Page 6 | Can you teach resilience? What makes one person more resilient than the next?

Lanzarotelady · 2025-01-20T12:52:14+00:00

Genuinely interested in this, what makes one person more resilient than the next? Two people go through the same, ie nurses working in covid ICU, what makes one person cope better than the other? Can resilience be taught? I am asking as we have a pot of money to use at work ( NHS ICU ) and people have asked for resilience training, but I can't help but think, you can't be taught it?

MsGoodWife · 20/01/2025 16:07

I don't know if you can teach resilience but supporting people through events, or even every day issues, is what I try to do at work as a manager.

I'm very "resilient ", but that just means I've been able to handle everything life has thrown at me. So far.
Am I no longer resilient if something happens to knock me down and I can't bounce back next time?
We're all different.

Tittat50 · 20/01/2025 16:18

Can the money be used to give staff a day off? A day away doing something to reinvigorate that has nothing to do with work.

This just stinks of plastering over a gaping wound.

I don't believe you can teach resilience. I believe alot of hideous experiences do build resilience over time for many.

I believe some people have personality types that are more resilient. An individual with a high sensitivity proclivity will potentially suffer more in the face of suffering ( their own and others) and therefore become so affected physically and mentally by certain experiences that they have less capacity for resilience than say a narcissistic personality who won't feel empathy in the same way.

It's just too complex to do a stupid training session on. It's also incredibly belittling to poor staff members who may be off sick, struggling with their mental health or diagnosed and undiagnosed Neurodivergent dealing with burn out.

Maybe the training could highlight the above.

WarmthAndDepth · 20/01/2025 16:19

I loathe the fixation on resilience. I'm naturally a fairly resilient person who bounces back from set-backs relatively well; this often comes up as a positive in performance management etc.

What keeps me showing up for the absolute shower which is my current situation, aspects of which have been rumbling on for over a decade, is trauma and the deep certainty that I can't not keep on. The stakes are too high to ease off. People say "Warmth, you've so much on your plate, I couldn't cope with that." Neither can I, but there's no choice. That's not resilience.

Tittat50 · 20/01/2025 16:24

TrixieFatell · 20/01/2025 15:46

I think in the NHS the word resilience has been used incorrectly in putting the responsibility onto an individual to "deal" with the utter crap conditions they work within as opposed to looking at the system as a whole and the failings and challenges within it. It becomes a stick to beat yourself up with.

Yes to this!

The system we are making you work in is so fucked up we will now allocate resources to gaslight you into self blame and to ' just try harder '.

Whydoeseveryonewanttoargue · 20/01/2025 16:24

Lanzarotelady · 20/01/2025 12:57

There is a pot of money that needs to be used, someone has suggested resilience training for some of our staff

You absolutely can and I have attended more than one useful resilience courses in my time!

Its about understanding your feelings and reactions to things and building confidence in the unknown.

There are many companies that offer this so I would Google and take a look.

Tittat50 · 20/01/2025 16:28

@WarmthAndDepth I second this. I have had the most horrendous experiences pile up over the last 10 years. Most people I known say I couldn't cope with that. And I say, I don't have much choice. Because I don't quite have the inclination or will to actively top myself. There are also others this would impact. I'm not going to just die in my sleep even though I often wish I would. This isn't resilience.

And I'm not depressed. My situation is utterly hellish. Alot of these workers will be dealing with multiple issues, including the environmental they are working in which impacts their responses ( time off sick, apathy, MHealth crisis, physical illness).

Knowitall69 · 20/01/2025 16:52

Tapofthemorning · 20/01/2025 16:01

Honestly @knowitall69? So, and this is my perspective, you take a group of people who are overwhelmed and overworked. Perhaps they've seen difficult things or experienced tragedy. You don't know what's going on at home. Maybe they're ill, or their children are sick, or their parents are unwell - there could be a myriad of reasons - and instead of offering support you implement an authotarian military-style approach that totally ignores empathy and doesn't consider people as individuals. Having someone from the army saying "well I did XXX" in Iraq (which bear in mind a lot of people still don't agree with) so you should be able to cope" invalidates their feelings. It would not increase the productivity of stressed employees. Believe me.

Wow! That was a ramble.

The OP said that her ICU colleagues wanted TRAINING in Resilience. Did you read the original post?

Also interested to see that you consider the Military Medics who work in the NHS as just "authoritarian"

The training the OP wanted was in Resilience..... NOT empathy.

Can't but help notice that there is a huge similarity between what medical staff in the NHS staff have to deal with and what forces personnel have to go through. Thanks for pointing that out.

Oblomov25 · 20/01/2025 16:52

They've asked for resilience training? What an odd request.
No, I don't think it can be taught. But that's because I was just like that, my mum says, even as a young child. Content, but resilient my mum says.

Knowitall69 · 20/01/2025 16:56

Oblomov25 · 20/01/2025 16:52

They've asked for resilience training? What an odd request.
No, I don't think it can be taught. But that's because I was just like that, my mum says, even as a young child. Content, but resilient my mum says.

