This UPF thing is irritating me

[SnowMoss]

I've never eaten much UPF, but it is getting harder and harder to avoid it. I don't go the whole 9 yards or anything, but try to keep myself informed and do my best to eat a healthy balanced diet.

Made a good effort to keep an eye on upf's, so for the past year have been sourcing good poultry, fish, and eating it with vegetables, etc. But I am bored out of my mind at this point! Just so fucking bored.

Then I hear about seed oils, so now even the small things that I added, such as mayo, gnocchi, the occasional flatbread (contains only sunflower oil, salt, wheat) are seen as a UPF too, due to the inclusion of sunflower or rapeseed oil. I am happy with and have the time to cook from scratch, but avoiding oils has basically taken a good whack at my time.
It's one thing trying to get people to eat a good diet, with veg and fruit and less processed meats, which will benefit their health, weight and wellbeing, but I am honest to god fed up of eating meat and a pile of veg, even if my own sauces and seasonings suffice.
And no, nothing substitutes for mayo! And no, I really don't want to make my own! I will make my own pesto, coleslaw, stuff like that, but I am bone bloody weary of avoidance.

Surely just being mindful is enough? I get that the food industry is an unregulated cesspit right now, but I am beginning to wonder just how awful it is, in moderation, to eat a some.
Sadly if I google any kind of additive or seed oil, I get lists of 'side effects' such as bloating, calcium loss and so on, it is so depressing.

If you are mindful of UPF's have you found a good balance?

Not what I said!

That’s for the reminder about the Yuka app. I looked up the apple pie.
Disodium diphosphate - now would you look at that…

Yeah. Rapeseed oil is in absolutely everything. You have to read the labels very carefully. I can’t work out whether I’ve fallen down a rabbit hole on the internet and it’s not that bad but I’d prefer it not to be everywhere.

I think the issue with it being in everything that we consume (that is shop bought) then the ratios of Omega 6 to Omega 3 gets out of whack.

I wish something could be done about all the shit companies put in food products. I know I can avoid and cook from scratch etc but I worry for my teens who don’t seem to care.

It just didn’t used to be like this when our parents were growing up.

But phosphorus occurs naturally in food too
Dairy, chicken, turkey
That's like saying you should avoid something that contains iron because too much iron is bad for you

When I take medication that increases my risk of cancer, it seems ridiculous to worry about the minuscule amount of an additive in an apple pie because it has phosphorus in
When I'm eating chicken which has it in anyway. That doesn't make sense to me

What does make sense is eating better
Plain crisps instead of Pringles
Plainer ice cream instead of low fat artificial stuff
Butter instead of margarine

But the once a year I eat apple pie I don't really care what's in it

Microplastics.

The Apple pie was just an example of how much a home made version is so much better than a shop bought one. The point is there are dangerous additives found in EVERYDAY food, food we are feeding to our children EVERY DAY.

I agree with you , I use the Yuka app a lot and actually find that a lot of Lidl’s products score much better than branded a few examples are their curry sauces in a jar, pasta sauces. , some cereals and breads. I avoid UPF’s as much as possible and use butter or olive oil when cooking but also eat mayo sometimes with seed oils

I’m not saying there is. Nor was I talking about “meat” but about animal fats - butter, tallow, lard. There’s a lot of data on the connection between animal fats and poorer health outcomes.

Does this mean I don’t eat butter? No, because it’s bloody lovely. Does it mean I don’t spread it half an inch think on my bread? Sadly, yes (most of the time, can’t say I’ve never done it).

The Op is concerned about UPFs. Almost certainly not all UPFs are equally bad/good. But if she’s worried about seed oils then moderation, or getting the more minimally processed ones - rather than switch to animal fats - may be the answer.

But sadly isn’t the answer all things in moderation - as it always is?

Many threads stating they kill their own cows? MANY..........?

Not threads but there was once woman on Come dine with me who named her cows and told the guests the name of the cow they are eating.
I grew up with animals for food and I found that weirdly disturbing. 🙈 Still kind of haunts me tbh

No, that would be unrealistic and life really is too short. You literally would have to spend half of your life searching for the right stuff. I do believe that companies ought to give us options at least. The majority won't bother to offer products now that aren't teeming with additives. I would just like more ....choice?

Today, at Tesco, I noticed they'd stopped selling their organic potato, tomato and rocket. I asked and was told that there wasn't much call for them. Same with chicken, the last time they sold organic at our store was 2022.
So a good deal of this is on the customer too - who seem to be, over all, choosing the crap. It isn't always more expensive to eat non upf.

I had mackerel, rice, peas, broccoli and roasted sprouts with a home made sauce and sesame seeds this evening. The lowest priced meal, all in all, in my cupboard rotation....it would cost far more to buy in decent ready meals, whereas my rice and frozen veg are durable, and you can eat mackerel from a tin.
M&S do a lovely tin of Danish mackerel in olive oil for £1.20.

