Or have you ever felt like a teacher just didn’t like your DC?

[Letthemeatcakebbz]

Trying to remain quite lighthearted about this but it’s still bugging me mostly because I’m not sure what exactly I’ve done to bother the woman.

my DD, 5, has a split teaching rota. So she had one teacher half the week ( So chatty and kind from what I’ve observed so far but I try not to be the parent who’s badgering them after school so I haven’t spoken to her a huge amount. I have had a few interactions with that one though and she was just so warm and lovely about DD. It made me feel like she ‘gets’ her and my DD will be happy in her care. )

the other one literally couldn’t be any different if she tried. It’s almost like a cliche Disney comparison. And she’s the one I’ve had more time in the company of. She’s very well put together but also quite reserved and ‘clipped’ in her manner. The first red flag was that she attended a child planning meeting for my DD, a multidisciplinary meeting to discuss a child’s needs. My DD is currently diagnosed with ASD). There were five adults in the room and everyone had so much to say and share, you could tell people had got a real feel for DDs personality and her needs.
DD is a bit of a character, but hasn’t presented as challenging in school. She was much higher need in a nursery setting annd then school seems to have given her a lot more structure annd predictability and all of a sudden she’s become a lot more able to mask and manage her needs during the school day. Which obviously has its pluses and minuses. We get the overwhelm and burnout at home but she’s coping at school so I’m grateful for that.

Again, all the staff in that meeting were just really warm and lovely about her. And yet, this teacher, who is the one actually spending all day with DD , and surely would know the most about how she’s coping… said not a word. She didn’t speak through the meeting, she looked a bit flustered and bemused when asked questions and really looked like she just thought the whole thing was a waste of her time. I think for a class teacher to sit through a CPM and not say a WORD is really quite bizarre.

DD is very heavily masking at school. Which I think is ok to a point because it’s a skill that will be useful to her in life. But it does mean that her difficulties and challenges are not always ‘obvious’. She doesn’t behave in a particularly challenging way at school, and I’m beginning to get the feeling that this teacher might have taken a dislike to us as a family because she maybe can’t be bothered with being asked to be aware of her being neurodivergent , if she maybe thinks that DD is not? I have convinced myself that she resents having to attend CPMs and make adjustments for her. I know that sounds a big leap. But the only interaction I HAVE had with her was to just quickly ask her about something which is related to my daughter’s ASD, I basically said, I just wanted to ask if there’s anything relating to this behaviour you’ve seen in the classroom so I know if this is just a home thing…
And, the WAY she looked at me!? She screwed her whole face up as though really keen to emphasise how ridiculous she thought the suggestion was and said ‘no, I can’t imagine her having difficulty with that’

it felt a bit unprofessional and judgy but then again, I know how hard teaching is. My best friend is a teacher, I know it’s hard when parents are bombarding you at the end of the day with lots and lots of bits of information and requests and especially with five year olds, I guess there’s a lot of parents who really do think the world revolves around their own little darlings. I also think there is a lot of expectation on teachers to bend over backwards meeting individual needs of children, and there’s a lot less expectation on parents and children, and a real quickness to throw issues at the school and expect them to sort it. I try SO hard not to give that impression and I tried to write this one off as maybe me having got her at a bad moment, her not being quick enough to cover up how ridiculous she thinks it is that DD is considered ND when her behaviour isn’t a challenge for them yet.

