AIBU to try and prevent care home fees? Advice appreciated

[Watermelonsuns]

So my parents are elderly, both have health issues but managing well at home. My mum in particular would struggle if something happened to my dad. Recently a friend's parent had to go into a care home and as the parent owned their own house and savings they are self funding and the fees are crazy.
AIBU to try and find a way to protect my parent's property and savings in order its not all gone in care home fees in the last years?
Someone has suggested moving their property into my name but surely that would be an obvious way to avoid fees and would look dodgy? Is there another loop hole im missing? Aby advice from someone working in this area would be appreciated thanks

But surely they both end up at the same point?

Dementia is increasingly a normal part of ageing. It’s the biggest cause of death in the UK.

I pay more national insurance on my salary than someone does on a lower salary, so in a way I already am paying more for my dental care than them...

if they have significant cash assets at the point of needing care you can purchase a care needs annuity.

my mum’s cost £330k and funded her care until she died. With the reduction of the estate for IHT and her care needs taken into account it was cost neutral in 3.6 years and she lived 7 years

all done through a care qualified IFA

But it's not part of the normal ageing process. Just as heart disease wasn't a normal part of the ageing process.

Academic, really, isn't it? Pay for care and hope it doesn't go on long enough to take the entire house proceeds, or sink the entire house proceeds into an annuity up front.

It wouldn't "look dodgy" it's called deliberate deprivation and they can take the money from you if they figure it out

See my previous post
I did all the calcs based on the 300,000 65plus currently in care homes ( not inc the additional funding needs of those receiving nursing care as figures vary so much )

If every working age person paid into an insurance scheme or additional tax it would cost less than £2.50 a week or less than £130 a year per person

That would free up all he money our local councils spend from our Council Tax bills on Social care
Either CTax reduces or better still they can afford to improve services elsewhere.

nb. this does not include 18yr olds plus social care for the 140,000 currently receiving it. 98% of which are Council funded. There were no figures available re costs of that to work from.

If care was paid centrally, using a paid for scheme as above, rather than council led we would not see the North South divide that currently exists.
For example
50% of care home residents in the SEast self fund
27% of care home residents in the NEast self fund

Thats a bumper bill for those NEast councils.

What currently exists doesn’t work now and certainly won’t into the future.
We need change.

So am I. But the way the care system works would have you, whenever you had a dental check up or another dental need, paying a 40% surcharge to fund NHS dentistry.

It's not "those with more money pay more" like the general taxation system, it's those with more money pay more, and if they are unlucky enough be ill, they pay a surcharge on top of the extra that they've already paid.

Well, the point is that if people are going to be in care for the rest of their lives they don't need their former homes, or large sums of money. Let's be honest here. It's actually those who are going to inherit who will be disadvantaged, they are usually the people claiming how unfair it is - because they won't get sums of money they haven't earned handed to them.

As I have already mentioned my parents paid for their care and I was happy for that to happen - even though I will be renting for the rest of my life and what was spent would have been a huge help to me. I also don't care that other people had all their care subsidised. Not everyone is obssesed with money matters.

The alternative is that LAs are funded to pay the same for care as anyone else, so the tax burden is spread across everyone and not the small proportion who end up needing a care home. The better off are still paying for their own care.

Exactly
What person would hand out £35,000 every year to a random stranger in the street. That’s exactly what the average self funder is doing every year.

I don’t know, maybe everyone would do that and I’m walking on the wrong streets

The payment wouldn't be deferred. The house is excluded from the financial assessment if the spouse is still living in it (in England at least).

again, you maths is out.

taking my mum as an example, her council pay £700. She pays £1300. Her home doesn’t take council payers, but for the sake of this argument if they did and the true cost is £1000, then my mum would be subsidising £300pw, not £600. £15k per year. Still a lot but a third of what you are arguing.

I’m afraid your maths is out as not representative

You can’t take one person ( out of 300,000 ) as an example when making these sort of calcs.
Its meaningless
You need to base it on standard average stats.

Areas vary
Calcs based on Govn info

Dementia can't be seen as a normal part of ageing. That's like saying high child mortality. before the modern era was a normal part of family life. Dementia is a disease and it only affects half of all even ninety-somethings; some day it will be preventable or highly treatable. I sincerely hope so anyway.

But again it stands to reason if you want a full set of dental implants instead of dentures you should pay for them. They're a luxury item when there is a basic that is funded by the state.

Indeed.

But it doesn't stand to reason that if you want a full set of implants, not only do you pay for them, you also pay for dentures for someone on the NHS. Yet that is how the current care system works.

We’ve already discussed that notion of basic state v luxury self funded though.

Examples don’t support that theory as standard. See pp by many.
and round and round we go

Because we have signed up for a welfare state, that's how it works. Not dissimilar from people paying taxes to fund state education and using private schools. If you live in the UK you accept that's how our taxation works.

It’s completely different to private schools.
People can chose state or private. They are not denied state despite being able to afford private.

People are denied state funding of their care when they reach 65 plus.

There is no similarity at all.

When the Welfare state was set up it was to care for people from cradle to grave. That was its purpose.
It isnt achieving that aim any more.
Its a failing on its main purpose.

I refer to my earlier remark about what else will an octogenarian with dementia spend their money on? It is, after all, THEIR money

I was referring to the comment of yours I tagged re
the Welfare state and
Private school comparison.

Not a past one I’m afraid

I do however absolutely agree with you it is THEIR money
as such - To do what they want with.
Yet most on here think it’s OK to be up for grabs for SC to do what they want with. That’s the current unfair system.

But i agree with you it’s not everyone else’s money to grab.

So using your rationale my salary is entirely my money and I shouldn't pay taxes because it's my money and I deserve to say how every penny is spent.

It’s your calculation I have an issue with, not the figures. Using your figures of £1160 - £477:50 = £682:50, the self funder is paying £683 more, but they are subsidising to the extent of £341. Not a million miles away from my calculation.

It’s the same model that applies to dentists . NHS dentistry services are a complete postcode lottery, and the majority of dentists do private work, either exclusively or in a mix with nhs services because the money the nhs pays for each patient procedure doesn’t even cover their costs and the private work subsidises the nhs work. They’re a business and have to make their money somehow.

if we want decent, state funded and run services such as care homes (and dentists) then they need to be owned, and run and directly employed by the state and not run as a business. Old fashioned I know but that model worked for years - a standard service for everyone with a more luxurious option/choice that you can pay for yourself. Same as healthcare and education.