Its hard making friends as a single woman in your 30s

[tropicalroses]

There was a thread on here the other day about how many presents you receive. What struck me was the disparity between people with families who would then also maybe have 2 or 3 friends who were also close enough to be gift givers, versus the single women who didn't receive anything from children and partners, but also who don't have the close friends. I think some of it may be that as your friends hit the life stages of married and kids the single ones drift away.

BUT, there was also an article in the paper at the end of last year about how isolating country life can be when you're single. The author pointed out that being a single woman in her 40s made other women keep her at arms length to keep her away from their husbands. So they might meet for a coffee, but never be invited to a BBQ or round for dinner.

The comments under the article said many recognised this too. To me it seems hugely unkind- but since I read the article I do recognise it more and more. I moved to a new village recently and whilst I have my dog walking pals, any suggestion to deepen the friendships are batted away. I know its not because they don't like me- if they didn't then we wouldn't meet so regularly!!

I guess over the years I am starting to feel more lonely. And whilst my family would say get out there and do more and meet more people, those friendships never seem to go beyond the gym walls, or the dog walk. I really am starting to think as the article suggests that other women see you ask a walking risk.

Yep. If you're even vaguely attractive or slim then women won't want you around their husbands. Not because they dont like you but because they know what men are like when there's a single woman around.

She doesn’t really know you yet! How long have you lived there?

In our case, we left the village eight years after we’d arrived, and all sorts of people starting coming out of the woodwork and expressing apparently sincere shock and sorrow — I think they vaguely assumed we’d always be there (it was somewhere people seldom left, very static population) and that we could be very gradually befriended in the years ahead. Whereas I’ve moved around a fair bit, and am entirely used to arriving, unpacking, and looking around for people I like.

Re your singleness, yes, maybe that is the issue here, OP. It’s your ‘difference’, hilarious though that might sound. In my case my ‘difference’ was that I was a foreigner and a mother who had a career in a place where both of those were almost unheard of (something I only worked out later).

But would you really want to befriend people who think you not being married with 2.4 children is some kind of stigma? Or who think socialising is either sex-segregated or couples only, like some kind of depressing two-by-two Noah’s ark?

That’s what I realised a few years in in my village — I wasn’t their cup of tea, but people who think foreigners are strange/suspicious and that working mothers are doing something odd and wrong weren’t going to be people I wanted to spend time with either.

I’m not in the least suggesting villages are hotbeds of small-mindedness. I grew up in one that had loads of foreign residents leading fairly alternative lifestyles. But my experience in this village demonstrates that choosing to live somewhere with a limited number of people also limits the variety of people, and the variety of prejudices.

I’m not saying you need to find singles at all or that you need to live in some ghetto!

but is the issue that you want to find good friends? Or is it to be accepted in these groups of what sounds like narrow minded, ‘smug marrieds’ ?

If it’s the latter, then you are on to a losing battle. You can’t change people. Even if they are nice friendly people, people seem to disappear from social things with young kids. So your pool of people who want to go out on a Saturday night is already small.

but if you want to find new friends, then you need to look for people who have the mindset for it. That is usually single people.

I’ve been single/married/divorced/single/ltr/single/ltr

so i know where you’re coming from. While I’m happy I. My relationship, I know it makes me socially lazier. All my friends have come from the times when I was single.

or you could make yourself look as unattractive as possible in the hope they see you as no threat!

And yes to this. The only behaviours you can control are your own.

In our case, having given it a number of years doing all the right things (getting involved in local stuff, running the pre-schooler group and later helping with the PTA and village fete, , inviting people over, attempting to join the book group (which said it was full) etc), we decided to leave, and tbh, if it weren’t for the fact that the place had given DS a gentle, safe place to be a small child in, we should have left sooner. Even though I made friends at work in the nearby city, being a pariah longterm where you live isn’t good for you.

And btw you are not crazy about the jealous wives- it’s definitely a thing. Either that or they think being single is some kind of disease they can catch!

or it’s just because they think couples can only socialise with other couples.

i saw your update about the woman not inviting you to the gathering- it’s pretty poor form, but also lots of people don’t like to mix friend groups ( I find this weird). Or other insecure types like to ‘gate keep’ events and social events because they are wankers.

I see most of my friends alone, whether they are single or not. I only have them over for a wine etc if DH is out. We have some ‘couple’ friends that we have the odd dinner with, and some friends with kids the same age as our DC who we have days out with, and the odd takeaway in the evening; but by and large, I see my friends alone and he sees his.

I think the remote location is more of an issue.

Also edit to say - I know this is probably unfair but in 40’s and peri with DC and work to juggle - I’m not really looking to make new friends - I don’t really have time to see the ones I have as it is. Daytime coffees on my day off are different.

People won't admit that you're right, OP, because they probably do the same and don't want to acknowledge it.

I'm a single parent and I know other mums in my village like me because they make an effort to speak to me, invite me to "mums nights" etc. But when it's an event at someone's home or something more couple-y I'm the only person in the group to not be invited. I'm sure it's nothing I've done wrong because I'm never flirty or pick-me-ish around men and apparently likeable enough when it's just women. They just don't want me around in that scenario for whatever reason.

It seems weirdly old fashioned and sexist but it is what it is.