I really don’t ask much of the school. Some people may actually think that I should be more demanding but there are some things which I think my wee girl is ok to be challenged by. Unless it’s really distressing, I think that sometimes it’s ok for her to find something a bit harder than other kids, but muddle her way through and find a way she can cope. I don’t automatically think they should provide a way for her to avoid anything she finds a bit overwhelming.

other instances where I’ve got the same feeling, were when my daughter told me she found the school assemblies really overwhelming because there were just too many people and too much noise. I told the teachers that I’d asked my DD to tell them if she felt this way and maybe they could (if there was a way to do so) have her taken out of the room. I do know they have thirty kids each and can’t just drop everything for one, but I was a bit shocked that seemingly this teachers response in the next assembly when my DD said ‘I’m finding it too much, I need to get out’ was apparently to tell her that everyone else had to sit nicely and she couldn’t have ‘special treatment for being bored’

I mean. If you haven’t gotten bored yourself yet of reading this, I fully accept that people may think I’m OTT and a nightmare parent who just doesn’t know it. But I really REALLY haven’t asked for any major special treatment. We have been told by teams working with my DD that we ‘should ask the school’ for various adjustments and I’ve never felt it necessary because overall, I know my DD is coping and learning how to continue doing so in a mainstream setting. Which will be expected of her throughout her life.

I just wondered if maybe anyone else has experienced having a ND child who maybe wasn’t super high need or super challenging, and felt the teacher was a bit dismissive and seemed actively irritated by the notion your child might have additional needs at times.

ive grown to dread the days it’s her in the classroom because now that I’ve noticed it, I’m forever feeling like I’m over reading any interaction. She recently took away an important part in a school production my DD had been given by the other teacher, and gave it to another child on the day because DD said she didn’t need to practice it because she already knew it off by heart. Which felt a bit icky because DD maybe did sound a bit stuck up saying that but she wouldn’t have meant to. She genuinely would have just not understood why she should stand in a corner herself to practice something that she did already know by heart without having to practice. It felt a bit like teaching her a lesson for being a ‘smartarse’ or something.

I would wonder if she is just very inexperienced. A lot of teachers in their first few years haven't had much experience ofnthose types of meetings and kay he worried about saying the wrong thing especially if she was looking flustered. It sounds like your daughter is doing really well and the 2 opposite style teachers at a young age in a lot of ways although not ideal, may help with resilience

Yep. I’m guessing it’s this. She will have been pulled out of class to attend this meeting, won’t have been given any time to prepare for it, and not being in class will have generated additional work planning for someone else. You can bet that following the meeting she will have extra jobs on her to do list. On top of that, your daughter is masking in school so doesn’t actually present to the teacher as needing additional support, so this will add to the frustration.

im sure she doesn’t dislike your daughter. She’s probably like a swan - seems calm on the surface but struggling underneath it all (the irony being this also describes your daughter of course!) I’m not saying her attitude or behaviour is ok, but I bet that’s what it is.

Yes some people are bellends who hate girls for this reason

I think that describes what I’ve seen perfectly. Perhaps I needed a reminder of it so I can stop taking it so personally. Even if I don’t want to be that parent you can’t help but feel like HOW CAN YOU NOT LIKE THIS PRECIOUS ANGEL OF MINE 🤣🤣

You have a right to express yourself girl, it's okay - sometimes talking about things helps you process them

Thank you x

O don’t like taking the part away. I’d ask about that one - sounds like a nasty response to a ‘ teachable’ moment. So your dd now has no part? I would ask about that: dd mentioned she’d lost the last she had practiced for because she knew the lines, was that a punishment for being a bit cocky? Is that how you would deal with something like that normally?
also- just talk to the SENCO

Yeah I was a bit miffed about it but I said nothing. Again I didn’t want to be some overbearing parent demanding to know why she dared to take her part away and give it to someone else who was more compliant in that moment.
and again, DD can only tell you what happened with exactly parroted words so she’s not misinterpreted it. She was asked to go and sit in a quiet corner and practice her part, she said I don’t need to, teacher said I haven’t seen you practice it at all, DD proceeded to start reeling off her lines from memory to prove she didn’t need to practice (she would genuinely not have been just trying to be cocky, she was confused why people would need to practice when she can just remember it on call) and teacher said she was giving it to another girl who was willing to go and do as she was asked. DD didn’t argue and just accepted she had done something wrong but she didn’t really understand WHAT because … why practice something you already know.

it would totally sound cocky to anyone who didn’t speak her language. Or if you viewed her as neurotypical. But she isn’t. She’s being factual, not intentionally cheeky. :(.