My DP likes ready meals, he buys several per week, and his shopping generally costs more.

And as I might have mentioned earlier, I live in a touristy area, a good bit of money floating around here (not mine, alas!), and people generally prefer junk. It isn't just about poverty or pricing, people just tend to love processed food (my DP is one of them, but he doesn't scoff at healthier choices).

I used to love reading food and recipe related articles at the Guardian, but became so bloody tired of the ongoing consensus that only poor people eat processed food. They may have to in most cases, but it isn't a given. There are many shoppers on a very tight budget know how to utilise cheap fruit and veg. We are not a food desert level just yet, unless you are stuck in the middle of, say, Shap, and have no vehicle.

I pretty much quit reading the Guardian after repeated claims that people who rent can't afford a microwave or know how to look at a cook book (I rent, I have a PhD, I have a reasonably decent income and a fucking microwave).

UPF to me are mostly beige foods. People seem to be calling anything not made from scratch UP!

Trying to avoid a large number of preservatives I sort of understand but the only thing I really try to avoid is palm oil or coconut oil because they are so full of saturated fat.

Under their guidance butter is UPF is you didn't make it yourself!

And to be honest, just eat the turkey dinosaurs, pork pies and scotch eggs. Just don't do it everyday.

(My dietician was more concerned about my low-fat croissant intake than whether I eat UPF...)

This isn’t correct.

UPFs are not ‘anything not made from scratch’. They are a specific set of (mostly) highly modified, industrially produced ingredients you would be hard pressed to replicate at home.

If your dietician was trying to get you to lose weight, they are looking for very specific things in what you eat to achieve that. That isn’t the same as people generally improving their diets by avoiding weird, unnatural chemicals used to bulk out or extend the shelf life of products.

Everything in moderation is a good mantra to live by, but as we edge closer (maybe) to trade deals with the US, a place where UPFs are far more prevalent and less well regulated, we need to make sure we don’t sleepwalk into accepting more in the foods available.

I did not actually say any of the things you are angry about. I said many people seem to feel UPFs are anything not made from scratch.

My dietician has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with weigh-loss.

I did comment that I avoid palm oil and coconut oil. I'm horrified that people believe plant-based is healthier without checking what's actually in their food.

I do find it's easy to get overwhelmed by the messages that seem to suggest anything in the world is now bad to eat!

I avoid upf as much as I can but I don't worry too much about seed oils.

I don't feel bored with my diet - I don't just eat meat and two veg. This week I've had roast chicken with all the trimmings, spaghetti bolognase, Chinese peanut pork with noodles, homemade pizza, and veg chilli with rice. I actually feel much more excited about food than before as so much is so much tastier.

There are definitely foods which I don't think are worth the faff of making myself. I either eat them anyway and don't worry whilst trying to get the highest quality version I can (eg baked beans, sausages, gnocchi, ice-cream), or avoid them.

(My dietician was more concerned about my low-fat croissant intake...

There's a reason for that...

Low fat croissants are a thing? What are they made with if not real butter?

I agree with this. I was really looking forward to asparagus season last year as I've been trying to eat more seasonal UK produce and NONE appeared in my supermarket.

Try making mayo with a stick blender honestly takes a few seconds and it’s delicious. But I doubt having some sunflower oil occasionally is that harmful. Existing entirely on packet food and deep fried junk is the problem.

'The book' says to aim for an 80:20 ratio - maybe save things like mayo for your 20%? I use mine on things like brown sauce/Worcester sauce/salad dressings and, well, sometimes I just need a chicken & mushroom pot noodle and a Tunnock's snowball!

Waitrose do a non-upf mayo. I'm not a fan (it's very eggy) but many people rave about it.

The seed oil argument is often an ARGUMENT on SM so I generally bow out of all that.

It sounds like you're making lots of positive changes, OP. Maybe focus on that, rather than feeling negative about the little things that aren't perfect?

Use your 20% and enjoy it!

Don't worry, it's the microplastics in the water that'll get you.

Orthorexia is a thing, not suggesting you have it but for some people the pursuit of perfection with health and food choices is likely to ironically cause them poor mental health. There is an awful lot of misinformation and over exaggerated nonsense on social media which needs a heavy dose of filtering but the seed oil thing is overblown. It is not in itself problematic it’s that it is in a lot of highly calorific but extremely palatable food making it very easy to overeat. If you’re following advice of people on social media just beware of anyone who talks in absolutes especially if they’re pushing diets and supplements. No food is inherently bad and we’d all be a lot healthier just following the basics such as sleeping well, eating a balanced diet, exercise more, socialising with friends, moving during the day and trying to reduce stress.

Water is toxic if you over consume it, it’s the dosage that is the poison in a lot of these chemicals not the chemical itself.

Have you used the Zoe app?