School readiness survey - surprising?

[GirlfromtheNorthLondonCountry]

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2025/jan/30/some-children-starting-school-unable-to-climb-staircase-finds-england-and-wales-teacher-survey

Is it really the case that 4 year olds (absent disabilities) are unable to climb stairs or sit on the rug because of too much screen time? It just seems so extraordinary to me.

@MoMhathair I completely agree with everything you’ve said about the parents who needed to struggle through lockdown with a newborn, I couldn’t have coped. I do think we are definitely seeing the results of this in some now-reception children. I will say though, I see this as well in children who were born well after everything had opened again, so I don’t think it can account for all of these changes. I think there are a number of societal factors as well.

@suburburban The school I'm referring to is a new build, slotted into a tiny, cramped site as a sweetener for a big new housing estate. The secondary it feeds into is across the road and equally cramped (if not more so - they have to stagger break times to accommodate everyone). So very limited outdoor space, no greenery, and I wouldn't be surprised if things like risk assessments and fear of litigation fed into the school ethos.

My own DD's primary half a mile down the road is a bit better - it has a field at least! But they are almost as bad around outdoor learning and risk-taking. I accompanied DD's class on a litter picking trip to the local country park when she was in Reception and it was like being in a chain gang - they weren't aloud to climb anything, touch or pick up anything (not litter - I mean leaves/flowers/pine cones) or leave the path to go on to the grass or look at the little stream that flows through the park. It was literally arrive - pick litter in the area around the car park - return to school. Another parent helper was told off by the class teacher for letting her group of kids jump off a log.

Another class parent, who works as an art therapist, offered to come into our school to do a project with the children, but when she asked if they could go outside to look for natural objects for a nature collage, staff told her no 'as a fox might have weed on them' - so the children ended up looking at the same natural objects on a screen.

There is a computing curriculum where children learn the skills they need. These are ever changing anyway.

Needing to use a computer as an adult doesn't mean that a three year old has to spend so much time on a phone that she uses American vocabulary and speaks with an American accent!

Lack of active learning, lack of play, lack of engagement by parents (some) as screen time is the easy option.

My youngest was born August 2020. Her life was no different to that of her older siblings. I so understand that some people had a terrible time, may have been anxious and that may have affected their babies. I do get that.

But I've had other parents tell me that if affected speech. How? I was with my baby all day, just as I was with my older ones. They didn't go to nurseries. We don't have extended family so we weren't missing out on seeing anyone. By the time my youngest was a year and I wanted to take her to playgroups and activities they were all open again as normal. Covid didn't stop me from talking to my baby all day. They don't need a conveyor belt of people around them to learn how to talk.

I've also been told it's why some aren't potty trained. Again, how?

As an aside, when we went for dds reception orientation last summer, the teacher made it clear that they expected the children to be potty trained. One of the parents said something about Covid, and she cut the off with, "potty's were available in 2022 when you would have needed one." But, she knows the demographic of our area well, there is a. Excuse for everything.

I worked in a school before Covid. These things have been going on for years. Some people have used it as an excuse.

What a shame is all I can say.

I remember a school trip to a farm in the 70s and my dm was a helper.

One of the boys fell in the sileage (nothing to do with my dm but I think he was in her car in way back but that was that

I had a covid baby, plus a hyperactive three year old at the time. Everything shut, we couldn't meet up with any friends, even play parks were padlocked off. Having to explain to a pre-schooler why we couldn't play anywhere and that we couldn't go close to anyone in case we gave them a virus or they gave a virus for us. Trying to breastfeed for hours while being begged to play by a little boy and there being no support allowed whatsoever. His first experience of primary school was 'lessons' over a video call once a day and a few videos sent for us to watch.

We go to the park now and play for hours but I can't help wondering what the effect of all that was on him.

I completely agree with this. The data is startling but now we need to understand it more. For example, while I am confident that in our local schools, the uptick in children not ready for primary is ALSO an issue, I dont' get the sense it's anywhere near as bad as what this report is saying. Maybe I 'm naive. But maybe it's also becuase we have different systems and services and support here? I don't think it's ever as simple as "screens" or "too many parents working". It's a huge combination of things that we need to understand more. (and hats off to the Princess of Wales - sounds like this is something she's clocked onto and is doing the work to try figure out).

I also don't think the "we can't blame covid anymore" holds up. It was a huge thing that withdrew huge amounts of support from families and children and intrinscially changed a lot of the way in which families interact with each other and with various support services. It doesn't surprise me at all that children who are starting school now - ie those who were born during lockdowns - are the ones who are the least prepared.

We can sit here and pontificate about people not playing enough with their children blah blah blah, but the reality is that when my children were babies and toddlers, a huge amount of the learning, physical exercise etc they got was done while we were out and about, and not just from me playing with them or taking them to the park. From just loking aroudn and reachign for things while doing chores with a DC in the pram, to meeting up with friends and other babies, to baby groups and soft plays.