Have explained to her that sometimes you just have to do as you are asked even if it makes very little sense to you. I didn’t want to let her think that I disagreed with the teacher cos I didn’t really want to explain WHY I disagreed. (DD doesn’t know she’s diagnosed , I don’t want her to yet, I want to give her a bit longer before she comes to understand she’s a bit different)

It may not be possible for someone to take her out of assembly because there may not be many teachers in there and those that are may be needed to keep an eye on behaviour. The teachers not in there may be using that time to prepare or work separately with a small group/individual kept out of assembly for example.

Would ear defenders help do you think? It would still be busy but the noise reduction might allow her to cope if she can't be taken out.

Taking away the part in the play just sounds down right mean. I think I'd talk to the teacher that gave her the part about it. TBH the other teacher just plain sounds not very nice and like she thinks your child is some sort of spoilt brat rather than a child with ASD.

From what you’ve said I would think the teacher thinks your DD isn’t autistic.. probably because she doesn’t cause trouble and the teacher isn’t very well informed on girls with ASD :( . There’s a scourge of private over diagnosis and some parents who think that a diagnosis is a way to outsource the responsibility for behaviour. And that dilutes genuine needs. It’s wrong of course, but it’s a thing.
I would bring it up with her in the way you have here, really really honestly. Say that she masks, that’s you HAVE A DIAGNOSIS and her needs are not being met at times. Don’t worry about being ‘that parent’ just state your case.

Yes, she was. They were short staffed that day.

Totally. It’s been lovely that DD has been such an easier child to manage in a school setting than she was at nursery. But I’m adjusting to how differently that makes people respond to her. And to us.

from 18 months we had health visitors and the nursery trying so hard to gently tell us something wasn’t right. We knew, but we didn’t want to acknowledge it and we we didn’t want her labelled so we resisted talking about it but eventually we saw that we weren’t meeting her needs if we weren’t honest and open with the people around her. So we just sort of said ‘listen we KNOW ok, we aren’t as blind as we have been pretending, we can see it and we are ready to acknowledge it’.

They don’t diagnose at the age she was often. We never had to fight for it or push for it. She was diagnosed before she even turned four and all her scores on the various testing models they use were firmly in the game for her diagnosis. There was nothing borderline about it.

but now that she’s presenting so much more ‘normally’ in a school setting… we are being treated really quite differently than we were by the nursery who were very kind but clearly thought we must be REALLY dense to not be picking up on it.

so interesting to be on the other side now where we look like we are over egging it instead

You've referred to her behavior in the multidisciplinary meeting as a red flag - if she is an ECT or new teacher, has never attended a multidisciplinary before, has been sent unexpectedly as DHT cancelled last minute or felt ill then this explains her behavior. Possibly, she felt intimidated among a panel of experts.

She may be someone who is developing her people skills with families. She may be ace in the classroom. Do you think she is picking up that you are concerned and/or judging her? Does she sense that you prefer the 'superstar' other teacher? If so, she may be unconsciously putting distance between you.

Get the SENDCO to put adjustments into place re:assembly. There should be a nominated individual to help your child in those instances. Also ask about the training staff have had to support chn with ASD. Would a 'home school' communication book be beneficial?

I think you're wrong not to explain to DD that she has ASD especially now it is impacting her at school. There is never an easier age or easier time to explain. The older she is the harder it may actually be rather than easier as she might not want to hear it.

There is no point pretending she isn't different when she's already experiencing that she is. To me it's like people who don't tell they're kids that they're adopted or that their dad is actually their step dad. It's better to just always know. The only reason not to tell her is if you think it's a bad, shameful or negative thing that should be hidden and I think unfortunately your reluctance to acknowledge it when she was younger or want her 'labelled' as you call it does suggest this might be the case. If that is the case then please get some therapy for yourselves in helping you to deal with this diagnosis and how to tell your child in a positive way.

