PE teacher at dds school.

[Chickencuddle]

DD is in first year of high school. Last winter she had pneumonia quite badly and is still recovering. We are still having doctors visits and she's still on an inhaler (no previous asthma) She gets out of breath quicker than she used to and hasn't been able to do much in the way of physical exercise other than walking so has lost some of her fitness.
I wrote about it on her medical form and at start of year sent a note in explaining to PE staff.
Since then she has had a throat infection and chest infection and each time she has these they tend to hit her hard. So she had a few weeks with notes for PE
The PE teacher has been really unsupportive over it and a bit mean imo. She rolled her eyes first time it happened.second time she made her walk outside while others who were off PE that day got to stay inside. She also wouldn't allow her to go to the toilet during the hour and a half class and dd came home in tears saying teacher had been mean and she'd been bursting for the toilet and not allowed to go.
I phoned in and spoke to head of year who spoke to dd and said if any teacher says she can't go to tell them she has authority from head of year. That was OK.
Since then she has been off PE once with same thing just recovering from chest thing and PE teacher shouted at her and said if she's off one more time she will get a behaviour point.
Today I sent her in with a note saying that dd was going to try her best in PE but still struggling with her chest and could they allow her breaks when needed.
She said teacher rolled her eyes and muttered "same old." Then was nudging other teachers and she felt like they were talking about her.

I'm annoyed tbh. This is a child of 11 who had a terrible time last year with this. It took months to be even well enough to go for a walk and she's still struggling. She doesn't enjoy this. She hates it. And they are just making her feel worse. She has been off PE this year probably 4 times in total. But was off school once sick too. So missed 5 lessons.
Aibu?

Meeting needs to be with Head of Year as they know your DD and the background to this. Whether the PE teacher or Head of PE is there is less important as the HOY will inform them of what needs to be put in place.

Decide what outcome you want - possibly system involving a clear understanding of when DD can or cannot do PE, how that information is to be conveyed to the school and what DD is to do during sessions she can not take part in. Think also about break times; you can’t easily argue for missing a PE lesson if DD is a child who spends their break time running around or playing sport.

There is a DfE document called “Supporting Medical Conditions in School”. This lays out the responsibilities of schools and others. Download a copy and take it with you to the meeting.

If the Head of Year refuses to meet with you, or doesn’t make the changes required (putting in place a system so DD does not do PE when she is not well enough), or don’t keep to the system, then that is the point to make a complaint, following the school's complaints policy.

Don’t mention the eye-rolls and comments, you want a plan going forward not a discussion on what a particular teacher did or did not do. Ignore the posters telling you to be confrontational.

I'm a secondary school teacher.

Don't go in being confrontational or all guns blazing.

PE teachers are always having to deal with kids who are trying to get off sports. Their reality is that they are endlessly getting emails and notes and so on from parents saying X has a cold, X has their period, X has stubbed their toe, can they not do PE today, and it's a pain in the arse for them. A lot of kids are trying it on and it causes them a lot of admin and logistical difficulties sorting out the kids who are skiving from the ones who are genuinely unwell or injured. I wouldn't do their job!

Also, bear in mind that communication systems in many schools are shit. The PE teacher may not know your daughter has ongoing respiratory issues - you'll be surprised how much important stuff doesn't get recorded or circulated. In my school only people with certain admin rights can add notes about students' health or whatever to our internal systems, and if an email gets overlooked or someone doesn't have time to put the note on the system, then pretty vital information can end up not being circulated to staff. You also have to bear in mind that PE teachers don't get much time at their desks, so they can miss emails and so on due to being outside for much of the teaching day.

I wouldn't be having a meeting at this stage as there's nothing that's happened here other than eye rolls and muttering - which your daughter has assumed are about her but might not have been, so that's not fact - and the threat of a behaviour point, which may be down to the teacher not being made fully aware of the health issues.

I would send an email to the Head of PE and the PE teacher, with the HOY copied in, reminding them of your daughter's medical needs and the fact that she is currently off PE due to her chest, as per doctor's advice. I would then ask what the plan is for her during PE, given that you don't want her participating in practical lessons until she is cleared to do so by the doctor. I would also raise the behaviour point and say that your daughter is very upset to have been assumed to be bunking off, and that you would appreciate the PE teacher apologising and making it clear that there had been a misunderstanding next time she sees her.

Only if that email is not acted on would I escalate to requesting a meeting with the Head of PE and Head of Year.

She obviously thinks it's a case of a child with asthma just using it as a reason because they don't like the lesson (which likely happens a lot, I know my DD in year 8 has used it as an excuse for pe lessons she didnt like, but will happily join in and use her inhaler as needed when it's the sport she enjoys!)
I would send in copies of her consultant appointments and discharge summaries from when she was too unwell to even walk, I'm sure once she realises it was actually a disabling illness for months not just asthma she'll have a lot more understanding.

If you have a meeting, go in with a list of everything written down in bullet points of what you want to say. And then below that a list of what you want to happen

then if you get tangled (I know how you feel) just look down at your list and take a deep breath

if they try and deflect

well thats not the point
to bring you back to the topic at hand
if I could just reiterate that I want to know ..

then at the end, ask for their direct email addresses and say you will be sending an email that summarizes everything you discussed and agreed and you would be grateful if they would acknowledge receipt and confirm their agreement

That's appalling , as others have said definitely ask for a meeting - and needs to know this is unacceptable- I'd be furious

Fuckin bitch. Phone in the morning for a meeting.

I'm so angry on your child's behalf. Making her walk outside when everyone else got to stay in?

Nah, I'd be livid and boy would she know.

Kick up a huge fuss.

I’m sorry to say that in my capacity as a form teacher I have clashed with a PE teacher over a similar situation who sounds similar to the one you describe. Make a complaint.

