AIBU to try and prevent care home fees? Advice appreciated

[Watermelonsuns]

So my parents are elderly, both have health issues but managing well at home. My mum in particular would struggle if something happened to my dad. Recently a friend's parent had to go into a care home and as the parent owned their own house and savings they are self funding and the fees are crazy.
AIBU to try and find a way to protect my parent's property and savings in order its not all gone in care home fees in the last years?
Someone has suggested moving their property into my name but surely that would be an obvious way to avoid fees and would look dodgy? Is there another loop hole im missing? Aby advice from someone working in this area would be appreciated thanks

They can’t take into account the house of the other parent is over 65 and still living in the property

So this only works on death or the first parent

Get your parents to do their wills
gets them to own the house 50 -50 - not joint

mirror wills with them leaving each half to you
when one dies. You get there half in a trust
but the other parent has the right to remain in the house via an lifetime interest in the property

social services can’t touch your half of the house

if the other parent needs care only thrrr half of the house is taken into account for care home fees

You want your parents to go into council care homes (basic) so that you can inherit. Yuk.
My mum owns her house, she has Alzheimer´s, we are funding 24 hour care for her at home from pension and savings, when savings run out we will take it out of the house, if in the end she needs to go into a nursing home it will come out of there too. So she can live her last years in confort. But then, I guess my brother and I are not cunts. And no, the taxpayer isn´t there to cover the shortfall either.

I am not going to comment on the morality but legally you have left it too late
Although I will say that the big posh homes are not always the best

YABU. What you’re suggesting is fraud. The money in their property needs to be released to pay for care - that’s what it’s for. Local authority care is rightly means tested and funds stretched to breaking point. If you look like you’ve intentionally deprived yourself of assets you can, rightly, be sued.

Sell the house if needs be and pay for best possible care. Please don’t leave your DPs struggling or unable to cope at home because you - or they - don’t want to pay for care.

The state is broke and people need to self fund. It’s been that way for decades, not sure why you haven’t clocked this before.

im afraid if they are frail and needing care now then its unlikley that you will be able to do anything, as any transfer of property / assets has to be done well in advance, at a point where there is not looking like any need to require care.

there is something if you have moved in as a carer for them, and it is now your only home.
there is also something if they have a vulnerable dependant who lives with them.

Thats the only two things I know which MAY provide a discretionary disregard of property by the council

Leaving aside any moral objections, it won't work.
My Mum looked into it and there are some companies who claim you can do it. She was all set to sign and I asked her to check with her Solicitor who said it was nonsense and she shouldn't go ahead.

I know I could not care for my mum or my FIL if they got to that level, so I accept that their homes may well be used for care and I would want that for them.
The only alternative would be to move them in, provide any care they needed and then see their homes as almost payment for that when they died. But l would not be any good at that and I don’t want that to be how our relationship ends.
If I had a sibling who was prepared to do that, fair play but again I would not expect assets to be split equally after death as they had done the caring.
It’s not your money til it’s your money.

Why shouldn't your parents pay their way? Everyone else has too if they have the means.

It's too late, OP, the time to do it would have been twenty years ago.

The only fair way to fund elderly care is a massive increase in inheritance tax, to spread the load. But that’s a huge vote loser so in the meantime you should just accept it’s not your house or your money until your parents die, and in the meantime their assets should be used to make their lives comfortable

Personally I’d rather my parents went into the best possible home in their old age and if that means no inheritance for me so be it, I am an adult with a job and they are not responsible for me.

Slightly awful that your first thought isn’t how your parents can be as comfortable as possible in their final years.

My grandfather is very elderly and we’re currently in a battle of wills to try and convince him to spend some money to ensure he can remain in his home (a care team, housekeeper, meal delivery style thing), or sell his home for sheltered accommodation or go into the fanciest, nicest home he can afford.

He wants to leave us a fortune. We just want to see him happy, comfortable, well fed and not lonely in his final years. The idea that he might not enjoy the rest of his life for the sake of saving money so the rest of us can have it genuinely makes me want to cry, and is really upsetting my father (his son). I’m a bit grossed out by your thinking.

There is no 7 year rule for deprivation of assets , this only applies to inheritance tax . The money can be deemed deprivation of assets at any point if it thought be have been given away to avoid fees .

My husbands mum went into private care home , then when the money ran out she went to the council one. The difference in them was vast. Like going from a nice 5 star resort to a 2 star. I would want to keep my parents in the best affordable place I could from seeing that all happen. It also scares me to think I could end up at one of the crappy carehomes.. go and take a look round a few now to aid your decision making here and decide for yourself where you would want your parents to spend their last few years on earth.

The only thing I would say is that many elderly people, IMO, should get CHC funding and don't. Our solicitor mentioned we could fight this but we chose not to at the time. Really we should have.

Consider urgently getting Power of Attorney in place so decisions on care can be made by trusted family members. Seek advice on restructuring their assets so joint assets are protected by separation.

I think that is the crux of the argument. Some people will get fully funded places if they have no money. Of course they need care as well but to take absolutely everything from someone who has worked all their lives to pass on something to their children/grandchildren is harsh. I think they leave them enough for a funeral.

@Watermelonsuns

It all sounds far too late I'm afraid. The time for estate planning [for this is what it would seem to be in reality] was years ago and by using [and paying for] a specialist.

Drink and gamble away all your income and get funded. Save it up and get shafted.

Well you wouldn’t be unreasonable if your way of avoiding the fees was to move them into your home and take on the caring responsibilities…

My parents inherited well from their parents and their own property is worth a lot and tbh, I thought I'd be quite comfortable myself in retirement as a result but mum now has dementia and will most likely go into care which will cost approx. £100k per year.

I have never once thought to put their money or property into my name, it's fraudulent and their money isn't mine.

It would have been nice to have received inheritance but it's not a god given right, shit happens and we need to accept this.

If your parents need care then I'm afraid they need to pay if they have property.

And some of those self-funders will be residing in the same care homes who haven’t. The system is so messed up.

Absolutely agree. I love how people are quick to use "I've paid my taxes"... when, in reality and in most cases, their taxes don't even cover what they take out of the system. There is no magic money pot but huge amounts of entitlement over it!

Typically the fully funded places are not the places people would chose

That can be a concern if the money runs out , but often a person will not be moved to a cheaper home - although it will be area specific and depends on how much money is available

And I don't think it's a case of those who live recklessly gambling get funding and those who save don't -- you could phrase that as those with mental problems get funding and those who got lucky in the housing game get to spend their unearned wealth

I'd recommend making sure that they are tenants in common with each will leaving their half to you or whatever family members. That way if one is in care only half their house can be sold to pay fees if the other one dies.

As PP said make sure all assets are split and that's better done with separate accounts.

The house cannot be sold to pay for care if one person is still living there. It becomes fair game if they both go into care.

Remember they may never need care homes if their needs can be met at home and the cost of the house is not taken into account if they remain at home.