Her not knowing is not protecting her because she is still experiencing being autistic whether she knows the name for it or not.

I'm a teacher and I nearly always defend the teacher but you seem really exceptionally reasonable and really kind. You already have some good advice and points here but I would just say don't worry too much about being that parent or asking too much from the school - your DD is entitled to support and removing her from assembly is such a easy thing to do, I would follow up and get something in writing for her. If your DD is happy and supported in school who cares if they think you are being demanding (and again, I really don't think you are - you could be asking for much more!)

Have you got any tangible evidence that parents are spending thousands of pounds of their own money in order to ‘outsource responsibility’?

Because all I see is desperate parents who are just about sailing the ship, absorbing all of their DC’s distress and therefore getting help from nowhere. People scrimp and save for months just to afford an assessment to try and get their DC help. Join a forum of those who can’t afford to go private no matter how much they save and are therefore stuck on endless waiting to see what it’s really like.

If you didn’t realise, I really hate this dismissive attitude. And my child also has a ‘formal diagnosis’, including from the NHS. I’m still somewhat traumatised by the whole experience.

So your comment about the teacher not attending a meeting was a bit disingenuous. They were carrying out their role as directed by their manager, not off on a jolly somewhere.

It would have been more constructive to have had her at the meeting. Not a ADHT that doesn't know DC well. That's the point I was making.

Perhaps she's great with kids but finds small talk type social chat difficult.

You are assuming her to feel all these things and that she is looking down on you. Perhaps she's aware that everyone likes the bubbly teacher rather than her quiet and reserved nature and thinks you are looking down on her and clams up?

She has feelings beyond being a teacher too.

Ultimately your child might not be her favourite. We all find some personalities easier to click with than others.

i think it would have been better if you had spoken to the school about her reaction to assembly. rather than your suggestion.
she has no doubt labelled you also

they do diagnose under 4s regularly,
it is a bonus that they are recognised by the health visitor/nursery centre and referred.

Gah! No- you read my post properly but I meant that is what some people think! They think that there is a scourge of over diagnosis. You hear it all the time ‘in my day they would just be called naughty’ etc it was badly phrased! You would fall under genuine need - as would I and all the asd parents I know because no one would go through that for any nefarious reasons, I just wrote it weirdly.

I can only talk about my own experience with a teacher at secondary school. Head of year when I was 12/13 (don't know what that is but was 2nd year then) Absolutely hated me! I could do nothing right, accused me of hitting another kid...even when the kid said it wasn't me he still wanted to suspend me "for being there". In the corridor walking between classes with everyone else.

I know he asked every teacher about me. I was a teachers dream...worked hard, did home work etc. He pushed one of the younger teachers saying I really couldn't be like that and he didn't believe her (she told me this year's later) and wanted her to put me in detention for anything.

I found out about 10 years after leaving school and chatting to my uncle that had gone to the same school about 25 years before me that he, the uncle had been a little sod. That this teacher couldn't cope with him and his mates and that they had played some pretty dreadful tricks on him!!!

Clearly he thought I was the same....not in school my old son, not in school....outside 😈

Some of this could definitely be relevant I think.

I wouldn’t want her to feel there was a preference for the other teacher, so hopefully I’ve not made her feel that way. Despite having lots to say here on a MN thread, I’ve actually had very little interaction with either of them. I observe and notice their differences in how they seem to behave toward her and us but I don’t interact much with the other teacher either (I don’t think she’s a superstar. I’m sure she’s not perfect either. I know very little about either of them tbh! I just notice she’s very warm and kind toward my DD and I can’t help but like her for it)

I definitely don’t want her to feel that I’m quietly worried about it, but who knows if she’s maybe reading that from me…. so this is a good reminder to just remember that I could be sending out an uncomfortable vibe her way as much as I feel I’m getting one!

