To ask if you (also) just ignore your "required" days in the office?

[Everythingisnumbersnow]

I am supposed to do two days. But the office is a minging hotdesk box full of coughing weirdos and the toilets are smeared with shit by 910am.

I can't do my job well in the office so I just don't go. I do manage people and they seem to appreciate the flexibility (half go into the office sometimes, half never do, we perform well).

Anyway it's been a real eye opener for the power of low key just defying silly rules.

Anyone else?

(If they cracked down I'd go elsewhere)

My view is also you only push back on the stuff that really matters. 2/3 days of the week in the office is not hard and actually does bring personal and professional benefits. Save the head butting with management for the stuff that really matters.

Petty non compliance just makes you look lile a dick.

I agree.

I also think ignoring regulations isn't big and clever; it's petty and then they'll be the first person to moan if things are tightened up for everyone, because a few people not doing it spoil it for the majority who are doing as asked.

My dd who started working after lockdowns, is not very sociable. She's probably on the ASD spectrum and definitely struggles with people skills. Her firm lets them go in or not.
She's choosing to do about 2 days a week in the office because firstly she recognises that she does work better there, and secondly because she finds that she does want social contact. She has a lovely supportive team, and they tend to coordinate when they're in, which helps.
I would have thought that she would have been one of the "stay at home as much as possible" crew.

There were toilet brushes there was no excuse just filthy people they also chose to come in early when the cleaner's were in and try to use the toilets/urinal while we were in there cleaning we downed tools and refused to clean the toilets again until it was sorted and it was changed to a two person clean for safety

That’s what’s happened to us. We’re 3/2 but because 40% of staff weren’t doing their 3 days in the office, they’re now punishing the whole company and mandating full time in the office for everyone.

It’s appalling that those of us who have done the right thing are now being penalised because others took the piss

Do you know which departments? Interested to see if they can enforce it

Can you not tell them you are in the middle of something and want to speak later? Thats imho totally acceptable.
Prearranged meetings, if its a chat of lets say 15 mins would drive me crazy. More so if it was remote.

Got a nasty feeling it isn't all made up and yes, it does confirm most people's worst suspicions.

Thats bad management to me. Sorry you were punished for someone elses behaviour.

Unfortunately I think media has painted office good, WFH bad. I don’t think it is that black and white. Box ticking often makes people dislike having to go to the office.

It seems that WFH equals lazy and shirking. Office equals hard working individuals. In my experience one of the laziest person I met normally only works in the office and dIdn’t use WFH days. Even though lowest level (I say this as they couldn’t pull the boss card) tried to get others to get them drinks and get things from across the room). I moved teams and wondered why phone seemed so busy. It was only when I went in the on my office day I saw they and others on team just ignoring so I ended up picking up calls. So going in the office does have uses. From what I saw working in the office in this instance meant doing as little as possible and buying dresses of Shein on your phone.

Unfortunately, I can confirm that some CS staff have disgusting habits. Even thought there are toilet brushes (grim but useful) not unusual to find toilets in grim state. Don’t know why grown adults can’t use a toilet without weeing over it. I go to two offices. One unisex and other gender specific. Not even like men can be blamed for poor aim. There are several notices such as not using sanitary bins as waste bins. The kitchen is covered in signs like don’t take food/drink that doesn’t belong to you. Tidy up after yourself. Place is still a tip, Dirty bowls in the sink. I think some (not all ) of the people that like come into the office and make a mess they don’t have to clear up. We have a cleaner at the end of the day, I think they are surprised when they see me clearing up if I spill anything etc.

My most productive days are at home. A side effect is if I am not careful I can end up working over. One the days I don’t commute I would probably work a bit extra. On my office days out the door at 5 as locked up. I try to work it office days used on doing the boring non concentration tasks. At the moment my job is just about ok. I am looking at other jobs but not seriously. I had seen better paid jobs that are solely office based. Weigh up pros and cons and decided being able to WFH some days worth staying where I am. If we suddenly had to go to the office five days i would seriously be putting the effort in to get another job. Even if it was office based.

Lazy people should be pulled up whether in office or home. If colleagues doing x and someone only doing half unless there is a good reason surely that is what you look at. Not punishing the hardworking people who are capable of working at home.

