Court summons for mobile phone driving

[Onlyme234]

Hi all
I was caught sending a text on my phone in standstill traffic in March last year. Silly of me but a police officer was walking past and caught me. I got issued an FPN and received a letter in the post with a £200 fine and then details of how to surrender my license details online. I didn't realise that I also had to send off my license, fill out a form and send that off too. I honestly just didn't read the form properly.
I paid the fine and did it online but didn't send the form off. In September, I received a refund of the £200 and a court summons.
I'm due to go to court on the 23rd and was wondering if anybody had any advice?
I want to just go in and be super honest and say it was human error and I didn't read the form properly. Has anyone ever had this before and received more points or a larger fine?
Do they just reissue the same as on the FPN or am I at risk for more?
Any advice valued please

Not really. It's not too much to ask that a midwife can comply with regulations and details. Same as a driver. Lives are at stake in both roles.

To clarify, you can use your phone as a sat nav if it is in a holder attached to the dashboard, but you CAN NOT touch it all while driving, even in traffic. In other words, it's ok to set your journey on your phone before you turn your engine on and start out, but you may not touch it again until you are parked up with the engine off. So if you have to reset or reroute, you have to pull over first.

My son in law had a similar misunderstanding for a speeding ticket

he was then fined £500 instead the initial £100

i don’t think he attended court as it was a 140mile trip to the county where he’d been speeding

he was on a bypass doing 70moh as that the limit but hadn’t seen the change of speed limit

And you would be commiting an offense if you did this.

I don't know how many times it has to be said: you may not touch your phone at all whilst driving, even in traffic. If you need to notify someone that you'll be late, you must pull over and turn your engine off first.

God, so sanctimonious.

Patients'.

I wonder how many people who berated the OP (who hasn’t made excuses and has accepted there will be punishment) have ever tapped their sat nav screen while in traffic.

Standard MN. I’m a primary school teacher and honestly wouldn’t let my class of six year old children talk to people the way some adults think is acceptable on here!

Of course the OP shouldn’t have been texting while in a stationary line of traffic. And she knows that and has paid her fine, she was asking for advice on a bloody admin oversight where she didn’t read a form properly! We’ve all done things like that in a rush! The OP hasn’t murdered anyone and some of these responses are both OTT and not answering the original post!

Hi - used to be lawyer in criminal defence. They prosecution will have note that you paid fine etc so they’ll back your position up. I’d be surprised if you got any additional fine or more points than the minimum. Just turn up on time, don’t make excuses and apologise profusely.

I do hope you read the patient records with much more care and attention than you seem to have read this form.

This.

When I walk down the street in Oxford at rush hour so I am going faster than the traffic, I would need more than one hand to count the number of people on their phones in the traffic jam. I wish the police would walk down the street too because it’s become so socially acceptable that I think most people don’t think they will be caught.

Were the police to walk down the street, they would also risk being knocked over by bicycles and electric scooters on the pavement but that’s a whole other story.

100% agree.
These threads always bring out the Perfect Penelopes who think that because it is in AiBU, anything goes, rather than recognising that many posters come here for traffic.

I've just paid a speeding fine. Very different to how it was. I sent off the letter saying it was me - then I had to wait for a letter telling me how to pay and what to do. I paid over the phone and got a reference number then had to send off the form with my drivers licence details on it.

Although all the information is there it's really easy to miss.

Please take the time before your court case to jot down some key phrases to use. Apologise - and again. Tell them you've learned, your phone will be zipped up in your bag from now on, that you hadn't realised that stationary didn't mean you couldn't use your phone but you know that now.

Do labour the point about being a student nurse and on limited income - think about how the outcome of a case could really impact your ability to study and pursue your vocation.

The court isn't after you. If you want to get the best result you can then really prepare what you want to say and make it good. I know this from personal experience, I helped a family member who was about to lose their licence and it worked, they didn't.

You can do this. Prepare and rehearse until you're word perfect and comfortable saying it. Very best to you and ignore the finger-waggers who relish threads like this - don't have anything in your head except what's best for you and your situation.

@Onlyme234 - I don't know if anyone else has suggested this but note the following.

The magistrates's sentencing guidelines say:

"... where a penalty notice could not be offered or taken up for reasons unconnected with the offence itself, [my bold for emphasis] such as administrative difficulties outside the control of the offender, the starting point should be a fine equivalent to the amount of the penalty and no order of costs should be imposed. The offender should not be disadvantaged by the unavailability of the penalty notice in these circumstances."

