Did mum do it on purpose?

[AnaMRT]

I would appreciate honest opinions on this. I was planning on going away for a week with my two younger children and my mum. It was to see family I haven’t seen in 7 years and to organise some paperwork. My dad sent a message saying he isn’t sure I should be going away, that it’s not the right time and we will discuss it later as he’s going to work. He was meant to be buying the tickets for mum and myself and kids and I was going to transfer him the money before he purchased them. The way he worded it seemed to imply that he is making the decision for us. For context he has form for convincing my mum not to go back to our home country as he’s got anxiety about flying.

My mum saw the message he sent as she’s in our small WhatsApp group. Then she sent me a private message saying dad said it’s not the right time to go. It got me angry as occasionally he has acted as if he can control my actions and tell me what to do. For context I’m in my 30’s, married with kids. I called her and asked her what’s going on. I then said I feel angry that dad seems to think he can just decide if I get to go or not. He isn’t in charge of my decisions etc… if I want to go I will go and I will purchase the tickets myself. Further context mum always uses her mobile on speakerphone when she’s talking to someone. As I spoke to her for about 15 minutes and occasionally got heated up feeling like I have to justify and convince my dad why it would be a good idea to go etc… she never once mentioned that he’s there listening. I heard something in the background and just got a feeling he was there.

I then said I’ll call dad myself and tell him all this as I’m feeling angry (I’m hormonal as I was up breastfeeding baby all night and period is due as I was in pain). She then said he’s here. He sounded sad in his voice. I told him exactly how I felt in the same tone of voice that I spoke to my mum about him. If I would’ve known he was there I would’ve spoken to him directly and said the same things but in a gentler way. I feel like she did that on purpose. Further context she is always keen to point out mine and the children and my husband’s faults to my dad. I feel like she likes to bond with him that way or to get him on her side. I don’t know exactly why but it’s happened before. The kids do something small and she tells him: See I told you they shouldn’t be allowed to watch this or do that as it’s spoiling them. She’s constantly undermining me etc.. She is very overbearing and controlling. I’ve always made excuses but this really hurt me. What she did felt like what a ‘mean girl’ would do.

I know she knows what she did because in the evening she called and kept asking if I was okay. I said why wouldn’t I be. It’s like she wants attention or to upset me. My dad and I are fine. He came round and we had a talk. I was always a people pleaser and I feel like I have found my voice but every time I explain to her how she likes to take over with the kids etc it falls on death ears. She promises not to do it again but continues to do it. I know if I ask her why she didn’t tell me he was there or say: here speak to your dad yourself she would just say she didn’t think of doing that. I’ve lost all trust in her. She doesn’t have my back and points all my faults to my dad. I’m an only child so I haven’t got anyone else to talk to about this. My husband said I don’t need permission from my dad to go away. Dad has agreed to book the tickets since then. I feel like she did it on purpose but I guess I’ll never know for sure. It’s my fault for saying anything to her I know but I still feel hurt. It feels like she’s trying to ruin our relationships with my dad on purpose. Sorry for the long essay!

Yes you are right I can go by myself. I’m an only child and was raised in a strict household and I guess got used to running ideas past my parents first. They help with childcare as I also work 3 days a week. I think the dynamic is toxic. I dream of moving away but wouldn’t be able to work until the children are much older.

I think you should take a huge step back and have far less contact. If you do have contact, put them on a strict information diet.

This - if you book your own tickets in future they get less say all round and it's much clearer to everyone that's the case.

If she's overbearing and controlling as you say, I wouldn't want to go on holiday with her anyway. Her wishes to go there and your dad's attitude to it is her own business to manage and you don't need the aggro impacting on you and your DC. A holiday is meant to be fun and it's already causing ructions. I'd leave them both out of it in future and manage my own family and my holiday bookings.

Ah okay well you've got yourself in a bind there, relying on them for childcare. Hard to call the shots when you're not independent from them, emotionally or practically. I'd work on getting that sorted asap so you have more of a leg to stand on when you want to assert your independence.

Clearly she isn’t actually that keen…

Unless there is some salient fact (your home country is Israel, Ukraine or Afghanistan) then just book to go without her. If she really wants to come, your dad can book a ticket on the same flight at a later date.

I would look at what's behind both your parents behaviour. Your dm might be desperate to keep the peace with your df and out of anxiety over years of conditioning has lost sight of putting you and indeed herself first.

My exdh was unpleasant to live with when things didn't go his way (ie emotionally abusive) so I learnt to anticipate his reaction and do anything I could to manage his emotions.

This looked like me being controlling but it was out of anxiety to prevent him blowing up.

You’ve hit the nail on the head. Even if I mentioned going out for 1 drink in the past (I never go out. Last time I went for a cocktail was in 2019) my mum was asking who I’m going with and where. Will I be safe and how will I get back. That I shouldn’t go etc… I feel like a bird trapped in a cage. My husband on the other hand doesn’t have a problem with it and has suggested I meet my 2 friends this year and go for a meal and a cocktail for my birthday. My mum is very anxious about everything. If she could bubble wrap my kids she would.

