To think stealing food isn’t wrong if you’re starving?

[ThatPinkHedgehog]

If someone is hungry and has no means to buy food, is it really immoral for them to take what they need to survive? AIBU to think there’s a moral grey area when it comes to stealing for survival?

Off the top of my head I can think of 3 that were in the papers in the last decade
Errol Graham, Mark Wood and David Clapson.
If you bothered to Google it there's hundreds...
People starving to death in this country. It's horrific. You do not have a clue what some people go through.

It's wrong.

It's still stealing but rather than punishment, when caught, the offender should have manditory reporting to an agency that can educate them on all available help for hungry folk.
Stealing for food is an alarm.
Action needs taking to care for the thief so that they don't have to rely on stealing again.

Repeat offenders should be charged.

Off to google all those words

Stealing is always wrong.
There is no shame in asking for help and support though

www.disabilitynewsservice.com/dwp-was-wrong-to-stop-benefits-of-man-who-starved-to-death-inquiry-finds/

I wish this was the only case like this, but it isn't. The DWP are rejecting so many benefit claims now, and yes, that did start during austerity as the Tories tried to lower the cost of welfare.

Both of my parents have severe arthritis, both are going to tribunal - it has taken over a year for the cases to come to the top of the list. They are not old enough for state pension and had to use their tax free pension pis to waterproof the roof of their house. They are lucky that I support them or they would be fucked.

Congratulations if you are living in a bubble where you can't imagine the hardships that some people go through - many of the safety nets simply take too long or are too complex to access.

I said at the start of the austerity programme that desperate people will do desperate things to survive. And here we are. When a single bag of shopping in Lidl costs £50 it’s not surprising many are simply unable to buy food. Yes there are food banks but in many places they’re only open one day a week, such as the town I live in. Luckily my own situation isn’t so bad and I can afford food, but costs are astronomical.

I remember being so skint when DD1 was a baby that I used to ‘steal’ nappies from supermarket changing rooms, take the whole supply they’d left out for people to use, because it was either that or DD would have had no nappies. I didn’t feel great about it, but it was what is was.

Of course it is relevant, or at least no less relevant than any of the other points people have made about foodbanks or the majority of people getting caught stealing non-necessary items rather than basics

If someone was literally starving then a tub of lurpak isn't going to make much difference, is it?

Therefore the poster's point was that if people are frequently stealing to the extent things like tubs of butter need security tags, it's not because they are starving, which is extrapolated to = most people stealing aren't doing so because they are on the brink of starvation

It is horrific to see the numbers these days. However, starvation is rare. The Many you refer to die or have an underlying cause of death as malnutrition. This is more not eating healthily ( fruit, veg, beans etc ) so eating the wrong food as opposed to none or little.

The main issue with the three above was the DWP stopping benefits. Two because they had mental health issues and little or no support to follow through on benefit requirements. One because it was wrongly summised he wasn’t trying to find work and without money couldn’t buy food and was a diabetic. These cases of starvation are rare, malnutrition unfortunately not so and is on the rise.

Right but that's not the title of the thread.. the thread didn't ask 'is it fine to steal lurpak if you can't afford it?'
And there really are people living in this country who do need to steal to survive unfortunately.
As I've said, I myself had to steal when I was younger.
Amd regarding the lurpak.. I think people who ate stealing to eat, tend to steal whatever it's easiest for them to steal from wherever it's easiest for them to go.
They aren't going to think 'oh no ill just steal the cheap items' it will be whatever there was an opportunity to steal that is edible.

Not saying there aren't people out there stealing expensive butter for the thrill of it.. but there probably are some people stealing it to live
Amd yes butter will make a difference. It's extremely high in calories and fat. The difference between plain bread and bread with real butter on it will be up to 200 kcals. If you are starving then yes that shit matters. If you don't know where your next meal is coming from you would be lucky to manage to steal a high calorie item like butter. That's gonna massively boost your calorie intake
You want easy to eat, small packaged, high nutritional value items

Until someone steals from you.

I agree totally.

Where I live there is access to food banks. The local Housing Association and a nearby church both put on a Sunday lunch for free. (most people that attend donate a small amount).
Some churches also have children's clothes banks and special funds for those in need (such as paying towards a school uniform or providing transport for hospital visits).

There is no need for anyone to steal.

As a youngster I worked in our local shop. I was never really bothered by Christmas as a youngster and offered to restock the shelves Christmas day. I watched a wee old guy stick some tins of cat food in his bag. My only regret in not saying or confronting him was to find out if he needed something.

I know had I contacted my parents he would have been invited round for Christmas dinner or a plate sent to his.

In a civilised country where there are support networks for people in genuine need, not to mention government-run assistance, precious few are stealing food (or anything else) out of necessity.

Well as the saying goes : if you see someone stealing food - no you didn't.

There are lots of reasons people can't use food banks - personal setups that make it difficult to engage with any kind of services (eg lots of rough sleepers), transport costs to and from, restricted diets (poor people have allergies and sensory difficulties too), restricted opening hours, just off the top of my head.

Obviously if a guy's loading up on sirloin steaks to sell down the pub that's different, but I really do think it's fine to nab a ginsters pasty from Tesco if you're truly hungry.

Stealing is always immoral.

Trying to justify stealing is scummy.

I wouldn't. I'd have to ask for help. I'd hate having to ask for help but I'd rather do that than steal.

Do you think anyone in the UK has staved to death because they weren't willing to steal?

I volunteer at an organization that provides food for anyone that comes through the door. There are no hoops to go through at all. The people using the service don't even have to talk to anyone if they don't want to. There are no referrals or checks at all. The food is good quality too.

The question wasn't whether stealing food was necessary in the UK.

I think stealing fits into a few categories

1. Survival - not the majority but still deeply important to remember. I have much compassion for this population and think it speaks about failings of society more than the failing of the person committing the theft.
2. Frees up money for other things - If I don't have to spend x on y then I can also buy...[could be things needed, but also can be wants]
3. Emotional void - correlation between stealing and mental health, impulsivity, other emotional or mental health factors. These reasons are typically not about money but the dopamine hit from the act of stealing and the further 'hit' from not getting caught.

Some good AI posts on this thread 😅

@XWKD
My answer is still the same.

Repeat offenders should be forced to do some work

A system that produced enough food for everyone but let some people go hungry is inherently immoral.

We have an epidemic of obesity. Some people are eating more than their fare share, IMO.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-65577541.amp

For those who don’t believe that people can starve in the UK, and that poor people are only so because they’re on drugs.

It says in the Bible, "If a man shall not work, neither shall he eat"