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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Helping year 3 child reach greater depth

71 replies

MrsMrsMrs12 · 13/03/2025 17:15

My year 3 child is currently ARE in all subjects. I think she is very capable of greater depth but she is in a very hectic classroom with lots of SEN and is, I think quite invisible - she is quiet and gets on.
can anyone recommend any apps or ideas for fun activities that could help her stretch to GDS? I would prefer not to get a tutor but would look into this if needed.
thank you

OP posts:
tantricyogababynameste · 13/03/2025 17:16

What's your AIBU?

AllFours · 13/03/2025 17:17

She’s 3. Yes, you’re being unreasonable.

NeverDropYourMooncup · 13/03/2025 17:18

Why does she 'need' to be at greater depth already?

JillAndJenTheFlowerpotMen · 13/03/2025 17:18

Books. Times Tables songs in the car. Pocket money to learn to budget. Go to museums. Watch Newsround. All the sensible stuff: an app isn’t going to do this for you.

AllFours · 13/03/2025 17:19

Whoops, I mis-read your post. 😅 Sorry.

@JillAndJenTheFlowerpotMen offered some good suggestions.

TwattyMcFuckFace · 13/03/2025 17:20

What do 'ARE' and 'GDS' mean please?

TeacherHatOn · 13/03/2025 20:44

With regards to writing, the most important thing is reading a wide range of texts - both fiction and non-fiction. You've essentially got to write like a published author to be GD in Y6. The best writers I've taught have developed their voice through extensive reading and writing practise. The primary curriculum encourages writing to be far too flowery for the sake of it - a GD writer will be balanced and selective. Read together and have deeper discussions around the text. Highlight the vocabulary, punctuation and the way things are written to make a certain impact. Give her the tools and encourage her to write her own stories/texts.

With regards to reading - obviously the above will be helpful for this too. Again, discussions when you're reading together - what the book is about, what do you think the character is feeling, what could happen next. Look up KS2 or Y3 reading prompts or comprehension questions if needed. Try to make the questioning natural rather than a test, this can take all the fun out of it.

Maths - knowing her times tables inside out will unlock so much of the curriculum. Practise problem solving and reasoning style questions and answers. She will need to have a complete understanding of each learning objective and be able to justify, show and prove her thinking in a number of ways. Consider whether she can explain the concept in different ways, using abstract, pictorial and concrete resources. I like to get my GD children to plan a lesson and teach me a certain concept - this usually highlights the misconceptions I need to teach them to get them to the next level.

Revision books are good but the subject knowledge of the adult helping her will be the most important thing. It's also really important to not push her too far and take the magic out of learning. Always aim to peak curiosity in your approach rather than just asking test-style questions and teaching with memorisation as the goal. I use a lot of 'I wonder what the author is thinking' and 'how can we find this out'. Create a curious learner and set her up with the skills to research herself. Create an environment at home that can help with this too - times table posters in the toilet have been a success in my house.

I'm sure there is more to it but hopefully some of those ideas will help. I want to add that it is also a really amazing achievement to be working at ARE, the curriculum is tough.

Soontobe60 · 13/03/2025 20:48

Good ideas from @TeacherHatOn if you are a teacher, not so easy to implement completely as a parent after a full day at school!
I’d as her teacher what her scaled scores are on her last assessments. ARE is a very broad band.

Oioisavaloy27 · 13/03/2025 20:49

She is 3 years old what is wrong with.you?

Creamsnackered · 13/03/2025 20:51

TeacherHatOn · 13/03/2025 20:44

With regards to writing, the most important thing is reading a wide range of texts - both fiction and non-fiction. You've essentially got to write like a published author to be GD in Y6. The best writers I've taught have developed their voice through extensive reading and writing practise. The primary curriculum encourages writing to be far too flowery for the sake of it - a GD writer will be balanced and selective. Read together and have deeper discussions around the text. Highlight the vocabulary, punctuation and the way things are written to make a certain impact. Give her the tools and encourage her to write her own stories/texts.

With regards to reading - obviously the above will be helpful for this too. Again, discussions when you're reading together - what the book is about, what do you think the character is feeling, what could happen next. Look up KS2 or Y3 reading prompts or comprehension questions if needed. Try to make the questioning natural rather than a test, this can take all the fun out of it.

Maths - knowing her times tables inside out will unlock so much of the curriculum. Practise problem solving and reasoning style questions and answers. She will need to have a complete understanding of each learning objective and be able to justify, show and prove her thinking in a number of ways. Consider whether she can explain the concept in different ways, using abstract, pictorial and concrete resources. I like to get my GD children to plan a lesson and teach me a certain concept - this usually highlights the misconceptions I need to teach them to get them to the next level.

Revision books are good but the subject knowledge of the adult helping her will be the most important thing. It's also really important to not push her too far and take the magic out of learning. Always aim to peak curiosity in your approach rather than just asking test-style questions and teaching with memorisation as the goal. I use a lot of 'I wonder what the author is thinking' and 'how can we find this out'. Create a curious learner and set her up with the skills to research herself. Create an environment at home that can help with this too - times table posters in the toilet have been a success in my house.

I'm sure there is more to it but hopefully some of those ideas will help. I want to add that it is also a really amazing achievement to be working at ARE, the curriculum is tough.

As a Y3 teacher, I think this pretty much covers everything. A really excellent post.

The best readers and writers every year are simply the really, really avid readers. They are also generally children who have been read to daily from very little.

