AIBU to try and prevent care home fees? Advice appreciated

[Watermelonsuns]

So my parents are elderly, both have health issues but managing well at home. My mum in particular would struggle if something happened to my dad. Recently a friend's parent had to go into a care home and as the parent owned their own house and savings they are self funding and the fees are crazy.
AIBU to try and find a way to protect my parent's property and savings in order its not all gone in care home fees in the last years?
Someone has suggested moving their property into my name but surely that would be an obvious way to avoid fees and would look dodgy? Is there another loop hole im missing? Aby advice from someone working in this area would be appreciated thanks

I'm sure they can put the house as joint tenants on common, or something like that, in their wills. This protects each spouses individual share of the house against remarriage of their surviving spouse or care home fees.
My parents did this. My dad has died so his share of the house is protected in a trust I think. His share has to be put in mine & siblings name. The clause is our mum remains living in the house without paying us half the market rate for rent on what is now our share of the house & is responsible for any repairs that need carrying out. Like it or not, that's how it's done.
Nb: we'd never have charged her half the market rate for rent on our share of the house, you'd have to be pretty hard & mean spirited to do that! And we make sure any repairs that need doing are done, so she doesn't have to worry.

Those are choices you make knowing how life may go. No one is entitled to an inheritance.

This isn't about being entitled to an inheritance. It is about people who have saved for their (and their children's) futures, being prudent v people who just spend all their money, don't save, don't have a plan for the future. The former has to sell their assets and the latter gets taxpayer funded care. How is that fair?

Life isn't fair.
If you save and are prudent you've probably led a life that means you're healthier than the person who threw their money away on silly things. Let's be honest the people who fritter their money away are few and far between. The people you're really complaining about are people like the carers looking after your parents who are working hard in low paid back breaking jobs and can't afford assets like a house. What you're really saying is sting carers twice, once while they're working and again when they need help.

This.

yup. You have to be treated in all respects as a normal tenant.

They don't share rooms
The rooms they have are very small and not much space.
I know of someone who was moved from private to local authority funded and the room was nowhere as big. Visitors had to stand.
No idea about food, etc.

Because that's the way it is.
You get to choose your own care home if you pay.
Some of them are very luxurious these days.
If a person owns a house, they deserve to choose and get a nice care home.
It's tough if your relying on parents home for inheritance.
Go out and earn your own money.

Quite agree
If councils pay the stat amount of £287:50 plus £190 of a persons state pension ( for England as £30 is allowed for pocket money, more in Wales, NI and Scotland )
Thats councils paying £477: 50 / week ( out of our Council Tax Bill )
The average cost to self funders as 2024 stats is £1,160 / week ( which includes the £190 sp.
That’s a difference of £1160 - £477:50 = £682:50 per week or £35,490 every year

I don’t know how others feel about that huge disparity but clearly paying £35,490 a year more than the Council pay for exactly the same service is an absolute disgrace! It’s very clear self funders are personally paying for others

Looking at whole population of 300,000 65plus in care homes. The average cost of that taking into account all fees paid by whoever on a 50/50 basis as it currently stands ( minus sp being used to pay for care just as it currently does for everyone ) and sharing that cost amongst all Working Age People in a sort of Insurance scheme or countrywide tax.
It would currently cost just under £2.50 a week or less than £130 a year per person to pay for that care. Remember our CTax bill is already used to fund the £287:50/wk so for those paying council tax that bill would, in real terms, go down as Social care for pensioners would be removed from it.

Paying £2.50 a week would offer everyone security of care when they need it and everyone is paying for everyone. Rather than a few selling their assets and savings to massively prop up the system for others who are underfunded.

A reduced CTax bill would be nice
or keeping that as it is but having more money for Councils to spend elsewhere would be even better. Councils are on their knees and all age groups are suffering. I’d love to see a return to more community centres, youth schemes and libraries.
I’d happily pay £2.50 a week for that.

can’t remember who I was tagging for this post. It’s taken me all lunch break to do the research and maths 😆

In our area after looking for my MIL council or self funded was irrelevant.
Everyone had the same choice of place and whatever room happened to be available at the time.
Food activities etc was exactly the same for everyone.
Everyone had en-suite
Rooms were not shared for anyone, unless they haven’t been upgraded as sharing isn’t allowed anymore.
There are no statutory sizes as care homes come in all shapes and sizes so rooms are not necessarily all small. Everywhere is different
Council funded could have a bigger room than self funded if that happened to be the room available at the time.