Given all this, it's really not great that they're raising your DC half the week. It sounds like your mum has some serious issues/anxiety/control problems which won't be going away. While making sure the DC still seeing their grandparents, I'd be making all efforts to assert some space and not letting this go on into another generation. The last thing I'd do is be taking her on holiday with me too!

This is needless meddling and I agree, you should go without her to make her realise the consequences of her actions.

My DM did similar things - it seemed that she was jealous of the relationship I had with my DF and tried to sabotage it, so when relaying information to him she would twist it in some way and make me out to be an awful person. It worked for a long time until I overheard and realised what was happening.
I cut her out of the loop and it took years to restore the relationship with my DF.

So basically your Dad manipulates it to being the one who changes and who then becomes the saviour painting yiur mum in a bad light. Of course he can change he is the one in control.

but this all sounds very enmeshed and I get it slightly as an only child of an anxious mum who still struggles sometimes with telling her things as well.

its hard isn’t it. For example my mum hates drinking and I still hide from her drinking glasses of wine - far more than I do from my 16 year old.

I had this behavior as well - like you I put it down to their anxiety - and it might well be.

However it doesn't stop until you make it.

Don't run things past them - sometimes so they don't piss on your chips tell them after you've planned or done something or be very clear it was a statement not a request for permission.

I tolerated it way too long and it tarnished some otherwise happy events.

Also you are modeling to your DC how to handle such situations - something I hadn't realised till saw teens pushed back when behavior was directed at them - they'd been watching.

Yes a very valuable lesson learnt! I won’t let my guard down again and I will not discuss anyone else with her. I haven’t said anything to my mum at all. We haven’t had a falling out. I was acting as normal and haven’t told her it hurt what she did. She called me in the evening after dad left and kept asking if I’m okay and I said I was perfectly fine. Don’t want to show her any emotion. I know that if o confront her she will repeat it all to my dad and make it out that she’s the victim. There’s not point as she never changes.

Exactly this ⬆️

It sounds like your dm can’t be trusted though so don’t tell her anything you don’t want repeating.

That’s it! It’s really affecting me and I don’t want the kids seeing all this stress around them. They are getting anxious about being told off a million times a day over unnecessary things.

That’s not your problem though. She can book her own flight and join you if she wants.

Your dad still has control of the situation if he's the one booking. What's to stop him just deciding that "oh your mother was too anxious so I've just cancelled the flights"?

I would also immediately ask if you're on speaker every time you call your mum. You know you will be but at least you will have the chance to then say "hi dad" or ask who else is there so you know who you are talking to.

Yes I’ll be looking for a job with school hours from September. I feel like I tolerate a lot more because they help so much. I feel like I can’t say no to all the unreasonable behaviour because I’m so grateful for all their help. I appreciate their help so much but it’s slowly chipping away at me. I need to reduce my hours or find another job.

I always thought my dad was the controlling one in my parents relationship. In hindsight, my mum was just as bad.

I don't think it's so easy to say one parent is being more controlling than the other here based on the information available.

Your dad sent the message in a shared group. Your mum messaged you separately, so your dad was unable to defend his position before he returned from work.

Your dad tries to modify his behaviour when he's called out on it while you say your mum just carries on regardless.

We don't know that your mum actually changed her mind about going and then tried to blame your dad.

The speakerphone thing could easily have been her way of manipulating you into having a go about your dad while she made him listen to it as much as it could have been your dad listening on purpose to make sure your mum complied.

While you can be angry at both your parents, I would caution against coming down hard on one over the other because it could easily be the other way round or both as bad as each other and you're unwittingly falling into their game.

So I'm guessing this isn't really about the tickets. You have lots of anger at your parents for some of the reasons you listed

Book your own tickets and go

It doesn’t really matter if she did or didn’t. Your dad is controlling and your mum enables it and is rude about you your dh and your dc. That’s enough to limit your relationship with them a bit and take some time to think

But your dad doesn't have to book the tickets. You can book yours and tell your Mum she's welcome to come if she wants to.
This is one of those situations where everyone in the family is playing some game, but any player can put down their cards and stop whenever they want. Be the one!

Thanks for sharing that! Sorry you went through that. It could be that. It’s hard to know. It’s just really negatively impacting me and I’ve noticed my oldest child. She’s getting anxious.

I’m so stressed about this impacting the kids! My mum wasn’t like this when I was a teenager but had become more and more controlling the older she’s getting. I keep telling her about she raised me and she can’t keep smothering the kids. She keeps saying the world is different now.

Hard agree. It's awful that their behaviour is already making your DC anxious. Take those steps so you can nip it in the bud and get therapy for yourself too if possible to work through all of this and get the perspective and strategies/tools you need to deal with it and not get sucked into feeling guilty or beholden to them. You sound like you know the score but that it gets distorted because you're so close to them and they have such influence over your daily life. The more distance and independence you can get the better for you and your DC.

That’s awful! So sorry that you went through that! Why do people do that? Are they aware how awful that is to do to any person let alone your own child. How do they justify it? How do they live with themselves… I just don’t get how you could live with yourself at the end of the day. I wonder if those people ever wonder if they are a good person.