Rubbish.

HotFlashHeroine · 20/01/2025 16:58

I haven't read the whole thread, but I'll assume other posters have pointed out that it is the ability to cope and bounce back from the normal stresses of life. Some jobs/experiences/contexts are more than normally stressful, so suggesting that a 2 hour webinar or some yoga supports resilience is insulting, and actually adds to stress. There is also mounting evidence that the "wellness" industry does more harm than good.

If I had a sum of money to spend on something to ease stress I'd use it to make the break room more pleasant, quiet and comfortable. That only helps if people are allowed take their breaks, though...

TrixieFatell · 20/01/2025 16:58

Oblomov25 · 20/01/2025 16:52

They've asked for resilience training? What an odd request.
No, I don't think it can be taught. But that's because I was just like that, my mum says, even as a young child. Content, but resilient my mum says.

I imagine it's so they can say that they've done something to help as opposed to actually wanting to help. A bit like the posters they stuck up in the toilets at work to say we shouldn't take things home with us and that thinking of one good thing we've done that day will erase the sheer hell of the shift 😆

Tittat50 · 20/01/2025 17:02

Knowitall69 · 20/01/2025 16:52

Wow! That was a ramble.

The OP said that her ICU colleagues wanted TRAINING in Resilience. Did you read the original post?

Also interested to see that you consider the Military Medics who work in the NHS as just "authoritarian"

The training the OP wanted was in Resilience..... NOT empathy.

Can't but help notice that there is a huge similarity between what medical staff in the NHS staff have to deal with and what forces personnel have to go through. Thanks for pointing that out.

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This post by @Tapofthemorning is probably one of the most insightful and accurate on here. Nothing rambling about this.

I understand that we need people in society who are more impervious to suffering. We even need people with somewhat psychopathic and sociopathic tendencies in some areas of life I believe in order to do things that may be for the greater good.

Certain people do well in the military and we need them. A huge proportion of these guys however come out utterly fucked up, homeless, suicidal and dead. Resilience training is not erasing this outcome.

For our collective well being, yes I'm glad there are some people who can do what others can't.

Support the staff, improve their circumstances, do things that are probably not achievable right now and you wouldn't need to gaslight them with these training programmes.

BetterWithPockets · 20/01/2025 17:10

MrsTerryPratchett · 20/01/2025 15:07

How old is she? Because parenting for resiliency is possible. Training it into harried NHS workers is less easy.

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She’s 11. Year 7 at school.

BetterWithPockets · 20/01/2025 17:12

MsMarch · 20/01/2025 15:09

How old is she? DD is 10. It's definitely not something that comes naturally to her, in part I think it's because she's quite smart, articulate etc, and so many things came so easily to her or just didn't matter that she finds it quite hard when she actually has to put effort in.

But things we've done that have helped her:

When she says she can't do something/ something is too hard/ too scary - just constant reassurance that actually, ANY progress is progress etc. eg I think she's got a fear of heights but can't articulate it. So things like monkey bars or some of the climbing frames she finds hideiously difficult. But we encourage her, stand by, and point out that yes, she did go one rung further than last time etc (because when they're in that spiral they can only see that they can't go the WHOLE way, not that they've made progress).

Things she's terrified/stressed by we talk about in advance and then very specifically about after. eg first school residential. Didn't want to go, was terrified etc etc. We had very specific conversations about how she feels that but we KNOW when she comes back it wil be okay. And then when she DID come back, we pointed it all out again (because, again, they get irrational so I know from experience if you try to be subtle they'll change the narrative in their head or promptly forget that they even found it hard and had to overcome it).

Sometimes we force her to do things she doesn't want to do - it's a thin line here so getting this right is tricky. But again, ti teaches her she CAN do it.

Offer her specific help to improve things and I am not hugely sympathetic to any braod "no, nothing will help" statements. So she was getting stressed about some stuff in maths she couldn't do. Obviously nothing will ever work, she will never crack it, she's useless etc. When we discussed a tutor she told me it was pointless..... needless to say, she's nailed it, she does also ahve a tutor and is doing very well but the thing I'm MOST pleased about is that last week she told me she was struggling with a particlar maths thing again without any of the hysterics that came last time, and she asked if I could let her tutor know so that they could work on it next time.

Also for botg DC we try to help them learn to put things in perspective. "Yes DS, maths is really hard for you but you're really good at these other things. Also, you're very very good at working at things that are hard, so can you apply those skills to improving your maths?" Or "Yes, DDOG is sick and she could die and that would be super super sad. But we'v ehad so many happy times with her and I will always be so glad we've had that - do you remember that time she jumped on DCAT's head and he was so cross? hahahahaha"

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This is useful; thank you. (Your DD sounds similar to mine. Mine is 11, just started at secondary school.)

Knowitall69 · 20/01/2025 17:12

Tittat50 · 20/01/2025 17:02

This post by @Tapofthemorning is probably one of the most insightful and accurate on here. Nothing rambling about this.

