Looking for solidarity from parents of low sleep needs children

[Mielbee]

My 2.5yo DD sleeps 9.5hrs per 24 hours (10.30-7.30 + 30 min nap). This makes her low sleep needs and she has always been like this - as I was as a baby and child.

We have tried everything to move her sleep earlier and get her more sleep but if we get one earlier bedtime she will be up until 11.30pm at least for the next 3 nights. She then actually gets less sleep overall and we have extremely frustrating bedtimes and less sleep ourselves. It has been much better since we worked out what her sleep needs are and stick to them. We tried dropping the nap totally but she wasn't ready and was miserable at nursery all afternoon.

Everyone has their own challenges but sometimes I have to admit I feel quite jealous of parents of children with higher sleep needs. Some literally have 4 hours more child-free time every day than us!

I would just really like to hear from other parents of low sleep needs children to know we are not alone! For those further ahead, do you ever get an evening again? Any tips on how you make the best of the situation?

Please no advice or comments unless you genuinely have a low sleep needs child yourself. Pic attached for reference (anything lower than the bright orange range).

So hard when the whole world just isn't set up for night owls!

The mainstream narrative around sleep also doesn't help people with average sleep needs children. It seems to set up the higher end as what you should be doing - which just sets most people for anxiety and worry! I'm glad this has helped you realise yours is likely absolutely fine and you're not doing anything wrong 😊

Wow that's so hard! There definitely seems to be a strong link with ND. Really hope the melatonin helps.

Oooh I hope so! Thank you 😊

This has definitely helped me to feel less alone and I'm glad it's done the same for you and others too!

My 5 year old is still a hideous sleeper, we have the triad of shittiness - nightmare to get to sleep (have to psyche ourselves up every night for bedtime) still wakes during the night (and ends up in with us - don't even bother trying to keep them in their own bed anymore, anything for an extra bit of sleep! But will often be awake for 1-1.5 hours when they wake) and then up at the crack of dawn, up until recently by 5 but actually since xmas more like 6 which is obviously a massive improvement.
And when he’s awake he’s up, full of beans and ready to start the day. Hopefully once he’s older, even if he is still a nightmare, he can entertain himself for a bit.

I awaited this magical change everyone told me would happen when he started school & would start sleeping through - still yet to happen!!

We don’t have any family support, so haven’t had an uninterrupted nights sleep in over 5.5 years, it really does get you down. I feel the worst part of it is the loss of my evening & any sort of downtime. If he went down reasonably & we could have a few hours peace, I could deal with the wakings/early risings more easily.

I want to punch people who say ‘oh, have you tried this’ as though I haven't thought to try every single thing possible. These people with great sleepers are just lucky in my opinion, nothing to do with superior parenting.

It’s at least in part one of the contributing reasons we haven't had another! I physically couldn't cope with even less sleep than we have now.

I do think he’s super bright (biased obv) but he does struggle with impulsivity & concentration, so I am wondering whether theres an element of ADHD involved (but on the other hand I feel he’s within the realms of normality for a boisterous 5 year old boy!)

Rant over, solidarity to you all! I

Wow, twins as well as such early wakes - that is super hard!

4 the same! Wow! I can so imagine that hearing all your kids awake and chattering is not a turn on - that made me chuckle.

That gives me some hope for school age! 9-7 would be excellent! Thank you

Oh that does sound so so tough! Particularly relate to the frustration of 'have you tried this' people. They just do not get it. Which is why I specifically was asking only for comments from people with low sleep needs children themselves - they do get it! Thank you for sharing.

No, other parent is a sloth. But she is like my mum and sister.

I have two of those 🙄. The eldest had melotonin which helped.
The youngest now has a combination of magnesium, rescue remedy for kids and a meditation, that is helping at the moment! This is the one who wasn't going to sleep until midnight but is now around 9.30 / 10pm.

They did very well at school, both went to Cambridge, got first class BAs and went on to get an M Phil and Llbs. As others have said, it’s chicken and egg. They don’t sleep cos they’re bright? Or learn more cos they’re awake?

My now 10yo was the worst sleeper for so long! First 2 years were sometimes every 45 min wake ups at time and generally every 2 hour wake ups. Then she would wake for the day at 4am. We used to put her to bed at 6.30pm as that was the best chance of getting her to sleep as she never woke any later if we put her to bed any later - just woke up tired and grumpy. From about 4pm onwards she was bouncing off the walls and if we did ever keep her up late she was completely dysregulated and screaming.

