Just been sacked for the first time ever after a funeral

[PrueD]

On Monday I was at a funeral and yesterday I was off on compassionate leave. When I returned today the director sacked me. Been there 9 months.

Before now, I hadn’t been made aware of any issues in my one to ones, the last one being a week and a half ago. I had told my manager a month ago about my terminally ill relative. It was harder to work at my usual capacity at this time but I was still doing a good job on important projects. The main problem I had was they kept piling on more work on top of existing work.

I said I would’ve liked the chance to address any issues and they said they don’t have capacity to support and that’s it. I’m in shock, having an awful week as it is.

@PrueD The trouble is, OP, that whilst it is unlawful to dismiss someone because they took compassionate leave, you had continuous service of less than 2 years so you don't have the legal right to bring an "unfair" dismissal claim UNLESS you've been primarily dismissed for a reason relating to a protected characteristic under the Equality Act 2010, i.e. discrimination, or been dismissed for a reason that's "automatically unfair". This link to the ACAS website gives more information on this: https://www.acas.org.uk/dismissals/unfair-dismissal The list of "automatically unfair" reasons doesn't appear to be exhaustive so it may be worth you speaking to ACAS just to double-check if your dismissal was for a reason which, under law, is considered to be "automatically unfair". (@DazedDragon "pregnancy or maternity leave" is an automatically unfair reason so you may have been able to bring a claim for automatically unfair dismissal even without 2 years' continuous service.)
Also, @PrueD does your contract of employment say anything about how bereavement will be handled by the company and/or reference a Bereavement Policy? If it does and they've breached the terms of your contract in this regard, you may be able to bring a claim for "wrongful" dismissal as all employees have this legal right from day one of their employment (instead of "unfair" dismissal, which, as I've previously explained, you have no legal right to bring with less than 2 years' service unless it's due to discrimination or an "automatically unfair" reason as detailed above). This link to the ACAS website gives more information on this: https://www.acas.org.uk/time-off-for-bereavement
I agree entirely @PrueD that they ended your employment because of your bereavement (which makes them utter bastards in my book!). They clearly cared more about wanting someone that was 100% focused on their job, regardless of what was going on in their private life, than showing basic human decency and giving you the support you need. It really beggars belief. However, it isn't whether their actions were morally wrong that would help you, but if they were legally wrong. Incidentally, if I were you I would definitely make a Subject Access Request (SAR) for your entire personnel file (it's free to request and they have to respond within one month). Your employer claimed they conducted "a thorough review of your performance and overall suitability for your role" so there should be a record of this in your personnel file. If there's no mention of this review then, whilst this is unlikely to help you legally, you will be able to tell people this is the reason they gave for dismissing you but you know it's a lie because you made a SAR and have seen your personnel file which makes no mention of it. 😉Good luck with whatever you do next OP and enjoy your get-together with your friend tomorrow.

I don't think there is much you can do under the current legislation although there has been talk of the 2 year rule being removed in the future. But such as it currently stands, here is the relevant ACAS link that will clarify your rights or otherwise:
https://www.acas.org.uk/dismissals/unfair-dismissal

If you conclude that they haven't acted illegally, there's no point in being awkaward about it; ask for a meeting with your manager or the HR Manager and request that you depart as a "good leaver" ie you remain until the end of the week for example and do a comprehensive handover in respect of what you were working on, they pay you up to date including any outstanding accrued holiday pay and maybe politely ask if they will pay your notice and provide a fair reference if needed. By being reasonable, mature and helpful with your departure, (what is known as a "good leaver"!) you may be able to negotiate some things in your favour and allow you to leave with your head held high.

And then put it down to experience and let it go.
Good luck!

There is a process. It just doesn’t apply here.

Hi op,

it is really tough. I would encourage you to not linger in the whys because evidently nothing serious/important happen. However, the work in itself isn’t all required from an employer’s perspective and it may be that it was just not a great fit on their side….doesn’t look like it was great from your perspective too.

I understand completely you being side blinded though. Not great. But they can’t really tell you… »sorry, we don’t like you so much »…

You will find something better. That you enjoy more!

Good luck op 🌺

This. Although you can't claim usually claim unfair dismissal unless there's been discrimination related to a protected characteristic, they still have to follow a proper process and it does not sound like they've done this at all. I believe it can be regarded as breach of contract.

There are also a set of "automatically unfair" reasons for dismissal that apply under 2 years.

https://www.davidsonmorris.com/unfair-dismissal-under-2-years/#elementor-toc__heading-anchor-1

I’m so sorry for your loss OP. These things happen in life. If you are proud of your work, you have nothing to be ashamed of. Don’t be embarrassed. Hold your head high.
I would keep the job on your C.V. I’d tell future employers and anyone who asks that you had some reservations about the management style and ethos of the company from the start but you stayed to complete X project successfully.
Finishing the project coincided with the death of the woman who mainly raised you and made you realise that you had more to offer and you weren’t the right fit for the company longer term.
Rather than stay and be miserable you took the brave decision to move on to something that suited your skill set better. It was a mutual decision and seemed like the fairest thing all round.
This is largely true. It is not casting blame. It makes you look professional and self aware.
You can easily survive a nine month job on your C.V. Just rehearse your answer to the inevitable question. I know lots of people who’ve decided quickly that a job isn’t for them and made a quick decision to leave. They’ve all gone on to better things and you will too.

Im so sorry you lost your gran.i understand totally, mine literally raised me too.:( so sorry you lost your job,that is not fair :( big hugs xxxxxx

I think you'll get a lot of advice about what you can do to argue this, but ultimately I doubt you want to work there anymore after this. Just checking they have given you notice and will pay you your notice, so hopefully at least 1 month money but you can go immediately? Did they even ask you to do a handover?