I think while some jobs can be done at home they may be some more suited to at least some days in the office. It is is box ticking that gets me. I am told I have to come in X days so I do. Just don’t think it is the best way to get best out of employees. I think it is going to be a shock when employers realised that it was only the WFH that kept staff working in sometimes mediocre jobs. Once gone they will go elsewhere.

I agree with you op.

My job (I also manage people) could be done completely remotely, but no, I have to go to the office 3 times very bloody week. Most of the time on those days there aren’t many people in the office as they’re in meetings, doing offsite activities or are on work from home days, so what the fuck is the point?

I have to travel, and pay for the pleasure, and of course put up with inane small talk and office politics and I just cannot concentrate. I try and try but other teams around me and anyone in from my team just disturb me. I fall significantly behind every day I spend there.

I have a disability and this is well known by HR and my manager, and also known is how greatly it can impair my ability to concentrate and how easily distracted I am, but no, they do not do what’s best for me and the service, no, they have to instead show how they control people.

but this was actually addressed to op
and in my work situation they come after hours and there are no toilet brushes

I find it baffling how many people on this site find going into the office so bad. That is definitely going to be one of the big hangovers from Covid. Lots of socially awkward adults who don’t want to leave their homes.

Her employer should be enforcing it if it's a requirement, not least because she manages people and thinks modelling non compliance is OK.

I go in the 3 days required, we are an outlier compared to our competitors but last year we outperformed them so we must be doing something right...

True to a point. Times are also changing as are how we work. Rigid work models are no longer are accepted by (younger) people and neither is top-down authority.

I absolutely value flexibility in the workplace - but it has to work both ways.

Some jobs will lend themselves to. 100% employee choice. In some roles is won’t make a difference is the employee picks their hours, never sets foot in an office and is never available for meetings or conference calls. We all know that model works in some places - that is why we have been able to outsource work to cheaper overseas companies.

But in some roles employees do need to attend in person meetings - they need to chair meetings, meet clients and stakeholder and partners, go to conferences, train staff, travel overseas, lead workshops etc etc.

if younger workers can’t accept top down authority then there is a whole range of jobs that will not suit them. That’s life😂. We have all managed people who refuse to listen and think they know best. It’s a bloody nightmare! But I don’t think this attitude is generation specific - there are arseholes of all ages.

Attendance at the office seems to be more of an issue for older people rather than younger ones.

More worrying is you saying top-down authority isn't accepted. I know of very few organisations which have a completely flat structure, and to be blunt that can only ever work in a co-operative - how on earth are larger organisations expected to work without a structure that means some people are in charge & therefore tell the others what needs doing?

Agreed!

Imagine the cocky young graduate swinging into the workplace and announcing they don’t recognize the authority of their line manager!

the newly qualified teacher telling their school principal to do one.

The shop worker announcing they will work whatever hours suit them.

The PA telling his boss he will decide what calls he will answer!

junior doctors disregarding the guiding hand of their consultant.

We do have a generation entering the workplace who have been raised differently. There are positives and negatives to that. But the real work has some hard lessons for some who have never received constructive feedback.

We have to be in two days a week BUT those days are agreed by team, so my whole team is (usually) in on both those days. Plus our office is new, clean, warm, we all have an extra monitor plus laptop stand/keyboard/mouse etc, we have free tea/nice coffee/fruit etc. I love my days WFH but I also love days in the office and look forward to them. Hybrid suits me perfectly!

My team are all happy with a 3/2 hybrid and it’s been proven to work over last 5 years.

My issue is that there really is no valid reason for us to be dragged back on 5 days a week because some people refused to do the 3 days. Deal with the ones who don’t honour the hybrid arrangement rather than punish those of us who have stuck to the rules.

And the decision has been made by faceless men in the USA who have never actually met a single person in our office. Our country head doesn’t want 5 days, HR don’t want it mandated, our UK board don’t want it but head office in the US have over ruled them.

Agree, but again that is now. The think ahead. I don't know anyone in their 20's that imagines working in an office 5 days a week or at all.

Can I ask what industry you work in OP? I am rather curious as to how your office environment is so unpleasant.

Not true! Lots of flex and protection for employees.

@Everythingisnumbersnow only if the adjustments can be supported operationally.

Do you like living with pink unicorns?

I recall all the horror and mirth in the 80's at cubicles coming into vogue. We've now sort of normalised them. However, it's really not surprising that many people find trying to concentrate in a room full of people overwhelming. Little wonder people don't want to go back to the office.