To think most of you don’t know Mumsnet are now requiring acceptance of cookie tracking or payment to use the site?

[OldChairMan]

… as MN have only posted in Site Stuff:

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/site_stuff/5268190-introducing-pay-or-consent-on-mumsnet?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share

Many will click on “Read for free” without realising that this is a change in the site’s terms.

“Hello everyone.

We wanted to give you a heads-up about a change in the way we deal with cookie consent. We are introducing a Pay or Consent model, giving you two different options to continue accessing the site:

• Continue for free with cookies and ads: this is the option that most people have enabled already.
• Subscribe to Mumsnet Premium: For those who prefer an ad-free experience with no cookies/tracking for ad purposes - Besides ad-free you’ll also get first access to our product tests plus all revenues from Premium are put towards our campaigning work

Why are we making this change?

The pay or consent model is becoming increasingly common across online platforms as publishers adapt to changes in advertising levels and data privacy regulations. Like many other publishers, we relied on advertising to generate income but changes in tracking regulation and the growing use of ad blockers have made this model less viable.

We know that Mumsnet is an essential space for many - a place to seek advice, find support, and connect with your fellow Mumsnetters. That’s why we’re committed to ensuring that the site remains free at the point of use for anyone who needs it but it’s not fair that those who install ad blockers or rejected cookies are piggy backing on the back of other users who haven’t.

At the same time as introducing this, we’re going to reduce the price of Mumsnet Premium to £2.99 a month because we want to be fair to those who’d rather not accept advertising cookies. This is less than the cost of a flat white a month from most decent coffee shops and we very much hope you think Mumsnet’s worth it! Nb anyone who’s signed up to Mumsnet Premium already at the previous price (£4.99 per month) will have their payments reduced within the next week or so.

We’ll be here to answer any questions you may have. Thank you, as always, for supporting Mumsnet.”

You can ignore the advertising targeted at you through the use of your information.

... the site costs money to run, therefore needs to generate income from somewhere, which means advertising

I'd expect most will realise that, @RenegadeKeeblerElf
However it's not so much ads per se which many have a problem with but the extremely dubious sort which are being allowed through - which doesn't happen on any other site I visit, and which the owners seem either unwilling or unable to stop

There's also the issue of handing over bank details to a site which so clearly lacks decent IT/security support, and for me at least it's simply not happening

But are you genuinely suggesting that it’s fine for MN to call people who reject cookies “piggybackers” and accuse them of behaving unfairly, simply because people are rude to them about other things?

For what it’s worth, I’ve been on site stuff many a time and called out the abusive messages that some people post when MN introduce a new feature. I agree that posters can be awful. But those awful posters are not necessarily the same ones who are using ad blockers or rejecting cookies. Those of us who have been nothing but polite and tried to support them have suddenly been insulted out of the blue. A simple “no more ad blockers we’re afraid” would have been fine.

I saw it yesterday. Other sites do it too. It should be made unlawful imo

Trying to figure out how low down my list of existential worries it would be that that Mumsnet had called me a "piggybacker."

What should be made unlawful?

OK. I’ll not bother teaching my son about politeness then, since it doesn’t really matter while the planet burns?

You’re conflating two different issues (1) needing income to support the provision of service (2) how the services are provided.

It is reasonable to ask questions about why the site isn’t professionally supported 24/7 while also recognising that businesses exist to make money.

As users she have value in paying for the service and as recipients of advertising. Arguably, crystallising the relationship into one where we are paid subscribers gives Mumsnetters more say in how the site is managed as it changes the power dynamics.

For now. That is going to go.

Why does anyone care their data might be sold? Or that an ad might follow them?
Argh, I'm being advertised a buggy that I might actually be interested in buying the horrrrooorrrrrrrr

No, I'm not saying that's fine at all. It comes across as a bit desperate to me. The 'premium' thing, when it first came out, was very much an opt-in-if-you-like but that does seem to have changed.

I won't be paying for the site, it's not worth it to me. It might be to others, or it won't be. Who knows how this will end up?

As for the rude posters, their pompous blustering and clamouring for attention and answers.dammit! has filled up the other thread and for what? Yes, we're all annoyed. What happened never should have. I'm guessing that MNHQ don't have all the answers yet, they're probably testing the measures they've mentioned and will possibly find some of those don't work as expected so they'll go on to try something else. Like every other organisation where something goes wrong.

I agree wholeheartedly with you that a 'no more ad blockers we're afraid' would have been clearer and altogether better.