And I'm sure I'm not the only one who used to do random little things like bundle the DC up and take them on the bus into town for one small task and maybe a little treat just to get them out the house, keep them stimulated etc.

And then Covid came and all that disappeared. None of these small simple things were available to parents during Covid and even as restrictions lifted, it wasn't as simple as just getting back to normal life. I remember the point at which masks weren't mandated any more mostly but people were largely still wearing them out and about. I took DD aged about 5 to a supermarket and while waiting for the lift, a man was shouting at her (not ME) because she wasn't wearing a mask and he wouldn't let her in the lift. The vitriol in his voice and his behaviour was huge. And i think that sort of thing meant that for years after restrictions were less severe, people just didn't get up and casually od all the things the rest of us did with small children. it was easier just to leave them at home when doing chores or to stick with online for everything.

So you were an experienced parent, and your baby was around other children. You don't think that your experience would have been different to a first time oarent, cut off from a support network, alone with £one babyall day?

No, I'm not saying that they have to. I'm saying that this is how life is set up now, and kids are not immune to it.

This whole conversation is often missing a consideration of the way the world has changed in the last few decades. It's all well and good saying that parents are just shit nowadays, but imo that's the easy answer and doesn't require any nuanced thinking.

My children have a forest school that they do for a few hours a week and it’s relatively common place where I live. The reception kids have free flow in and out the classroom (which I understood to be compulsory in reception in the UK) they have a mud kitchen. Both kids look like they’ve been rolling in mud each day anyway.

@Wellthisisshitty I agree, many “COVID babies” probably weren’t affected by lockdown, and some probably benefit from more 1:1 time than they would have otherwise gotten eg if maybe parents would have returned to work full time but were on furlough instead. However, I can also imagine many parents were struggling with mental health during this time which may have affected their interactions with their babies. The only way for some parents wfh with very young children to cope may have been to use screens to keep children occupied for longer than they otherwise might have. I’m sure it was different for everyone but I can definitely imagine a number of situations that would have made it much harder to parent normally during lockdown. I agree though that the changes we are seeing generally are not just a result of lockdown — it’s happening to children who were born after the lockdowns as well.

@Wellthisisshitty your 2020 child had three older siblings who would have interacted with them. You were an experienced parent. Some children are more predisposed to speech delays anyway. Parents were expected to work with their young babies at home. I can’t attribute my child’s speech delay entirely to
lockdown but I do know when he started nursery it resolved very quickly. Of course I spoke to him - but everyone else he met worse masks!

There seems to be a bit of disparity between why teachers and parents feel are the causes of lack of school readiness on some kind issues and convergence on others. Teachers are more likely to say that lack of parents reading to children, time on screens are to blame, parents are more likely to say the cost of childcare is to blame - both agree to a similar degree that parents aren't talking to their children enough.

So you were an experienced parent, and your baby was around other children. You don't think that your experience would have been different to a first time oarent, cut off from a support network, alone with one babyall day?

I do understand that's different. But seriously, my first was on a military base, alone in a country where I knew no one and couldn't speak the language.

It didn't stop me from speaking to my baby or teaching him to use the toilet.

I also want to add that while I'm nto sure how this plays out for the baby/toddler/pre school period, another huge societal shift that i think is massively detrimental to our children is that parents are so much more paranoid now. For older kids, we see that in the way they're not allowed to be out and about alone and how many are still being ferried or accompanied everywhere, even as they start to go to high school.

But I wonder if it's also playing out in some way with younger chidren? Stairs being an interesting example. SIL and BIL were constantly absolutely terrified of stairs. They would discourage their DC from climbing them, or hover while telling them how dangerous it was. Ditto, I feel like over the last few years I have met a lot more parents whose fear of their child choking is higher - we were all careful but I am surprised these days how often I meet parents who are still obsessively watching their children eat way past the point at which it seems necessary for this level of concern, or even still feeding them. And it must psychologically impact the children too as they learn these fairly normal things are actually "dangerous" or "scary".

ON MN (which I concede might not be real life), the one that always strikes me is how long parents continue to get up at the crack of dawn with their children, or act horrified at families where mum and dad remain asleep while the 7 year old is up at 7am. I just don't get it and I, and to be fair most of the people I know, have actively done everythign we can to make sure our children can be independent and self-contained at home as much as possible, but if MN is to be believed, that's not necessarily normal.

Yes I often see dc in buggies with their dps on phones but not talking to their dc. I know it's necessary to make calls at times obviously.

No of course not. Lockdown was a factor - it may not have been the be and end all. I feel it contributed to my child’s speech delay and it might have been he would have had one anyway.

this attitude is part of the problem. It sounds like you did a good job and were able to mitigate for covid. Good for you. But to assume that everyone is the same is unrealistic. there's a reason we have Health Visitors and midwive visits. There's a reason that baby groups and commjunity groups are set up. There's a reason that charities like NCT or local hospitals create ante- natal classes and groups... becuase a lot of people (mst people) really would struggle if just left to get on with it alone. Because they dont know what's needed. Or they dont have the tools, resources or skills necessary. Or for some other reason.

