, sure, it could be that he's just got a different view to you, but it does seem concerning tha tyou're worried that he won't even let them inherit. If he doesn't like going out and being out and about does that mean he's avoided their sports activities, school events etc? does he have any sort of relationship with any of their friends parents ? becuase that sort of broader community is important for children and it's hard to see how he's part of it based on what you've said.

As for things like cleaners and windows. Well, I think that's ultimatum time - the house is a mess, the windows are filthy and I am not standing it any more. I'm booking a cleaner and a window cleaner for next week. If you feel that strongl ybaout them coming, that's fine. I can cancel up to 48 hours ahead if the house is at a state I can live with and that you have agreed to do. [My Dh is the least lazy person you've ever met but I've had to do this a few times. In his defense, he either pulls it together and does it, or he accepts graciously that I am getting the cleaner or whatever]

I'm sure that with the appropriate support OP's DH could make an adequate spouse. She can always make up for deficits by getting out more, whatever.

Fucking hell, what an utterly depressing future that would be. An adequate spouse who the OP could tolerate being married to by never being in the house with him.
It is more than ok for the OP, and for all of us, to chose far more than this for our lives.

Isn't it amazing how it's always the women who have to put up with bad men? OP's husband refuses to acknowledge that he may be ND and refuses to make changes to how he interacts with life. Meanwhile OP has to set aside all her modest wishes for happiness.

Vows? Didn't the husband also make vows about loving and cherishing? And does he not break those daily?

Don't listen to the handmaiden, OP. Start quietly working towards freedom and happiness.

Absolutely this. A part of me is so glad I never actually married my ex. Even though it made it even harder to start again after separating this old fashioned ideas of obligation (and the idea of wifely duty to look after a man is heavily implied from that poster), the pressure to actually stay from others was far less. There is a huge misunderstanding between marriage as a legal entanglement and marriage as any other serious relationship. Some still seem to think ‘ownership for life’ is still an expectation of marriage.

Divorce doesn’t “chuck someone away”. Talk about emotive language! It frees both parties to pursue their own goals.

There's a lot of word salad here, but what you seem to be missing is that he has made ZERO effort to improve anything for himself, or for her. I have a ND 14 year old who has more maturity and understanding that it can't ONLY be his way... and he's only on the very first steps of understanding that just because he thinks/operates/feels one thing, doesn't mean it's okay to behave in certain ways.

I have no time for the excuses given that ND people need extra support. Because they do, and I am 100% fine with that. But that doesn't absolve them of all responsibility or of the need to make the effort.

"Word salad"?
😅

I’m not quite sure most people would see the reasoning behind having an ‘adequate spouse ‘ - maybe it was enough for some in the past with few choices but you only get 1 life and divorce can simply mean you no longer want to be in that relationship as it doesn’t ‘fit’ anymore- - it doesn’t mean you have to hate them , or never see them again ( unless that’s what you want) -it just means you don’t want to be in a relationship with them - some people seem determined that we all put up with any relationship at any cost

have you actually read what he’s like ? She can’t even get a window cleaner ?

Also, IIRC, the sexual relationship is dire. No one—male or female—should be forced into regular sexual intimacy that they don’t enjoy.