Thanks everyone

This.

I realise that it varies very much from school to school, but in my LA parents are asked not to contact secondary school class teachers directly. (I'm a retired HoD.)

In my view, the HoY would be the appropriate contact given that there's a significant pastoral element here.

@WearyAuldWumman

I'm not sure when you retired or where you were teaching, but LAs don't really exist for secondary schools in England any more. The vast majority of secondaries are academies, and they make up their own rules.

I've been teaching for nearly 15 years and I've never worked in a school where parents couldn't (and weren't bloody well encouraged to!) contact class teachers directly with any issues. I'd love it if they didn't have my email, but that battle was lost a long time ago!

I would disagree on this being a HOY issue. It's a subject specific issue, really, as the health issues only impact on PE and its delivery. It's the Head of PE and the PE subject teacher who would be expected to work out what the OP's daughter is to do during PE lessons if she can't participate, and to set appropriate subject specific work for her to do. The HOY should only really be getting involved if an issue gets to the point where it can't be resolved within the academic department. So far from what the OP has said, the only meetings with school have been with the HOY and the Head of PE hasn't been involved at all. As a former HOD myself, I would have been pissed off if an issue had been raised about a member of my department and it had been taken to the HOY rather than allowing me to try to resolve it first.

Some PE teachers are a special brand of psycho. It's such a shame as it's really off putting to kids who could benefit from encouragement and gentle stamina building like couch25K to find their potential and make fitness fun.

One of my worst PE teachers got suspiended for making a child on crutches play basketball as they didn't have a note

I'm in Scotland.

In our authority, if a parent contacts a class teacher, the PTC (Principal Teacher Curriculum - HoD or Faculty Head equivalent) replies.

The OP has already been in contact with the HoY, so it would be appropriate to liaise with someone who knows the background and is aware of the health condition. Other schools might work differently, but in ours it would be usual for either the Year Head or the child's guidance teacher to send an email out to all teaching staff and classroom assistants where there's a particular health condition - even if difficulties are more likely to be encountered in one particular subject.

ETA I should imagine that the HoY will already have informed the HoD about the issue, given the previous phone call.

Further edit: In a situation like this, the HoY would have asked me to have a quiet word with the teacher involved in addition to sending out an email to staff.

We don't have numbers or emails or any contact information for any teachers. We can contact reception and ask to speak to a member of staff so far I've only spoke to her form tutor and head of year. I think you can ask for others though and then reception ask you what it's about and take a wee note. Then you get a call back when they've time.

Good God woman please ask for a meeting with HoY and say you are not happy.

I think you should get a doctors note. Pe is a part of the national curriculum so I can see why the teacher wants her to do it if at all possible (which of course it isn't at the moment). Bearing this in mind you do need a doctors note to put everything on a more formal footing.
It is normal for children excused PE to have to change and go outside and still be involved in the lesson in some way. If course some can't if they have a broken leg for example and that's probably why some of the others weren't made to.
Also it is normal to expect kids to not go to the toilet during lessons so I don't think the PE teacher is to blame for that either. And I don't think the HOY should be undermining her if that is school policy

@Chickencuddle Id be straight into the school to the head again

Refuse point blank for your dd to be in that class. Ask for your dd to be elsewhere for the force able. ( untill fully recovered )
State dd will also not be around that teacher .

As you can’t email, then phone and request a meeting with the HoY and Head of PE, together. Insist that they are both there. The reality is you can’t trust the HoY has communicated with the PE department - and so meeting with them both together will ensure that everyone is in the loop.

She can't do PE so the PE teacher is annoyed - it's not worth getting upset about.

I understand why you would think this as this is not normal. However. The reality is that sometimes children get sick. Really sick and have to come back to school as they are well enough to learn. Doesn't mean they are always well enough to do PE.
If we had stuck to you approach of staying off axhool until fully better she would have been off for over a year.
As it was she was off school for a few months and that was enough to really effect her.
I understand her situation isn't usual...which is why the approach for her may be different than it is for other children

I don't agree with children not being able to go to the toilet during lesson. When I went to school a girl wet herself. She never shook the humiliation and people still spoke about it for years after. Awful.
Also fine for her to be walking outside. But I expect the children off PE to be treated the same. The others were allowed to stay inside warm on a cold day. She had to go out and walk. She was treated differently for no apparent reason.

Sounds like a bully - taking out their own frustration and rage on a child. Not ok

Smeegal you edited your post so mine looks strange now. 😅 I was referring to your post pre edit.

You're right that her ongoing medical issues need her to be excused from physical activity in PE. However, it doesn't sound like her issues have anything to do with needing to be the only one allowed out of lessons to the toilet.

If this is school policy that they must stay in class (unless exempt for medical reasons) you want to be careful asking for special treatment she doesn't really medically need, as it makes it easier to dismiss her real issues.

My kids school is like this. Send an email to reception and ask for it to be forwarded to hoy. Ask for a response via email or letter. When they phone if you prefer in writing say I'm sorry I would rather communication in writing.

Completely different situation as my child was much younger and had autistic meltdowns. Teacher didn't understand and provoked him then hurt him physically restraining him. Locked him in a room alone crying for two hours. I didn't believe my child's story until a TA from the school told me in confidence she witnessed it I have to do something. Anyway I had multiple phone calls all full of lies and misinformation. Before I finally made an official complaint and regret not insisting on communicating in writing from the start.

That pe teacher isn't worried about continuing to bully your child when they know you have been in touch with school. I think they know they can get away with it as probably have picked other students to treat this way previously and not faced consequences. Keep everything in writing is my advice. Don't go in with official complaints strait away but don't be having verbal conversations. Follow up on meetings with an email summing up what was discussed and decided.