Page 20 | Teachers : what's the worst thing about the job now?

Floursacktabletop · 2025-02-22T20:31:02+00:00

I've name changed , but been here many years and teaching for 22 years. Dreading going back on Monday. For me , the worst bit is the increasingly poor behaviour of students and the continual parental complaints and allegations. Anyone else dreading it and fancy a solidarity thread?

FrippEnos · 23/02/2025 22:35

HeldBack · Today 19:01

A question. Are any teachers commenting here teaching in a private school? Because I imagine that there are parents there too with entitled attitudes? But obviously those schools don’t take that many kids with SEN or disability or from difficult home situations. Does that make a significant difference?

One of the main differences in private education is that the schools are pro exclusion and will get rid of not only pupils with issues but those that are not likely to achieve the required grades.

Pissoffyouall · 23/02/2025 22:38

Itsrainingatlast · 23/02/2025 06:58

I’m SLT in secondary.
I’m also the parent of a 15 year old with an EHCP (ASD/ADHD/PDA - all diagnosed by CAMHS).
For me, the worst two aspects of the job (and as a parent) are the ridiculous levels of accountability (to the MAT, to Ofsted, to parents); everything is completely results driven. This year, because the current Y11s didn’t do SATs (Covid) there is no P8 measure. So this year, we only give a shit about English and Maths results. Completely morally wrong. The kids know they only need 4s to get into 6th form (around where we live anyway - lots of schools/colleges competing for 6th formers) and tbh I agree. We test them at 16 in 8 or 9 subjects, on a 10 point scale. We don’t need this amount of information - I could tell you right now which Y11s will go to RG unis, which will go to other unis, which will go to college and which will be NEETs. Don’t need 2 sets of mocks and the actual exams to tell me that. And a bell curve distribution which means a third of them are guaranteed to fail.
Next week, one of my key tasks will be looking at the reorganisation of our SLT roles so they start to align better with the new proposed Ofsted framework. Not because this is what the school needs, but because this is what Ofsted will come in to measure.
Secondly, linked to the above, the complete inappropriateness of the curriculum. Gove’s obsession with the rote learning of facts. Exams are just a giant memory test. The destruction of the arts and vocational subjects.
My child is one of those SEN students who is just complete overwhelmed by school. Too noisy, too many rules for him to manage, a curriculum that doesn’t meet his needs. He can’t manage a full day, so has been told he needs to drop two of his options (that he likes and is doing ok in) but has got to carry on with science (which he loathes and will inevitably fail).
I genuinely think that with less obsession with outcomes, and a more appropriate curriculum, a lot of the behaviour and SEN needs would be much less of an issue. The pressure on teachers, and therefore on the students is the issue
for me, both as SLT and a parent.

There needs to be a ban on schools having a say onbwhat pupils should or shouldn't be taking/dropping.

FrippEnos · 23/02/2025 22:49

Pissoffyouall · 23/02/2025 22:38

There needs to be a ban on schools having a say onbwhat pupils should or shouldn't be taking/dropping.

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I disagree.
As I posted up thread pupils often show no interest in a subject, actively disrupt the lessons and in some cases are down right dangerous and shouldn't be allowed to take the subject.

I have no issue with pupils wanting to take a subject that they are interested in and actively participate, but a line needs to be drawn somewhere.

Mookie81 · 23/02/2025 22:53

mumda · 23/02/2025 13:09

Is there a country that does education well? Are there any aspects that could easily be put into place here?

How do you have less admin? What admin could be dropped instantly? What is essential?

How do you improve behaviour? If current offerings don't work, what would?

Marking. It's a waste of time. The children don't have time to read or action 'next steps' anyway.
Teachers ideally should be able to spend the lesson walking around the class talking to the pupils and sticking their initials on the work, with a symbol showing which bit of the task they addressed.
Of course, all the shitty behaviour and extra needs affect this happening, but the hours of marking different books are nonsense.

Pissoffyouall · 23/02/2025 23:04

ArseInTheCoOpWindow · 23/02/2025 08:02

I think it’s because schools are now so rigid and tough.

My daughter has Audhd. She just presents as quiet. When l started teaching in 96, children like her slipped under the radar. But there was no real pressure on them. So they were ok. It’s the pressure in school that’s bringing the number of special needs to the fore.