Agreed. Some posters certainly seem to have suspect motives.

For some, AIBU seems to be the only part of the site they know about and dump everything there so that it has become a ragbag of trivia and chatter mixed with its supposed purpose of advice - others do know where they could post general chat but choose to use AIBU. As Mumsnet is managed very loosely and not actively monitored or moderated it carries on in haphazard manner, even though it has a highly developed content structure with dedicated sub forums for dozens of topics.

We produce 95% of the content for them

I’ve said this in the other thread too, but the talking of piggy backing is hilarious.

mumsnet is suing open ai because quote “it has to be properly regulated and creators must be compensated”

mumsnet is saying don’t be a piggybacker pay up or disable ads, because businesses must be compensated properly.

cool, cool, I’m glad mumsnet agrees people being compensated properly for their work is a good thing, what passionate campaigners about this! Love it.

so about the free labour you use for your site instead of paying people at night?

Not only did they use the term "piggybacker", but also "freeloaders". I mean if you're happy to effectively be called a scrounger for wanting to protect your privacy then fair play to you, I, and many others, have a different view.

My data was already compromised by MNHQ. I was one of the people whose Mumsnet name, name and email address was hacked and released into the ether somewhere. I have seen other security leaks. So I have zero idea why anyone would give them payment information. The site is not secure enough to risk that.

It's also very worrying that someone raised the question of how secure payment methods would be hours ago and yet MN have not been at all quick to answer the very reasonable question? You think they be falling over themselves to explain why people should trust them with this information when they can't even keep email addresses safe?

Although it's actually pretty farcical how poor (thrown under the bus) Becky started the thread to answer questions and yet there's been only one response from her on the whole thread...

I think you should be focusing on taking care of your night watch team who will be traumatised, making a system that ensures csa images can never get through again, paying employees equipped to deal with it should it happen again, rather than exploitation of volunteers who will now never get those images from their heads for as long as they live.

You should also be sorting out said ads that people including me keep getting full screens of making the site barely usable.

I feel a bit nauseous and disappointed that your next step after such a hugely upsetting event - for not only your unpaid workers despite your massive revenue, but also the people without whose content you would have no revenue, is to say "oh hey, pay us" erm no ta. Sort your existing issues out then i would have no issues at all.

Will you use this money to pay actual trained night staff?

If you accept cookie tracking by mistake on a device and want to reject it, how can you do that? It's not obvious

This is what I don't really understand.
I find kettles appear all over the place after I checked a detail.
Doesn't bother me.
Doesn't make me buy them.
In some ways they are a pleasant change from some of the other adverts we all get.
Some are quite pretty.
Maybe i should Google kettle from time to time to get nicer adverts.

Taken from MN T&C
"We store the following data for all users, whether registered or not:

• IP address, cookies, device ID – to identify your web browser and device".

"Within our user database, we assign your internet browser and device a unique 'Identity Number'. Against this identity number we record the topic of the content that your device is viewing or creating – in other words, your device’s 'reading habits'. "

They use digital fingerprinting to take your personal data, to both sell and share with partners. It is not Just cookie tracking, they admit even admit it.

People need to forget tracking cookies, they use advanced algotithms to take serial number of your hardware components, software, operating system ect. from the devices you use and a unique digital finger print is created that is shared with other companies.

This allows your personal data and tracking to be made of all your use across multiple browsers, sites ect (they track your device on and off MN with the identifier). It can also be exploited by people with no good intentions.

It amazes me that people do not understand basic security issues and dismiss it by talking about kettles.

This is crazy! I don't why there are so many people here accepting so well what's going to happen! There must be better ways to earn money to sustain Mumsnet than this. We already give waaay too much personal info to Mumsnet already.
One more thing to add. Mumsnet have a long history of attacks of hackers. Do you think it's a good idea to give free access to hackers into your money? It's not a good ideat at all.
Anyways, I'll never get rid of using blockers of ads, trackers and cookies.
I use Malwarebytes and Adguard if anyone is interested in suggestions of extensions to use.

It is all very weird. I think because it started small with Justine and Carrie etc talking on threads that some long term users kind of they're very important and can poke abuse at the mods as much as they like.

Every other site has the accept cookie thing, please tell me why the outrage for this one?

So many people with an axe to grind always revel in these situations on mn . I repeat again that the csa incident was terrible but measures are now in place. Let's direct our revulsion and fury to the perv who posted them not a few mods on a chat forum.