In terms of future employment, if asked at interview, just say it didn't work out there and wasn't a good cultural fit for you. I did 7 months at a company and I was miserable, I quit with nowhere to go, and to be honest future employers weren't that interested in why after I gave that flimsy answer about cultural fit. Sometimes these things just happen. In terms of reference for a new employer, your old employer HR will just say 'yes she worked here' - they never say anything more because they don't want to be held to it, so don't worry about references. You're also within your rights to post on LinkedIn that you're open to work and looking for a new role in x field, that will probably speed up your job search.
(all my advice is based on work experience in UK).

I'm sorry for the loss of your grandmother, I was devastated when I lost mine too.

My gut feeling is, they’re a terrible company & they did it cos you had time off, even tho it was legitimate & they approved it. My dad was a brilliant employee & the company loved him til he had an angina attack & needed a couple of weeks in hospital & then they got rid of him. I think you’re old company know exactly what they’re like & will probably welcome you back. If it’s possible in your sector, you should consider joining a union - they offer brilliant protection in circumstances like this. Or you could go for an unfair dismissal tribunal as they haven’t given you a chance to address their concerns or improve on any issues they had. Very best of luck whatever you decide 🤞🏽

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/work/dismissal/check-your-rights-if-youre-dismissed/

this will explain your rights

Don't be put put off by the fact you haven't worked at the company for 2 years and bringing an employment case againt them. I have recently gone through a Preliminary hearing and settled out of a court before the actual trial, for a company I only worked at for 3 months. Due to signing an agreement I can't go into detail, but my point being if you feel you were unfairly dismissed fight it. Even if that means representing yourself like I did.

Most companies won’t give a reference these days, they’ll just say you worked there from
x to y and your job was z. IME it’s rare they’ll actually say anything about your performance etc. they’re too scared of blowback/ lawsuits

Can't do a thing under 2 years

Unfortunately as you have been there less than 2 years, they can dismiss you for any reason. I was dismissed from a job after a few weeks once because my boss said there was no chemistry between us! I understand how you feel. It is hurtful and humiliating but in the big scheme of things, it's just a blip. You will find something else and can put it behind you

@PrueD Im so sorry to read this. Your ex employers sound like complete ass wipes and they don't deserve you.

Move on. Get a better job and rise above their BS. There is nothing you can do cos you've been there 9m.

Ref future employers, I wouldn't say anything unless asked. You enjoyed the job, the work was varied and you had successes. Focus on that.

Look for an interim contract in the meantime of finding a permanent role. Sign up with specialist recruiters in your field. You should find something that pays better reasonably quickly. You dont need to set up a limited company either, use an umbrella company to do your accounts etc it'll be cheaper until you decide what to do.

Re references, dont ask the company for a reference, although they can't say you've been sacked or anything about your performance its not worth running the risk because it sounds like they dont follow law/rules etc. Contact your boss on maternity leave, talk to her about what's happened. She'll probably be shocked and may offer you a reference. If not, would someone else you know in the company give you a reference? Im hoping there is someone you have a good relationship with who will do this.

Good luck x

I am so sorry this happened to you and I can understand why it’s shocked and upset you so much.

I work for a nice company and have seen several people leave but then come back after anything between 6 months and 2 years, in no time at all it’s as if they never left and if it is potentially of interest to you to approach your previous employer don’t worry about being seen as failing or that they may not be able to take you back. For that very brief period of awkwardness you may be back with a company you know and like ! Best of luck whatever you do

A couple of points here. 1) They cannot provide you with a bad reference. They should simply confirm your job title and dates of employment, which would be all I would also expect for a top performer with a decade of tenure. 2) You are one tiny dot in what will be a year of turmoil. There is a pattern of bosses of less than successful businesses behaving appallingly and this is inspiring a lot of movement in the job market, from people under 2 years of tenure being pushed out for spurious reasons, all the way up to long-tenured top talent that has had enough of the boss's nonsense. Your story is a common and believable one. You are not alone and will not stand out.

Then, if you do ask to return to your previous employer in a different role, there is no "backward stepping" if you frame your choice constructively. I know a number of people who had very successful second stints with an employer they had previously left. Two had "unfinished business", but others simply realised that they could have asked for a new challenge in their old company, instead of leaving to change things up - not an error, but a mere misstep. You might have to withstand a bit of gentle ribbing, but if you take it in good part, you'll soon settle back in.

Hi all, I phoned ACAS. They confirmed I can’t go for unfair dismissal as I’ve been there less than 2 years,

They said I could appeal ( I won’t) or raise a grievance. I can’t stand that they are just getting away with this so it is tempting. She recommended asking for details on this ‘thorough review of performance’ and also thought there may be something in their timing re compassionate leave.

But I don’t want to spend all my time on a grievance as well as the job search etc. But maybe that’s what employers like this rely on. It’s horrible feeling powerless.

D’you know what, at least they confirmed it wasn’t you it’s them & I think this will be apparent to anyone who knows about it.
They sound absolutely despicable & no one could survive there in such a toxic environment long term. They probs have a very high staff turnover 🚩 and in the long run it will be a blessing that you’re not there anymore.

I wouldn't waste time on a grievance and just concentrate on your job search. Once you've secured a new job then you can refocus your efforts on a grievance if you can be bothered at that point.

I would take it further, my employer has a personal improvement plan.
Sorry for your loss

Speak to your union or seek legal advise

Were you still in your probation period?
if not then I think sacking without written warning is only allowable in the case of gross misconduct.

I think the issue is that the contract says performance issues will first be dealt with informally and then they ‘reserve the right’ to start a performance plan etc.

The advice was that if the contract says they ‘would’ start a formal plan they have to follow that, but they didn’t and the contract is written carefully to avoid nailing themselves down.