And Covid. Mine didn’t want to go back because she liked the quiet at home and said she’d got out of the habit of being with others. This was in Y10. Became an EBSA in Year 12 due to pressure.

l left teaching in 21. I taught textiles. I had 2 visually impaired kids in my class. Along with 10 others with SEND. I had no support. So if l sat with the VI kids ( health and safety) handing a piece of dangerous electrical equipment with a constantly moving needle which they couldn’t see, the rest of the ckass just rioted/ got bored/ stabbed each other with scissors. It was horrific. The stress was unreal.

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How sad. Do you know if it was the parents choice to educate in the mainstream setting?

Pissoffyouall · 23/02/2025 23:10

Shinyandnew1 · 23/02/2025 11:56

Lack of funding for SEND, so we have children who ten years ago would have never been expected to go anywhere near mainstream, now are dumped there, despite it not being what the parents/any professionals want, without 1:1 funding.

Dealing with KS1 pupils who are non verbal, in nappies and dysregulated in a large class of 30 is hard enough, but add in all the other pupil with needs (we have 7 children in one y2 class on pathways for diagnoses-all requiring endless forms for the staff to complete and adjustments parents want put in place) and it becomes unmanageable. Plus all the rest of the class who still have to all make continuous progress!

The curriculum is too vast and inflexible, Ofsted is ever-looming, stressful and career-ending and workload is through the roof. I don't know a single primary friend/colleague who isn't planning an exit strategy. Secondary friends seem happier somehow, I'm not sure why, though some of the behaviour they talk about sounds absolutely abysmal.

Sorry to hear. What is the extra workload generated for ofsted? Do you think ofsted outstanding schools are actually great for kids learning?

destiel00 · 23/02/2025 23:34

FrippEnos · 23/02/2025 22:35

HeldBack · Today 19:01

A question. Are any teachers commenting here teaching in a private school? Because I imagine that there are parents there too with entitled attitudes? But obviously those schools don’t take that many kids with SEN or disability or from difficult home situations. Does that make a significant difference?

One of the main differences in private education is that the schools are pro exclusion and will get rid of not only pupils with issues but those that are not likely to achieve the required grades.

Many don't do that until Y10/11. They are happy to take Cash until its results time!

destiel00 · 23/02/2025 23:39

This years Y11 cohort has been badly let down by the DfE.

They didn't do KS2 sats ,so schools have no idea what their MEG should be. Most of this Y11 have been labelled as MPAs when they really aren't.

As a pp said, it's all about maths and English now - so much so my Y11 dd has another set of English and maths mocks next week.

I'll be glad when my dc is done with education tbh.

The tories gove have destroyed any real love of learning, and the curriculum is SO dry. Even the best teachers struggle to make it interesting.

Pissoffyouall · 23/02/2025 23:45

destiel00 · 23/02/2025 23:39

This years Y11 cohort has been badly let down by the DfE.

They didn't do KS2 sats ,so schools have no idea what their MEG should be. Most of this Y11 have been labelled as MPAs when they really aren't.

As a pp said, it's all about maths and English now - so much so my Y11 dd has another set of English and maths mocks next week.

I'll be glad when my dc is done with education tbh.

The tories gove have destroyed any real love of learning, and the curriculum is SO dry. Even the best teachers struggle to make it interesting.

The tories gove have destroyed any real love of learning, and the curriculum is SO dry. Even the best teachers struggle to make it interesting.
/
In what way? Is it ridiculous stuff like doing times tables and fractions at 6 y.o. when they arent developmentally ready? knowing the full tables by heart aged 8/9 in y 4?
I can't remember starting to learn the first ones till after 9 back in the day of dinosaurs.

destiel00 · 23/02/2025 23:56

It's learning facts by rote now. But, more worryingly, the defunding of the arts. Also, the baffling science curriculum where pupils only do about 6 practicals in total for the whole gcse course (2/3 years)

It makes absolutely no sense (unless your own dc will never set foot in a state school and go to lovely private schools who don't have to follow the not fit for purpose National Curriculum gove)

By Y11, my experience is that pupils who have fallen behind (or who like the current Y11s) have huge knowledge gaps due to the covid lockdowns) just give up.