I saw it long before Covid when I worked in schools in deprived areas.

It was just excuse after excuse for not being arsed and wanting to drink or smoke weed all day instead.

I know that doesn't fit the general demographic of mumsnet users though, thankfully not many people reading this will live in the sort of dump that I live in now, but it's what I know.

My children have a lot of screen time. I don't see it as the devil. But from what I see around me daily, it's just shit parents who were dragged up themselves and are now doing the same.

@MoMhathair Great posts, and I agree about the impact of lockdowns - I'm very well documented on here warning about the inevitable fallout of it all on children (and being called a 'granny killer' for my troubles). We too interpreted the 'guidelines' rather loosely and persisted in taking DD into shops, to the local market, on public transport (I remember being frequently shouted at and told her she should be wearing a mask - she was 2 at the time). We continued to see grandparents and resumed seeing our neighbours with similarly aged DC as soon as we feasibly could - I'm so glad now that we did.

That said, I do think that there's more to it than lockdowns. I don't think there's a binary debate to be had around whether it's covid measures that have caused all of these issues, or poor parenting; I think it could very well be both of those things and more (the overarching culture around childhood and families). It all feels quite toxic at the moment.

I notice poor parenting around me all the time, but it's not really traditional neglect - what I see is a lot of frazzled, barely coping adults with zero knowledge of child development, fractured families and little exposure to children prior to having their own, many of whom are also hopelessly addicted to their phones (but often don't realise it). I left teaching in 2013, but even back then issues like excessive screen time, poor language skills and children arriving at school in nappies were much in evidence - covid just exacerbated those trends. And it's across all class and economic barriers - I saw a school mum who's a high ranking HR professional crash into a lamppost the other day because she was walking home from the school run gawping at her phone.

And I agree - no external help whatsoever. With DD I had one home visit from the Health Visitor immediately after birth and that was it - no developmental checks (we received a letter in the post that said to phone a number if we were specifically concerned about anything); no reminders about childhood immunisations; no dentistry during Covid (we have been very diligent about taking DD since they reopened, but our dentist frequently comments that they never see kids for checkups any more - only to remove already decaying teeth); no health screening or things like eye tests in schools any more. It is entirely left up to parents, many of whom aren't educated or well resourced enough to know what they're looking for or to identify when there's a problem.

During Covid our county council stated that the lockdown proved that face to face 0-5 yo services were no longer required and sold off all of the sure start centres... and yet here we are.

We moved to Northern Ireland post Covid in part because, as a teacher, I couldn’t face putting my children through the education system. There is no ofsted here and we still have sure start centres which are well funded and attended. I can only speak for my coastal town but it is like another world. Children are not able to start the pre-school at 2 and 10 months unless they are potty trained. They are outdoors for a minimum of one hour a day in all weathers. The impact that the prevalence of religion and community on the children is profound. Obviously this has had terrible consequences for NI but it is impossible to live here and ignore the positive ones. There is a morality in the people that live here that I think comes from a shared belief in god. You see this is many other countries which are still deeply religious. Similarly, everyone knows everyone else and this acts as a repressive state apparatus, children know they need to behave in public areas because otherwise it will get back to your parents. There is also a huge sporting community here and this gives kids a real sense of identity and belonging. Teachers are respected here and the respect for them is, in part, down to the parents and the way they talk about them. GCSE results here are staggeringly superior to England and students are able to learn in schools, we also still have special schools for students who aren’t able to access a mainstream curriculum. It’s honestly astounds me every day the differences for children here

We're talking about teaching your kid to use a potty, how to move about, how to use cutlery. We aren't talking about anything that parents haven't been teaching since the dawn of time, long before a big state apparatus to intervene for poor parents. It doesn't require a herculean effort just not neglect.

Gave a 4yr old a simple jigsaw (at school). Actual sight skill were great, could see the pattern colours etc. Pushed the pieces with a finger (swiped it) got very frustrated when they didn't join together. Had to be shown how to pick up and join it.

Also, not a new thing, I taught MANY children who didn't have ANY books in their homes. Can recall a little girl being overjoyed that santa had given her 'my very own special book'. It's heartbreaking

No actually, the poster was talking about how she kep her child socialised, spoke to her child all the time, did lots of playing and developmental activities etc... all while at home in Covid and therefore so could other people.

Don't get me wrong, I am not blaming covid for everything. I said from the start I think it's hugely complex and there are lots of elements to this. I just think we can't simply say, "Covid is irrelevant" becuase it's not and it certainly exacerbated a lot of existing problems with poor parenting. Not least, for me, is as a society we are much more insular. There's much less "it takes a village" in the mindset generally, again this was exacerbated by Covid.