In terms of 'making the grade', maths comes down to the formal written methods for multiplication, division and subtraction, times tables (2s, 3s, 4s, 5s, 8s, 10s) and fractions. As with Y6 SATS, if you can smash the arithmetic side of things then you can often achieve GD.

BraOffPjsOn · 13/03/2025 20:52

With writing, it’s so difficult now to get GD - lots of exposure to high quality texts so they’re immersed in the language and use it within their writing. It’s now a common thought that you can’t teach greater depth.

Maths - they need to be fluent and have mastered everything for their age. They need to be able to use reasoning skills to explain the maths and solve two step problems. Being proficient in all areas of maths too.

Reading - check out vipers - as well as being fluent and expressive. comprehension questions and skin reading to answer them is a good skill to practice too.

Being good at tests can also help to show teachers they’re secure (unfortunately) for reading and maths.

My son (y2) is GD in maths but has always been insane (and intense) at maths since he was 2. I know he is autistic (lots of things but learning is his intense focus so managing at the moment)

I’m a teacher and sadly the curriculum is so much harder and GD is not the above age related it used to be so it’s so hard to achieve now. Expected or age related is amazing!

Candledrip · 13/03/2025 20:56

An app isn’t going to do this for you. Therein lies the problem no doubt

Dramatic · 13/03/2025 20:57

BraOffPjsOn · 13/03/2025 20:52

With writing, it’s so difficult now to get GD - lots of exposure to high quality texts so they’re immersed in the language and use it within their writing. It’s now a common thought that you can’t teach greater depth.

Maths - they need to be fluent and have mastered everything for their age. They need to be able to use reasoning skills to explain the maths and solve two step problems. Being proficient in all areas of maths too.

Reading - check out vipers - as well as being fluent and expressive. comprehension questions and skin reading to answer them is a good skill to practice too.

Being good at tests can also help to show teachers they’re secure (unfortunately) for reading and maths.

My son (y2) is GD in maths but has always been insane (and intense) at maths since he was 2. I know he is autistic (lots of things but learning is his intense focus so managing at the moment)

I’m a teacher and sadly the curriculum is so much harder and GD is not the above age related it used to be so it’s so hard to achieve now. Expected or age related is amazing!

Is expected and age related the same thing?

BraOffPjsOn · 13/03/2025 20:59

Dramatic · 13/03/2025 20:57

Is expected and age related the same thing?

Yes - different schools/assessment programs call it slightly differently.

i have some writers in my class who would definitely have been above in previous times and now were calling it GD potential and told not to put them as GD and leave it until they’re in y6.
Just a very sad situation as the kids work so hard.

Dramatic · 13/03/2025 21:03

BraOffPjsOn · 13/03/2025 20:59

Yes - different schools/assessment programs call it slightly differently.

i have some writers in my class who would definitely have been above in previous times and now were calling it GD potential and told not to put them as GD and leave it until they’re in y6.
Just a very sad situation as the kids work so hard.

Oh what a strange system! My eldest is 17 and I have to say her school reports were much easier to read than my younger kids, it's as if the teachers (or the system) don't want to actually tell you how your child is really doing.

howsthehair · 13/03/2025 21:04

@TeacherHatOn - what a really thoughtful and in depth response, that's really kind of you (and useful for me!)

TeacherHatOn · 13/03/2025 21:17

howsthehair · 13/03/2025 21:04

@TeacherHatOn - what a really thoughtful and in depth response, that's really kind of you (and useful for me!)

So glad it was helpful - happy to help!

Pickupapen · 13/03/2025 21:18

TwattyMcFuckFace · 13/03/2025 17:20

What do 'ARE' and 'GDS' mean please?

I have a year 3 child and would also like to understand this please!

dillydally321 · 13/03/2025 21:19

@TeacherHatOn thank you so much for your helpful post, much appreciated here!

Littlefish · 13/03/2025 21:19

Oioisavaloy27 · 13/03/2025 20:49

She is 3 years old what is wrong with.you?

No she's not. She's in Year 3. It says it in the OP.

surreygirl1987 · 13/03/2025 21:19

MrsMrsMrs12 · 13/03/2025 17:15

My year 3 child is currently ARE in all subjects. I think she is very capable of greater depth but she is in a very hectic classroom with lots of SEN and is, I think quite invisible - she is quiet and gets on.
can anyone recommend any apps or ideas for fun activities that could help her stretch to GDS? I would prefer not to get a tutor but would look into this if needed.
thank you

Are you actually blaming the SEN kids for her not getting greater depth?!

Just FYI my son is working at greater depth in most areas and has SEN (autistic and ADHD) - he's one of the top two students in the year (in fact, the other student has SEN too).

Porcuine20 · 13/03/2025 21:27

This might be a cynical view, but fewer ‘greater depth’ grades seem to be given in year 3 and 4 than in year 5 and 6, at least in my kids’ primary school, for the purposes of good data and showing added value and progression. Both of my kids have been ‘average’ in year 3 but largely ‘greater depth’ in year 6, when I wouldn’t say their ability has changed a huge amount. I think encouraging kids to read is one of the best things you can do.

BendingSpoons · 13/03/2025 21:33

Pickupapen · 13/03/2025 21:18

I have a year 3 child and would also like to understand this please!

ARE - Age related expectations i.e. where they should be for their age
GD - Greater depth i.e. ahead of where they are meant to be for their age

BraOffPjsOn · 13/03/2025 21:34

ARE is at age related expectation for their current age and year group.
GD is greater depth - so mastered and above ARE

Pickupapen · 13/03/2025 21:35

Thanks @BraOffPjsOn @BendingSpoons ! 😀