Naps often took 45 mins of rocking to sleep get a 20 - 30 min nap.

In short she was a bloody nightmare.

Somehow we thought it was a good idea to have a second child, who luckily turned out to be very different. Not a good sleeper, but far easier than her sister. She still woke lots, but you could keep her up later and she would just eventually fall asleep, as she got tireder. She woke at 4am too but didn't bounce off the walls, she would play quietly. Crucially, she loved naps & napped for 3 hours a consistently in her cot. It was an absolute game changer!!

My survival strategy for baby 1:

Sleep when the baby sleeps - if they will nap for 30 mins, take it.

Lower your expectations of a tidy house etc - survival and your sanity is key.

Take any offers of help you can get eg taking them to the park for an hour - use that hour to sleep.

Loads of exercise ( preferrrably outdoors) and cognitive stimulation - the only time would did get longer toddler naps was after big hikes or bike rides. Making her brain work had the same effect - doing jigsaws, colouring, reading etc.

Drop the naps and get out. We just excepted rather than spending 45 mins rocking a toddler to sleep for a nap to let her crash out in a sling/ car seat or buggy if she was going to nap.

As she got older quiet activities - colouring/ lego/ reading/ stickers/ audiobooks at bed time. She can stay up late but she must stay in her room and be quiet.

Now 10yo prob goes to sleep 10.30 until 7.30 and that works for her and us. I do think she has ADHD and needs lots of help with regulation still. It's very obvious looking back, she looks insane in every toddler/ preschool video we have, with her baby sitting sitting calmly next to her.

Remember every child is different - what works for one child and family may not for another and that's ok.

I have a very close friend (we saw each other most days when the kids were babies and toddlers) with a very low sleep needs child, while I had (have) a very high sleep needs child.

Both difficult in their way, but it really is an advantage at secondary level as her DC has time to do huge amounts of sports training, lots of home work, music practice, seeing friends etc as she just doesn’t need more than 6 hours a night. It gives her so many more hours in the week, which she makes the most of. Mine is (at 17) grumpy and miserable when she gets less than 9 hours, and that often happens because of evening events and early morning before school stuff.

Hopefully that offers some light at the end of the tunnel. Sleep deprivation is awful, you all have my sympathy.

I feel your pain. Both of my kids never slept well.

Unfortunately my second child (5) is autistic and it got worse from being a baby. He was up last night from 3:30am until 6am. And that was WITH melatonin. 😭

She comes into our bed and stays there until morning but is just so wriggly and was getting upset as well. The upset has lessened since we changed her bedtime from 7 to 8 but she's still so fidgety none of us our sleeping, neither of us take full responsibility for dealing with it as such because she just lies there fidgeting and asking for cuddles until she eventually falls asleep. I think we need to wake her at 6 so we don't have to make her bedtime later but it's so hard when she's finally fallen back to sleep at around 4 to then think about getting up just 2 hours later.

along with very little need for much sleep my nice also suffers from sleep walking night terrors night mares and bad foot pain she does have a low pain threshold as well

10yo has just drifted off...!

Thank you for such a thoughtful post. So true that different things work for different people.

Has she always had that bed time? I only ask as my DD is 9 months and no matter what I do I can't get her to go to bed without using it as a nap anytime before 9:30/10 which I think is awfully late for her age

This is a good point to remember - there are pros and cons to everything and I can see how it's harder to have high sleep needs as a teenager and young adult. Thank you also for the sympathy!

Yes I think you have to calculate how much sleep she actually has in 24 hours and then assume that is her actual sleep need. Then work out where do you want that sleep to go i.e. would you rather have a morning or evening. You may be able to shift it to where you want, i.e. by waking her up early, but I totally appreciate how hard that is to actually put into practice when you're tired! Good luck.

Actually at 9 months it was later! I called her my midnight baby as that's when she fell asleep. We could never make baby classes in the morning. Any earlier and it would also be a nap, exactly like you say.

Your DD is obviously a night owl. You can do some things to try and shift it earlier like I'm sure you've tried, but they never really worked for mine either. I think you can send yourself round the bed doing that. I was much happier when I accepted it - it's just her and not anything you are doing wrong.

@Mielbee thank you, yeah she was later, started at 4am but has gradually got earlier, you're right if I try anything it makes it worse and I find just going with what she wants works the best, in the plus side I get regular lie ins until 9:30/19 where a lot of other baby mums are up at the crack of dawn