Many others on this thread have said exactly the same.
There's no difference in care or facilities.

Great post @DrPrunesqualer

I doubt that. If yiu were council funded you presumably didn't see the better places.

There’s actually a huge difference. The care home where my parents lived was self funding only, it didn’t accept LA funded residents because it didn’t have to, there was a waiting list. The staff/resident ratio was higher, all the rooms were ensuite, the food was excellent and there was a beautiful garden. If I need a care home that’s what I want and am very happy to pay for it. If I get dementia (extremely likely) what else am I going to spend my money on?

You and some others can delude yourselves all you want that all of the "better" homes only take self-funders, but that isn't the truth.

You and some others can delude yourselves all you want that all of the "better" homes only take self-funders, but that isn't the truth.

Yup.
Same nursing home - FIL self funded (£10,000/month) in one part of the home, MIL (they were divorced) council funded in the secure dementia wing.
Same food, same care, same staff, same rooms (taking into account the different care needs).

My MIL was one of two that was self funded
The other 28 people were council funded.
We are in Kent and looked at everywhere that had places available over the 6 months we were looking.
Not one was purely self funded and not one was purely council funded.
The only place we couldn’t look at was one for nursing care only.

Many others on here have said the same

We also looked for my dad in Hertfordshire, same story.

Absolutely agree.

Yes it just isn't the norm that if you sell your semi you live in a beautiful manor house being waited on and living in luxury. You get the same place but you have to pay. Meanwhile next door who may have rented and spent their retirement lump sum on cruises don't.

It is unjust and wrong.

@ShyMaryEllen
When half my PILs house went to my husband after his father died and he was left that half with my MIL keeping her half
I, as the DIL, signed a legally binding document that clearly stated I had no rights to my dhs half in any form of divorce settlement and neither would our kids.

Solicitors will advice on this.

My Aunty went into a private care home and self funded. I visited her most weeks in her home. She was given good quality care. Staff would pop out and fetch her an ice cream if she asked. They often sat and chatted to the residents. The residents got taken out to places of interest if they wanted to go 2 or 3 times a week. Sometimes they'd go for a drive and go in and get a cream tea somewhere. It was expensive but you get what you pay for. My Aunty didn't have any DC and her DH had died years before so for her it was a good option. She spent all but about £30k before she died. I went to visit a neighbour where I used to live in a council run home. The staff were really run off their feet. They had no time to talk to the residents. The residents never got taken out anywhere and I can't imagine staff would have time to pop out a buy anyone can ice cream. Your parents have earned their money over their lifetime and they should be allowed to pay to get themselves booked into a nice private home. I know if you run out of funds over time the council make you move because my Aunty was worried about having to move into a different care facility. What type of care facility do you want your parents to have? It should be their decision if they are capable of making a decision.

I’d rather give the £36,500 a year to my kids than random people I don’t know in the rooms near me. Just because I’m paying and the Council underfund those that don’t pay the full amount care homes need to survive.
@funnelfan

If you feel that resentful of those people, couldn't you sell your house before you need a nursing home, spend the money on cruises and then rent?

If they've had a lump sum in cash, they've had assets too and spent them, just as you have a right to do if your assets are in property.

If you still have assets by the time you need a care home, you'll need to pay. Seems fair.

If they need care and you don't want to pay for a care home, the only thing to do is for you to provide it another way. Can you give up work and be their full time carer?

If not, do they have a spare room that would allow them to take in a lodger and instead of charging rent allow that lodger to pay by providing personal care?

A friend was looking for a care home for both parents and was told it would be £3k a WEEK for both of them (Brighton area) which worked out at £156k/pa. They hired a private nurse to live on site. I can't remeber what it ended up costing - something in the region of £25k as the nurse then wasn't having to pay rent, bills etc. Is that something you could look into?

Oops mistake that’s £35,490 a year

No there are some very nice, expensive care homes near me that don’t take council funded patients.

Yes, selling then renting is a possibility. I mentioned earlier downsizing to a rental bungalow and buying a motorhome might be an idea.