I understand that we need people in society who are more impervious to suffering. We even need people with somewhat psychopathic and sociopathic tendencies in some areas of life I believe in order to do things that may be for the greater good.

Certain people do well in the military and we need them. A huge proportion of these guys however come out utterly fucked up, homeless, suicidal and dead. Resilience training is not erasing this outcome.

For our collective well being, yes I'm glad there are some people who can do what others can't.

Support the staff, improve their circumstances, do things that are probably not achievable right now and you wouldn't need to gaslight them with these training programmes.

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Another ramble but an eloquent one.

Tittat50 · 20/01/2025 17:13

@Knowitall69 I do try 🤷‍♀️😆

Littlemisscapable · 20/01/2025 17:14

Gumbuyahpark · 20/01/2025 13:01

I’m not sure that resilience can be taught as such. I think we can learn strategies such as mindfulness or self care that might help people cope more easily with the stress of deaths of patients, for example (but perhaps this might be seen by some as teaching resilience?)

For me, my resilience level changes with my stress/personal issues. For example, when I was undergoing multiple surgeries, two grandparents dying and a friendship breakdown, I was not resilient and really struggled with things at work that normally I’d breeze through. Currently, I’m healthy, I’m happy and these same work issues are a non event. I say all this to illustrate that resiliency is unique to the individual and not set in stone.

Edited

Yes I agree with this.

BBQPete · 20/01/2025 17:16

Blanketenvy · 20/01/2025 14:14

I work in the NHS and a lot of focus in last few years seems to be being spent on 'wellbeing'- managing stress, reducing absence.
To be honest it feels like being gaslit, you put people in impossible systems with ridiculous pressures and then throw them a half hour mindfulness thing at 4.30 one day.
It doesn't build resilience it just makes people cross.
If you can't change the system and reduce the pressures then at least use the money to provide meaningful support-good supervision, access to therapy, adequate training for the job they are doing, time to attend medical appointments etc..

Absolutely this.
Not NHS, but also public funded.
Forced to waste an afternoon with some trainer teaching you it would be good to go outside and stand by a tree and breath in the air, whilst continually adding to a caseload that would have kept 4 people busy.

BBQPete · 20/01/2025 17:18

Like the very first reply, from your title, I was coming on to say "Yes, and it is really important that parents do that", because I do think teaching children resilience from when they are young is a great thing for a parent to do but I don't think it is something you can go on a 3 hour training session and learn, as an adult, no.

So I don't know which way to vote.

outerspacepotato · 20/01/2025 17:20

You can teach coping methods and stress management techniques. There's mindset. But there are other factors at play.

Critical care is one of the more stressful jobs around due to the nature of the job. Things like not able to get food breaks, working up to 18 hours because somebody called in, and shift work and too many patients per nurse and lack of support staff and the emotional toll of dealing with death. Having 9 vents because two people called in and management didn't bother to get anyone else in.

The health service needs to look at the actual job conditions people are working under. Look at shitty management.

littleducks · 20/01/2025 17:21

I think strategies to support resilience can be taught. Also work van be done in the environment (might not take away as the barriers and problems but can solve some be being more psychologically informed(.

I work in a similar environment but paediatric and the current funding is on TRIM training (https://www.marchonstress.com/page/p/trim) not sure if that's something you are familiar with?

We have also had training I've felt helpful which incorporated ACT therapy principles

Superhansrantowindsor · 20/01/2025 17:23

You can’t learn it on a training course. Resilience comes from a life time of perseverance through adversity or through participation in competitive sports.

JandamiHash · 20/01/2025 17:24

I think people who’ve had hardships in life obviously have better resilience and perspective. The amount of young adults who crumble these days because something doesn’t go their way is quite alarming.

If your child doesn’t have a natural hardship then saying no, letting them go without now and again, and keeping perspective and not pandering the every problem in a permissive parenting “Your voice matters, darling” kind of way helps.

Also not avoiding heartache and not being afraid of child your child being upset.. I know people whose children aren’t told when their great grandparents died! The parents just hoped they didn’t notice!! All in the name of keeping them from being upset.

LifeBeginsNow · 20/01/2025 17:28

I've just been doing a course on this via FutureLearn (free). Some of the thoughts discussed last week I was already aware of but some were new.
The idea of treating resilience in a holistic manner has prompted me to look at areas I lack (time outdoors, exercising, relaxing) and understand that if I don't meet these requirements, I will fail at the meer mention of a change/ set back.
I'm looking forward to this week's session (it's only a 2 session course and mainly just watching videos and interacting with peers about our own thoughts).
For what it's worth, I do think resilience can be learnt.

Tittat50 · 20/01/2025 17:29

@JandamiHash yes I think somewhere in the middle is best. And so much of it starts in childhood. The truth always is my parenting philosophy. No matter how ugly. You ask, you'll get the truth. I don't think mollycoddling helps.

But it's so much more complex than this.