Child in all day detention for something they didn't do.

[rooby252]

Hi,
I'm just trying to see if this is common practice in secondary schools really.
One of my children was kept in an all day detention for 1.5 days for something that happened after school and he wasn't responsible for.
He was at a bus stop with a few other children from his year group (year 8) and another boy threw a plastic bottle on to the floor. It bounced off the floor. It didn't hit anyone or anything and didn't break.
A teacher apparently saw the incident and saw my son wasn't involved, but the school kept the 4 children in detention for 1.5 days- knowing exactly who had thrown the bottle- waiting to see if the boy responsible would own up.
They missed out on all lessons, just doing work they had already done in year 7.
I feel really angry about it but am thinking this might just be how school do things these days?

Well, if you had read my response, he wasn't lying and I've never said that he's as innocent as the driven snow!
I agree that he probably can learn from it.

Well thank goodness you aren't my children's parent then. As I've said, he was telling the truth.

mumedu · Today 05:46

Oh please. Stop making excuses for him. Schools don't keep people in detention gor no reason.

They certainly used to. I was 13 and 4 lads at the back wouldn't stop mucking about, the teacher put the whole class in detention, even though we were quiet and trying to get on with work.

Perhaps you could stop viewing it from the teacher who cannot manage a class' point of view and start putting yourself in the shoes of children who have to put up with not only a teacher who cannot effectively manage a class but also disruptive class mates who are being disruptive because of the terrible class management. Some of whom then get put in detention for a day and a half for something they didn't do. Which frankly should be against the law as it is tantamount to child abuse.

The children who are disruptive in DC's class have personal problems and are so far behind with work they simply cannot do the work - detention and isolation and punishment is the last thing they need.

Also, in DC's school the children are better behaved generally in classes where the teacher engages in a positive way. In classes where they are terrified of teachers they may be quieter, but negativity comes out in other ways and it really affects the rest of the class.

Honestly, the law should be changed around this, prohibiting mindless punishments, and schools given up to date training drawing on child development research about what is and is not effective class management.

There seems to be something really wrong with what is coming out of the department of education if this is how schools are at the moment. What is happening will be causing or contributing to serious mental health problems in children.

As I said upthread, the law should be changed around this, prohibiting mindless punishments, and schools given up to date training about what is and is not effective class and children management.

But look back again at your list of why your children have been given detentions OP and ask yourself honestly do you genuinely think these are the real and unabridged reasons they were punished? Or do you accept that there's no smoke without fire? I don't doubt that there's still a few 'Mr Sugdens' out there teaching but I reckon the majority are just trying to get through the day and do what's best for all the kids tbh.

And do you know what, even if the teachers are being unfair to some extent that's life. Your kids will be put in equally unjust situations in their adult life and need to learn to cope with it in a mature and responsible way. Their parents can kick and scream about how unfair it is but ultimately it won't help them manage these situations in the real world.

They have no jurisdiction outside school hours.

Stop spending half your life on mumsnet for a start. Mumsnet is very timeconsuming. Very difficult to have sympathy with how busy teachers are when quite a lot seem to dominate threads on mumsnet. Every time you want to post on MN, stop, and do something positive to enrich children's lives instead.

Start a book or a sheet which passes from home to school where you can quickly jot down notes to parents. Will take no time and means you won't get questioned or taken into meetings when parents want to know what the h is going on at school. Introduce this idea to the other teachers and the head, instead of posting on MN.

Much better time management.

So disruption is the teacher's fault? Do you not feel like children's behaviour is their parents' job, not the teacher's?

Their job is to teach, which the majority does very well when they are no disruptive elements in the class!

God I love how patronising people are with people who work in the public sector. They have all the answers and yet they don't want to do the job themselves 🤔 Some people want literal blood from teachers/doctors/nurses then wonder why nobody wants to do these jobs.

Not accessing the work is no excuse for disruption though, what upper rubbish! So it is OK your child's education is disrupted because these poor kids have problems and are disruptive? I do feel for the children, but I don't see why my child or the teacher should suffer as a result.

Have you read the school's behaviour policy. Ours is "Internal Exclusion
A period of Internal Exclusion (to the Inclusion Room) may be appropriate following a single serious incident, or prolonged and repeated disruptive behaviour. A Head of Year or member of SLT will make the recommendation. Parents will be informed by telephone or email before the day in the Inclusion Room takes place, and it will be followed up with a confirmation letter within 7 days. "

With regards to the list of reasons they have had detentions- I can only comment on the ones where I've spoken to the school. Looking at a fly, blazer being taken off without permission etc, I've just told my children to take the punishment and follow the rules (ie wait for permission to take the blazer off).
The teacher who shouted at my son for asking where the Middle East is and sent him out of class, (where he was then told off again by another teacher and told he had a detention) did later apologise and said they had assumed he was trying to make the class laugh. When he said it was a genuine question they told him they were sorry but he had already been shouted at and punished by this point.
The looking guilty incident, again he was proven to have had no involvement but not until after he had sat the detention!
I'm not sure if it's teaching them anything useful for the real world

It's the context that you're missing OP. Yes, he was punished for asking where the middle east is and that on its own, is unjustified. But how was his behaviour beforehand? Was he trying to entertain his mates? Was he chatting, interrupting? Was it another silly question to stop the flow and make people laugh? Was it a genuine question or a I'll pretend to be interested question? If you imagine a scenario where the class is quietly listening to the lesson, someone puts their hands up, the teacher gives them the go ahead to talk and they ask where the middle East is, I reckon no detention would be given or the class would be up in arms at the unfairness. No one was, because let's face it, what seems in isolation an innocent question was in in likelihood the last straw on the camel's back.

Don't be silly. I'm not a teacher, but why are you allowed to post on mumsnet in your spare time and teachers aren't?

Every time you want to post on MN, stop, and do something positive to enrich children's lives instead.

I'm fairly sure that if he had been chatting before hand he wouldn't have been in the classroom to even ask the question!

Ok. Whatever you say OP.

Your child got a detention for looking at a fly?

You’re honestly telling us that the school confirmed your kid looked at a fly and got detention? You didn’t question that at all?

Given how much time a child spends at school, and how much impact school has on a child, it is both. Both the parents and the teachers'. I am really surprised if teachers needed to be told this (I am not sure whether or not you are a teacher?)

There are some really good ways of handling disruptive pupils, and none of detention, isolation or other "punishment" are one of them.

Is it one of those slant schools or whatever they're called where all the kids are expected to keep their eyes on the teacher the whole time?

Indeed, and they certainly do nowadays for very slight things.

30 years ago the only detentions I ever had were whole class detentions. I certainly hadn't done anything to warrant it.

No I'm not saying the school confirmed it. If you read my reply I said that things like looking at a fly/ taking blazer off etc I just tell my children to follow the rules and do the detention. The punishments I've spoken to the teachers about (asking where the Middle East is and the throwing of a bottle etc), they have apologised for.
I generally trust that teachers are doing the best for the children in their care and I let them get on with it, but I will question something if I feel its not right.

You aren't a teacher? So you are "backing" teachers but you are spending a lot of time on threads backing teachers but you are not a teacher and you don't have expertise around teaching?

And this applies to other posters here presumably?

You are doing some kind of recon mission?!

Sorry, this is in response to Batsandeggs