To think it is long overdue that we brought in dog licencing

[Eurghh]

This is not a dog-bashing thread.

Dog poo is a massive issue in the UK - I agree some areas are worse than others, but i have lived in various places, holidayed all over, and it really is pretty bad pretty much everywhere. This country is already on its knees with paying for services out of the public fund, but SOMETHING has to be done about the huge number of people who let their dogs mess on the ground for the rest of us to contend with.

I think we need to bring back licences, which will pay for:

• dog wardens to regularly patrol problem areas, and issue fines
• a nightly hose down of pavements in problem areas and also all around pavements leading to schools
• cctv to identify people who don't pick up after their dogs
• dna database

All of this needs to be funded by dog licences.

YABU - the system is fine as it is
YANBU - please bring in licences for dog owners

Atttached to show a photo I took today which prompted me to write this, this quantity of poo is common round here, and I live in a naice well-to-do London borough.

@Eurghh here, have a Thursday afternoon drink:

So it's already happening in NI. Didn't know that.

Australia has a dog licensing law in effect too that is issued by local government. So definitely viable and actually happening in other countries.

England is definitely behind the curve on this issue.

YABU it never work. The cost of wardens etc (plus the cost of collecting the license fees) would be far, far more than the licences would raise, unless you make them a silly price of £1000 or so a year.

The old dog licences were abolished because they cost more to collect than they brought in.

Info about the old dog licenses here -

https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/RP98-6/RP98-6.pdf

its awful here too voluntary groups go round cleaning up which they should not have to
the litter bins are overflowing and why people use a pooh bag then throw it in trees I do not know
we have not got a dog warden here they tend to just put you through to another dept and its just going on the pile of jobs to do
trouble is people like the police are stretched as it is and though they are supposed to have community police for anti social behaviour they are so busy backing up the police on the bad crimes like muggings rape etc
I do not think a licence could reasonably be enforced there would have to be a warden or similar to check even if on a computer so again would not have much time for checking on dog pooh culprits.
when we had a licence for our dog bit like radio licence's did not do much at all

That paper is 27 years old.

Think it's time for a revisit. World has moved on...a lot.

"Easily enforceable"? Like how it's the law to tax, insure and MOT a car AND have a valid licence? Are you aware of the statistics on just how many are not complying with that?

It has always been the case in NI as far back as I remember.
Not sure how it is policed, legal requirement to have a dog chipped so maybe that information is shared with council. Our pup is 10 years old so cant remember whether we done it ourselves or were contacted by council after first visit to vets to update chip/ injections..

£1 a month wouldn't cover much, I'm surprised they still bother it must cost that to process the licences!

If you're over 65 one dog is free and any additional ones are only £5. A bargain.

https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/dog-licensing-and-microchipping

Exactly, most people still didn’t bother getting a license and nothing happened.

I’m a dog owner, see all the issues you do where I live (but don’t contribute to them) and don’t disagree with the idea of licences.

However the sort of people causing the issues we’re seeing aren’t going to abide by having a licence either.

If I paid a license fee to the local council then I would be paying for them to clean up dog shit left by irresponsible owners as I already clean up my dogs mess. Sometimes other people’s dog mess too if, for eg, it’s near the local school. I’m also paying towards local schools but don’t avail myself of those services. The same as many other people. We all pay a lot of council tax for all the services so why should dog owners be singled out for extra payments. I’d pay a licence fee but reluctantly as the crap owners won’t bother.
If cctv is used to spit and fine the crap dog owners then it should also be used for fining litter leavers and vomiters etc. it will never work, just an extra tax to those of us contributing loads to the economy.

There's just no way of enforcing it. Microchips have been the law for years and less than 20% dogs picked up as strays are reported to be chipped.

I frequently see evidence of other illegal practices eg cropping and docking on the streets which aren't enforced although they are visible

The reason it works on cars is because you have to have your car on the road to use it. Even if somehow you had a microchip scanner on every lamp post in the country, it wouldn't register the absence of something, and then people would walk their dogs in the countryside

The real problem owners already have "off grid" dogs that are rarely registered at things like vets, born in dodgy conditions with no form of registration.

I'd be reluctant to support anything that made people less likely to take dogs to the vets, or to walk them/train them.