The content of subjects like history, or science is just too vast to ever catch up without natural talent in the subject or extra curricular tutoring.

I really think that this year's gcse grade boundaries will have to be pretty low 😕

FrippEnos · 23/02/2025 23:57

Pissoffyouall · 23/02/2025 23:45

The tories gove have destroyed any real love of learning, and the curriculum is SO dry. Even the best teachers struggle to make it interesting.
/
In what way? Is it ridiculous stuff like doing times tables and fractions at 6 y.o. when they arent developmentally ready? knowing the full tables by heart aged 8/9 in y 4?
I can't remember starting to learn the first ones till after 9 back in the day of dinosaurs.

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Gove took out most of the vocational subjects and streamlined them reducing them further.
He introduced more academic work even in the vocational subjects that remained.
He forced a requirement for lvl 4/5 math and science in to the subjects meaning that the higher grades are no longer based on skills shown but on academics instantly removing higher grades from 20% of the cohort and reducing what the subject should be for the rest.

FrippEnos · 23/02/2025 23:58

destiel00 · 23/02/2025 23:34

Many don't do that until Y10/11. They are happy to take Cash until its results time!

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Some don't but the threat of it is there.

Pissoffyouall · 24/02/2025 00:01

FrippEnos · 23/02/2025 22:49

I disagree.
As I posted up thread pupils often show no interest in a subject, actively disrupt the lessons and in some cases are down right dangerous and shouldn't be allowed to take the subject.

I have no issue with pupils wanting to take a subject that they are interested in and actively participate, but a line needs to be drawn somewhere.

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They ought to be excluded if they disrupt learning for others. They are welcome to fail the subject if they wish, on their own.
I can see the benefit of not letting someone do it if they showed no commitment before.

vipersnest1 · 24/02/2025 00:01

Has anyone mentioned the cheering word 'compliance' yet?
It caused such a reaction in my school that it was changed for consistency - but it still means compliance.

Dramatic · 24/02/2025 00:05

As a parent it's so depressing reading this thread, I'm sorry you all have to put up with this sort of environment. I have 5 kids and I think I've only ever emailed a teacher on two occasions, I would feel ridiculous emailing them over tiny little issues, and that's with two of them having SEN. Please know that there are still parents out there who appreciate what you all do.

LoztWorld · 24/02/2025 00:12

Teachers complaining about kids with SEND who wouldn’t be in mainstream 10 years ago… how bad is it?

My 3yo has moderate to severe intellectual disabilities. People with his health condition are almost always nonverbal, may not ever be toilet trained, and are intellectually similar to babies/toddlers even as adults.

My health visitor has said he’ll be unlikely to get a place in a special school and will probably need to go to mainstream.

Are there really children like this in mainstream school now? I’m terrified for him and have been hoping she’s wrong.

everychildmatters · 24/02/2025 00:18

@LoztWorld Unfortunately, yes and it is unfair on everyone. I'm a EOTAS tutor now after leaving mainstream class teaching after 20 years and it is wonderful to be able to work with those "lucky few" who are being funded by the LA to have some home tutoring.
I have just finished supporting a beautiful little girl who is of Reception age but completely non-verbal and with many additional needs. She has been allocated a place at a specialist provision for children with communication difficulties. I was delighted for her at first...until mum informs me she won't be able to start until Easter 2026. No schooling until then.
It's not OK.

PassingStranger · 24/02/2025 00:25

BookASpaceCadets · 22/02/2025 20:49

Parents.
They will blame school for every little problem they can actually think of.
Some things are so ridiculous you couldn’t make them up!

When there's no teachers left.
Parents will have to.home school. Then they will be moaning
Why don't they think before they give teachers a hard time.

LoztWorld · 24/02/2025 00:28

everychildmatters · 24/02/2025 00:18

@LoztWorld Unfortunately, yes and it is unfair on everyone. I'm a EOTAS tutor now after leaving mainstream class teaching after 20 years and it is wonderful to be able to work with those "lucky few" who are being funded by the LA to have some home tutoring.
I have just finished supporting a beautiful little girl who is of Reception age but completely non-verbal and with many additional needs. She has been allocated a place at a specialist provision for children with communication difficulties. I was delighted for her at first...until mum informs me she won't be able to start until Easter 2026. No schooling until then.
It's not OK.