@BeaAndBen of course, it’s not ‘all wives’. I wasn’t the jealous wife. I have friends who definitely aren’t the jealous wife type, but they do exist and I’d have never have believed until I saw it in action.

@Crichel and others really sum up village life. I grew up in a village. I’m still considered an outsider because my parents moved there from a big city when I was 4.

people see the pretty views, but forget it’s the people you are living with. The reality is that people who have lived in same place all their lives are already going to be Less keen on change. That means less open to new friends as well as experiences.

im not saying everyone in cities is amazing, but there’s just a lot more people to choose from. There are also more likely to be open to new things and more people are not from there so have a motivation to build new ties.

It's not about 'being right'. Will feeling 'right' while being friendless make OP happy?

Unless is OP is just fishing for affirmation and quotes for an article on 'bitchy village wives' of course...

Most of my friends are friends I've made since my divorce. Some are married, some have families and some are single. I don't live in a village though.

Yes, this. Obviously the OP is ‘right’ to be annoyed if she’s routinely omitted from social events purely because she’s single, but it’s not a situation she can do anything to alter, other than, say, hosting events at her own house with a mix of people — asking people she likes round for dinner. All she can do is change her mindset and enjoy what friendships are on offer, look for friends outside the village, or move away.

I think this is probably a good point, I’m single and childless and most of the new friends I have made in the last few years (mostly through work) and who are actually free to socialise regularly are either in their 40s/50s with children who are in their teens or older or are in their 20s and pre-kids.

I agree with this. A small village is not a good place to build a new friendship network. Being a single woman in your 30s can be difficult because people are generally coupled up and starting families and that can reset friendships but there will always be people who aren't. I was single for half my 30s and had a riot, because I surrounded myself with other like minded women who weren't married or with small children. But I wasn't in a small village, I was in London.

If, as you say, people are determined to exclude you because you're single (and I suspect a fair bit of that is your own paranoia as opposed to objective reality), you can do one of two things: either you move somewhere people are more open minded or you deliberately seek out people who are at a similar life stage to you and with similar interests and broaden your social circle.

But you can't sit around feeling sorry for yourself and paranoid about people having prejudices you think they have. You have to take control of the situation a bit.

My relationship, I know it makes me socially lazier. All my friends have come from the times when I was single.

I agree with this, @Namechangersanonymous

I also agree that I mostly socialise in sex-segregated ways. It’s not about being conservative or regressive. It’s just the older I get, the lower my tolerance for male bullshit. I vastly prefer the company of women.

It’s probably not them being unkind. I’m in my 30s, married with two DCs. I don’t have time to make friends with single people, which may sound ridiculous to you but it’s true. My friends are couples that both DH and I can socialize with together, couples with DCs similar ages to mine so we can socialize as a family, or mum friends with DCs that I can see on my day off work during the week with my toddler or in school holidays. A single person with no Dc just wouldn’t fit into my life, there’s just no time to fit in anything else or think about it really. Not me being unkind just very very busy.

It was a christmas party for our road. Another neighbour commented to me that it was a shame that I couldn't make it and I'd lived there over 6 months when it happened. I don't think next year I'll have anymore credibility from a longevity point of view. But it wasn't for a friendship group as such.

OK so this is the sort of attitude you need to get away from, frankly. What a narrow-minded way of looking at the world.

I'm also in a couple with a child and an extremely demanding job but I don't want to limit myself to only hanging around with other couples! Why would someone's 'fit' in your life be determined by their relationship status?

Maybe OP you do need to move back to a city!

This^ I love seeing my friends by themselves because I talk differently when it's just us than when their husband is there- even if I really like their other half it just still changes the dynamic. So I would rarely have seen my friends in the house or if they came to visit my ex would have taken himself to the gym or something. It was never a worry about my single friends being around him - if I thought that was a risk I'd have ditched them both because I don't keep people I can't trust around me.

And as a now single parent I've been meeting up with plenty of friends and actually more with their husbands and kids present because we moved so they've made a family day out of it. I've never been made to feel like I'd be eyeballing someone's husband.

Yes, exactly. I mean, without entering a tedious busyness Olympics, I have a child, a demanding career, a DH with a demanding job which involves him being away a lot on a regular basis, ageing parents who need frequent help, and am in the middle of a major house renovation while we are still living here (currently emptying all rooms on two floors at the back of the house, as steels need to be inserted when a wall is knocked) . It’s a lot, but it would never occur to me to limit my friends to the people who most easily ‘fit’ in my life. My friends are the people whose presence in my life I value, regardless of convenience.

Why do I need to get away from it? It’s my life, I have lots of friends, I don’t have to do anything. O have single friends but they have DC who my DC are friends with. I don’t know where someone who was single and has no DC would fit into my life right now, we’d be at different life stages and I don’t have time to socialise much without my DH or DCs there and when I do get a bit of time I’d much rather socialize with my existing friends.

I'm glad my friends with husbands and children do manage to see where a single childfree person can be part of their lives.

Yes - this is also true. I definitely prefer female company more as I get older. Women tend to be funnier, less belligerent and moany.

Not all men- I know a few notable exceptions to this. But the average man in the street is just a bit mansplainey for me now.

that is different though to actively excluding a woman from social things because she’s single and it’s being attended by couples. And I do think there are lots of people who do this- possibly for various reasons.

PP was clearly talking about OP needing to get away from attitudes like yours