YANBU. A series of dirty fuckers have left poo outside our gate to the right, left and straight ahead – getting the pram out onto the pavement without going through poo is like a Crystal Maze challenge.

There’s also a wanker who clearly thinks the gutter is a better place for poo than the pavement, like they’re generously keeping it away from foot traffic. Except no one has driveways and we all need to step between cars in the dark when parking up or setting off, so it’s just a new and unpleasant place to leave poo. Plus the cars all drive through it and smear the whole road.

I’m constantly outraged and exhausted by it all because it’s clearly more than one owner, so there are multiple dirty bastards who think this is OK.

How many dogs do you think see a vet? Lots of people don't take dogs regularly and you don't want to stop dogs in pain getting emergency care

Lack of vet care and encouraging people to keep out of dogs out of exercise spaces, training groups etc is a surefire way to increase dog bite rates

I voted YANBU because I agree with you. However I don't think it's doable atm with the issues around police and cost etc.

Was out with my dog the other day and cleaning up after her, only to turn the corner and step in someone else's dog poo 😑

Where I grew up, there was an imperative to have a dog licence as a dog owner with binding terms and conditions for dog-ownership. All dogs had to wear an easily observed metal tax disc on their collar when out, engraved with their personal dog ID number. There were different licencing categories such as working dogs (working sheep dogs or guard dogs on farms etc), registered hunting dogs (for annual elk culls) and ordinary pet dogs.
Dog tax was paid annually by owners to the municipality. People took it seriously and complied, but then that's Scandinavia for you.

So this dog licence fee, which if we go by NI rules, is £12 a year and excludes certain groups of owners like over 65s, is meant to pay for:

Wages for all staff involved (admin, crew, management etc)
Machinery and equipment
A DNA database and upkeep
DNA testing
All fees associated like insurance cover, court fees etc
The gigantic water bill it would produce

I don't think it's really going to touch the sides is it.

I doubt dog license fees would pay for the cleanup, and leaving that job to local govt sanitary workers would mean people took even less personal responsibility than they do currently.

What you need is stringently enforced leash and fouling laws. I live in a community in the US where it is illegal to let your dog off leash and people show and shame photos of people walking away from their dogs' poop, on community FB pages. It's a densely populated place, and there are multitudes of dogs. It would be unliveable if people didn't clean up after them.

You shouldn't accept poor policing. It ultimately causes people to vote for extremist parties.

License could be linked to cheaper pet insurance or vet services? It could be a condition of dog breeders to check before a puppy sale? Sure not everyone would get one but 50% would be a good start

I think this would be an enormously valuable investment in everyone's health and wellbeing. Once the dog DNA database is set up, the fines for dog fouling would need to be large enough to pay for enforcement. Which they should be, because there is absolutely no valid excuse.

So because something didn't work before, it can't work now - and now, we have vast technological advances that really could help us tackle this problem if we wanted to. What a defeatist attitude.

I do agree that it's completely horrid though and that there should be some way of regulating it closer (but just have any idea of how you would)

My dog for example is very traceable. She's chipped, she's registered at a vet, has a pet passport, adoption certificate from a charity, she's insured, walked very publicly, she's a regular at dog training classes and sports. She's even got one of those dog dna tests!

However she was born in cupboard, her parents are siblings, the owners didn't know how many dogs they had because the breeding was so rampant. They were giving them out to friends etc, all underage, unchipped, no form of vet oversight. They were already breeching how many dogs they were allowed in the property, not getting the dogs adequate medical treatment etc but had never been prosecuted. Some of the adult dogs were clearly neglected but still walked in public.

Eventually one of the owners ended up having an ambulance called and the whole sorry saga was uncovered

There's thousands of dogs (and probably her siblings) that don't exist on any system at all.

And also - you have to get an annual municipal license for your dog, and show proof of your dog's vaccinations in order to get it, including (especially) rabies. The current cost of the license is $120 per dog. No more than two dogs are allowed per address.

You also have to buy an annual license for your cat, and show proof of vaccinations.

Dogs have to wear their collars with their metal tag at all times when out, and they have to be leashed.

There are (locked) municipal dog parks that are available only to licensed dogs or guests of licensed dog owners.

The dog owners would pay it - they will pay whatever the fee is necessary to tackle this problem. We should have clean streets, not covered in dog poo.