See here: 5. Penalty notices – fixed penalty notices and penalty notices for disorder – Sentencing

This means that you can respectfully ask the court to fine you at no more than the FPN level. It doesn't mean they will do so, but the guidelines say they "should".

So plead guilty (I presume you accept you were guilty as you tried to pay the fixed penalty?) and If there is a mitigation section on your plea form you can say that you inadvertantly paid the penalty notice without realising you needed to send your licence details back. It was an admin error unconnected with the offence itself and you respectfully ask the court to follow the guidelines as I've linked to above and not punish you more the penalty notice.

If you've already returned your plea form attend court and make the same mitigation plea in person.

As I say, you may be lucky or you may not. But if you don't ask...

Good luck

I hope you've learned something important from it, if you aren't paying attention and don't read things properly when you're a nurse, you could do some serious damage to someone.

have you had one of these forms?

Further to my previous post.

I know that the sentencing guidelines show an example (note - example only) of admin difficulties outside the control of the defendant.

That doesn't necessarily mean that the guidelines can't apply to admin difficulties within the control of the defendant.

What's important is that the admin error was "unconnected with the offence itself"

No guarantee of success but...

To be honest, if I get an official form in relation to a driving offence, or anything else, (three speeding offences in about 9 years: 36 in a 30, 45 in a 40, 24 in a 20) I read the form once, twice and then again to make sure it's pitch perfect. Because it matters.

I would have thought a student nurse would have significant attention to detail; if not let's hope they are never in charge of the drugs trolley or have to read a patient's notes.

In support of the op if she was in stationary traffic sending a quick text was not dangerous and in my opinion a fine is disproportionate. A qyick twlling off from the bobby should have been sufficient.

I don’t know about the fine etc but don’t be too hard on yourself as we’ve all done it.

I did it just last week when I was stuck in a traffic jam and had to ring work to let them know and my hands free wasn’t working.

If you’ve got your handbreak on, then nothing bad can happen and so it’s a silly law but it’s understandable as it’s easier to have a blanket rule.

I try and just turn my engine off and then do it, even if it means the traffic starts moving at that point and I have to start it up again.

Shock horror! Nurses are not ‘robots’ or ‘angels’ (or dragons pending which mumsnet thread your reading!) they make mistakes! It does not mean they’re incompetent at their job. Like the rest of society they can perform well at work but have a moment of madness!

However, please do not try and use a ‘difficult uni course’ or ‘being a nurse’ to your advantage like suggested. It makes a mockery of the profession. Nurses do not deserve ‘special treatment’. The role had no impact whatsoever in this instance.

As you’ve stated you’ve done ‘the crime’, admitted it and not read the forms. It doesn’t matter what course you are doing or what your employed as.

Counselling? What for?

Turn up to court, apologise and hope for the best. Seek guidance from uni when you know know the outcome. I wouldn’t worry about your future career tho, motoring convictions like this won’t affect you.

difficulties outside the control of the offender

And

This means that you can respectfully ask the court to fine you at no more than the FPN level. It doesn't mean they will do so, but the guidelines say they "should".

What? This is for people with disabilities, or who didn't get the letter due to a postal issue, etc. Not for people who, totally within their control, just didn't read the instructions.

She can, of course, respectfully ask. But there's nothing to suggest they "should" do it.

It was an admin error unconnected with the offence itself

I dunno, not reading things or not understanding rules feels like a theme for this poster.

(It wasn't an "admin error", it was clearly negligence. The rules were there, she didn't read them).

We're not here to be polite, we're here to be honest.

And maybe you don't read legal forms properly or take them seriously either, but that doesn't mean it's something people should be doing. For exactly these kinds of reasons. Rushing through a form is fine for things like what you want for breakfast at a hotel or giving permission for your kids' school trip, not legal requirements to avoid court.

It makes me concerned how many people who vote potentially end up voting for someone or something they didn't intend to or their vote got discounted because they "rushed through it."

You would still get fined for this. The car has to be parked off the road. It’s not good enough to have the handbrake on and engine off apparently

What an unpleasant, sanctimonious, patronising and unhelpful group have people have piled onto this thread
Glad I don't know most of you in real life!