I definitely would like to communicate more with them about how she copes and what we see at home but I just never want to be pushy with them as I’m worried it will exasperate the (admittedly invented in my head) issue of them thinking I’m a pushy mum wanting the world to revolve around one five year olds feelings.

I found DS's primary school very dismissive of his autism. He's a "high functioning" masker and I sought the referral in y2 when he was seriously struggling with regulation the moment he stepped on to the playground and saw me. The 4 hour meltdown because I asked him if he'd changed his reading book is one my shins will not forget. The diagnosis came in y4 a few months before the Covid shutdown, and the school kept up lots of Coz Covid restrictions for 2 years. It was halfway through y6 before I was able to talk to a teacher in person.

Y6 was a shit show. Teacher 1, I only spoke to online where she railroaded through the 5 minute conversation. I managed to squeeze in that he looked like he was struggling during the recent video of a music lesson "Oh no, he loved it!" She trilled. Really??? Head on the desk hands clamped over his ears when he loathes tinny little instruments? That does not look like love to me!
DS mentioned somewhat later, after teacher 1 left that they were doing autism awareness and the teacher asked the class if they knew anyone autistic. When DS put his hand up and said that he was, she didn't believe him. The best bit is that she had been the SENCO two years earlier when his NHS headed diagnosis was made and we had exchanged correspondence on the matter!

Teacher 2 I actually did meet. I did not make a good first impression as I got my first word in there very promptly that I was shocked that halfway through y6 they were still making a dyslexic, dyspraxic child write in pencil in contravention of the OT report sent two years earlier in Feb '20, and that he needed to be comfortable and accustomed writing in pen before transitioning to secondary school. When I raised the issue of additional accommodations to support him with his SATs because autism, because dyslexia, because dyspraxia (stress, processing speed, writing speed, writing quality) I was shot down with "he doesn't need them, he's doing well enough". I decided at that point to let them hang themselves on their own attitude and not waste energy to fight it. He was going to a secondary with good SEN support that takes SATs with a pinch of salt, so when it was disclosed two days before he left that he did fail to meet his predicted targets and the teacher blamed "anxiety" (wow, funny how that's a legitimate reason for him to be eligible for the additional time they refused) the only negative consequence was on the teacher having to justify it to management. 🤷‍♀️

That was a dream class too. He was not lost amongst other children with more pressing, complex needs. I worked with them closely until Covid and they were well behaved and above average ability range. DS was very lucky with his class combination as he's easily stressed by excessive noise and people not following rules.

He's now doing brilliantly at secondary school, his needs are light-touch but taken seriously and he knows where he can get support and he has access to appropriate accommodations to help him reach his potential.

Funny how DS2 was allocated additional time for his dyslexia after I raised DS1's experience to that y6 teacher, but she was an excellent teacher who was on top of her game.
DS2 also happened to have teacher 2 the school year straight after DS1. It's not often that both DCs agree, but they did both agree that teacher 2 strongly favoured girls and was short on patience with boys. DS2 was relieved to not have her for the full school year when she moved on.

I've been a teacher, most are great or at least do what needs to be done. But teachers are human and some aren't so great. Some drop balls because they're stressed, demotivated or have other human flaws. Some still struggle to take additional needs seriously in quiet, masking children, and some schools don't have a helpful culture in meeting the needs of all their children.

It's incredibly frustrating when you have a child who just about copes and masks through and it's not being taken seriously. Even if the fallout isn't being shown in school, that comes out in other ways and can potentially be damaging. Support should be there to help children reach their potential, not just do "well enough".

(And I have had positive, constructive relationships with all the DCs' other teachers!)

I'm a teacher
• some teachers dislike children and /or parents
• you mentioned she's a character perhaps she's fine but not going overboard
• some children can annoy you or frustrate you (if this happens I have to work really hard to overcome it!