Would you pay more tax to boost defence spending

[trainermush]

Obviously we are now in a more precarious position & defence spending has been underfunded for some time. RR had just said we need to spend more money & she will but without breaking her fiscal rules,

"So we will stick to our fiscal rules. But recognising the priority of defence spending in the world that we live in today means that we will have to make difficult choices so that we can spend that money that is needed to keep our country safe."

Mulling it over & even though I think I pay enough tax I would pay more each month towards this (cut back in other areas) as opposed to labour cutting back on something else. I guess thinking about my dc & other loved ones has changed my mind somewhat now things appear more bleak. What do others think?
Conscription of young people terrifies me even though my dc are too young.

We are squeezed to death by taxes as it is, just over the threshold by a whisker into higher tax bracket, and living in the highest council tax county in Wales, we literally do not have any more to give.

We actually need proper grown up conversations about what we are prepared to pay for and what we aren't.

You first?

No because it wouldn't be spent sensibly.

It would be wasted on redesigning ceremonial uniforms or something equally vacuous

No, please don't spend my taxes killing people

Here is a breakdown of current spending. Brace yourself.

(it’s 2022-23 but I don’t think it would’ve varied wildly since then - more recent stats aren’t readily available)

Only the right sort of people though. Have a look at what the Russian soldiers have been up to. And then have a think whether you want money spent stopping them doing the same here.

If we all chip in £720 I reckon we can get rid of that 40bn black hole.

No I don't want to cut services but we are at the stage when we have to start having these conversations because we don't have enough income tax to fund them and all the vanity projects of politicians.
You can't say "increase spending in defence" without really looking at where that extra money comes from cos it means another area gets cut.

So how would you fund that increase?

I fully accept that I'm probably more willing to go without is because I have dc. I don't think solely cutting back on public services is the right solution tbh as my dc & I need education, healthcare, policing etc.

Too late! It's eating itself!

I already don't shop at Starbucks. There's nothing to stop the UK tightening its corporation tax requirements - co-operation with other countries didn't deter the US from enacting FATCA (for better or worse). Why should I, as a taxpayer, pay even more, when corporations which are sitting on billions are waxing fat off the labour of people in this country without contributing a fair share to our tax system?

The obvious answer is because taxpayers are easy targets. But the unpalatable truth is that there's only so hard you can squeeze before those taxpayers say "enough". Particularly when they are not only expected to fund a war, but offer up their children to staff the infantry to fight it...

The social contract is breaking down. Why the fuck should ordinary people have to pay - monetarily and with their children - to defend this country when it's being systematically asset stripped, in full view of the governing classes, so that there is nothing left in return?

I don't blame young people for not wanting to fight - why would they? What do they get in return - ridiculous levels of student debt, a white collar jobs recession and increasing lack of employment security because AI is going to take their jobs, an environment that's fucked, and no chance of being able to buy a house.

Can we get rid of 'other"

As usual, everyone will be in favour of more tax being paid - by someone else!

In reality, we ALL need to pay more tax and have done ever since covid, in fact ever since the 2008 crash. But voters won't vote for it. All they ever vote for is "someone else" paying more tax, i.e. the politics of envy which led to VAT on private school fees, IHT on farmers, the employers NIC hike, etc.

A few percent on income tax is what's needed, but voters won't go for it as it would hit everyone. In fact, to be absolutely "fair", a 1% rise in income tax, 1% rise on VAT, 1% rise on all other indirect taxes (fuel, air passenger, insurance premium tax, etc), 1% rise on capital gains tax, etc. The broader the net, the less affected individuals will be.

I don't want my tax money spent on killing anyone, Russians Ukrainians, or anyone.
War is not the answer.
If you feel so strongly about killing Russians, go and volunteer on the front

In which case seven months into a new parliament is the ideal time to increase income tax because nobody gets to vote for at least another four years.

@twistyizzy you have completely lost me now.

You can't say "increase spending in defence"

Rachel Reeves has said we will be doing that, hence my thread...

without really looking at where that extra money comes from cos it means another area gets cut.

Well yes, again have you read my OP?

So how would you fund that increase?

It's in my OP what I would do 😆

No I don't want to cut services

So what are you saying. You do want to cut services or not?

In fact, to be absolutely "fair", a 1% rise in income tax, 1% rise on VAT, 1% rise on all other indirect taxes (fuel, air passenger, insurance premium tax, etc), 1% rise on capital gains tax, etc. The broader the net, the less affected individuals will be

@taxguru I agree it would have to reach the vast majority to be acceptabl

Agree. People dont mind more tax as long as we are all in it together and that the tax is spent on the priorities of everyone not just interest groups or specific labour voting sectors at the cost of others. And a priority now must be the defence of all of us.

Yes, I would.

Sadly, I think we need to. We can't just make more and more cuts - the very last thing we need is austerity 2.0.

I guess we could borrow more, but that brings its own risks. Especially after the last government had to borrow so much to get us through the pandemic.

So tax is probably the best option. As a higher rate tax payer, I accept that those who have more will need to pay more. Those who are struggling to get by already won't be able to take much more of a hit.

I already don't shop at Starbucks.

Presumably the odd person does though?

other countries didn't deter the US from enacting FATCA

we aren't the US though.

And a priority now must be the defence of all of us

Absolutely

No. Absolutely not.

I agree. Labour should have realised by now that they've no chance of winning the next GE so they may as well finally do something worthwhile for the good of the country rather than sucking up to their union paymasters.

There's a lot of dead weight in the economy. Some towns in the north have well over half the employed population working in the public sector. That means over 50% of working people are living off the state.. and the public services are still pants. That's the sort of area where investment into defence industries should take place perhaps.

Get rid of triple lock. Means test all benefits properly.