Thank you for replying. This is awful. That poor little girl. The state is just completely ignoring its duty to provide for all children then. How is this happening in a rich country in the 21stC?!

I don’t know how we will cope if he has to go to mainstream or be tutored at home. The former would be utterly unsuitable. It would just be a complete farce and so far from the kind of education he needs. And the latter would likely require one or both of us giving up our jobs.

everychildmatters · 24/02/2025 00:38

@LoztWorld I'm so sorry you're in this position because you shouldn't be, and neither should your little boy.
He's very lucky to have a lovely mummy like you making the best decisions you can for him.
There's no easy answer or solution and you're right - the children I support at home have to have another adult present at all times for safeguarding (and this is usually a parent).
Do you get financial help with regards to his difficulties?

PassingStranger · 24/02/2025 00:44

blackbird77 · 23/02/2025 11:38

Yes we also have the same issues with work experience. So many local businesses now refusing to take on the Y10 students from the schools in our town due to bad experiences with students not turning up, behaving badly, not doing the work, talking to staff, superiors and customers inappropriately etc.

Not just work experience, for vocational placements too. So many mechanics, plumbers, construction firms sending back/failing or complaining about the apprenticeship or placement students we send them due to all the above.

It’s not even the case anymore that bright (but not academic) sparky and earnest kids who wanted to work with their hands and enter a vocation and do some hard graft are out there in large numbers for employers. The kids who don’t want to do academics don’t want to do any vocational or trade work either or any type of job at all apart from filming on their phones. There’s no pride or work ethic out there. My friend owns a painting and plastering company and hires school leavers. He said it’s utterly impossible to leave recent ones unsupervised to do even the most basic tasks as they do no work, on phones constantly, show up late or not at all and cannot interact with the public professionally. He said it is a world apart from the stock of school-leavers he hired for the same role two decades ago.

How sad.
Phones definitely have a downside. This is proof.

PassingStranger · 24/02/2025 00:54

Threeandahalf · 22/02/2025 21:32

Behaviour
Parent contact which is more often than not delivered with threat of complaint.
I am a Head of Year. I rang a parent day before the holiday to say their child told me to fuck off. Parent said 'do you have any proof'

👍🏼

Years ago parent would have believed you and had it out with their child.
Why would you make that up?

PassingStranger · 24/02/2025 01:23

Itdoesntmatteranyway · 22/02/2025 23:47

And you can report the post, I don’t care, you can still fuck off

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When you are complaining about children swearing remember alot of adults are also unecessarily swearing too.
Children learn it from somewhere.

oakleaffy · 24/02/2025 01:26

SquashedSquid · 23/02/2025 01:36

Isn't it just? I spend a huge chunk of my own salary on essentials like pencils, resources and glue sticks.

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That's so sad...back in the 1970's mum {a teacher} said the Stationery cupboards were filled with boxes of aromatic cedar pencils, lovely exercise books, boxes of pritt sticks and cow gum and copydex and rolls of sugar paper and paints, drawing pins and other goodies.

arcticpandas · 24/02/2025 07:21

Parent of 2 DC secondary school. One NT that teacher describe as polite, serious, hard-working. Other ND who is no fun to be around. He's polite and has never been rude to any adult ever (except his parents) but he's hard work for himself and for teachers. The thing is there is a lack of send schools: the ones around here cater to major cognitive dysfunctions whereas my son has a normal iq but his ocd and immaturity doesn't make him fit for mainstream. He repeats the same joke 20 times and laughs and he can't concentrate if he's not interested. He ought to be in a Send school but they won't take him because he's too intelligent...well no he really isn't no matter what the test scores say his theory of mind and executive fonctions are not those of a 15 year old. I have apologised to all teachers for him interrupting the class by making weird noises or flapping but I'm not there to soothe him and his 1:1 is a young, nice girl but who is not qualified to help him.

So I know it must be hell to teach when you got students who are not acting like students and who shouldn't be in your classroom but as a parent I have to tell him to go to school. Finally in September he can leave the school system and go into protected work scheme with other SEN teens. It will be better for everyone.