Why do so many people criticise vegans?

[trunch]

I'm a meat eater!

However, I don't understand why people criticise vegans so much.

They aren't hurting me and are trying to save animals and the environment.

What's wrong with that?

Surely people should be more critical of me because animals are killed for me to eat?

And this is why some people criticise vegans…

Yes, for the truth.

Your version of the truth

My reasons:
1 - I don't want to hear about it every five seconds
2 - If you come round mine, I don't to have to make something separately, catering JUST to you
3 - If we go out, I don't want to go past 50 restaurants because they have nothing you can eat
4 - When we're in a restaurant, I don't want to hear how they have few options, or that the stuffed pepper you had was boring

Vegans are like runners... if you didn't know before meeting them, don't worry, you will after five seconds.

An animal is killed to be eaten. How is that a ‘version of the truth’

Totally with you on this.

I'm not vegan, for no other reason other than that I'm weak. Sometimes I'm pretty much there, other times I'm off the wagon and anything goes.

Mad respect for people who manage it 24/7.
Good on them. Maybe one day I'll make it.

The whole 'it's humane' argument is utter nonsense. But lots of people are, as pp mentioned, still in the cult. And I'm living proof that even when you see it, it can be hard to shake off the conditioning.

I understand why lots of people don't go vegan 'for health reasons' too though. Not because it isn't possible to be very healthy and vegan. It very much is.

But I don't think it's fair to say anyone can do it. Because that doesn't take in the capability of the individual. And if they have certain intolerance and illness, that can compound things.

Does that excuse, morally, the deaths? No.

But I'd advocate for everyone doing what they can when they can and raising the new generations to be aware of things and consistently work towards being vegan. Hopefully, that way, in a few generations, we might all get there.

Is this wishy washy? Yes. Absolutely.
But I feel it mire genuine than than the view point of 'it's humane and we need it so let's all ignore evil, tralalalala'. Like, if you don't know how to change or, suck at other, just be honest with yourself. Because if you think these industries are OK...you're either unaware of what goes on or, in denial.

I bet vegans like you too.

Indeed, god forbid you befriend someone who doesn’t like to eat the exact same food as you.

How do you know if someone hates vegans, don’t worry they’ll tell you!

@Pinkbonbon you’re right it’s not entirely possible for everyone, my older sister is coeliac and would love to be vegan but most gluten free items like bread contain egg.
She does her best at home but out and about is often restricted and has to order whatever is safe.
Needs must and the definition of veganism states “as far as is possible and practicable”
I think the aim for a bulk of people should just be progress not perfection. The world needs millions of imperfect vegans right now, not a handful of perfect ones.
You’re not weak if you’re doing what you can, that’s better than doing nothing.

Because some eating choices have Victims. Maybe that’s it.

So we continue to allow evil.

There's no way to rear any food, whether animal or vegetable, without killing animals in the process.
Crops and vegetables will displace species from their habitat, then kill more animals in order to rear them, whether through pesticide use or shooting them to protect crops (eg deer and boar, half the French spend most of their winter going this for instance).
Then further deaths during harvesting.

A lot of non-organic crop and vegetable production is also absolutely horrible for soils. Every living thing in them killed, then industrial fertilisers added back, the run-off of which is often catastrophic for fish in bodies of water downstream of the run-off.

You may feel better because you're not eating the actual dead creatures, but they still died so you could eat.

In fairness, all those statements also apply to me as a coeliac. I know it’s fucking irritating to others, which is why I don’t eat when I go out with people (also don’t want to take the risk of being turned inside out on the toilet for three days afterwards).

So I do understand where you are coming from, even though my irritating eating is medical and not a choice.

Also as a coeliac my biggest bugbear is being lumped in with Vegans. I don’t often eat processed free from foods as it’s full of chemical shit and I’d need to remortgage to regularly eat bread, pasta, cereal, biscuits and cake, but when I do, I usually have veganism forced on me as many things are gluten free, milk free, meat free all rolled into one and it’s just shit.

The vitriol is insane.

If you replaced the word "vegan" in that and many other of the vegan bashing posts with "coeliac", "Hindu", "Jain", "FODMAP" or any other group of people who follow a special diet it wouldn't be acceptable (and indeed, would be downright offensive) to speak about them in this way.

Yet people seem to think vegans are fair game.

I don't like vegans. They are ruining my vegetarian food! So many restaurants are starting to do a vegan option instead of a vegetarian and a vegan option. Which I realise is easier for the restaurant but I want real cheese!!!! Curse those vegans (joke ish but seriously restaurants please keep your veggie options!)

But humans eat less plant food than livestock do. If you look at feed conversion ratios this becomes obvious. Less land is required to feed someone a plant-based diet than an animal inclusive diet. Therefore far less deaths on a plant based diet.

Maybe but a lot of posters have said it’s not due to guilt, so what about calling an animal a victim (which, technically is true, it is the victim of slaughter, it has been killed by someone) enrages people so?

Yes it is a humanising term but often used as a counter point to the ongoing objectification of animals. How else would you describe an animal that has been killed, eg a pet mistreated, other than a victim of that abuse?

In the US it was ruled that animals can be legally regarded as victims of crime eg. Serious cases of animal abuse.

Curious, because other vegetarians have said similar, are you not vegetarian for ethical reasons? I thought all vegetarians didn’t eat meat for ethical reasons until they started saying these things. As dairy is just as unethical as the meat industry (in that dairy cows also killed at a fraction of their lifespan) I thought vegetarians would embrace the opportunity to be given more ethical choices.

I have nothing against vegans at all but I'm not keen on gluten free being lumped in with vegan in people's minds. Those of us with a fairly nasty health condition are regularly lampooned as attention seeking, holier than thou, a nuisance to go places with etc by ignorant people. But bizarrely, actually obtaining a meatless GF meal out is hard work. I think people just don't and won't understand diets other than their own. To me if someone has a health issue diet they deserve sympathy and support and if someone has a choice based diet then that's their business, what they do/do not eat doesn't bother me. The rise in vegan choices is surely due to supply and demand, if people want them places will sell them.

So what’s the alternative, we all just starve?

There is a massive difference between growing vegetables and slaughtering cows and this sort of thing always comes up as if we don’t live in a world where huge swathes of land are used to grow food for livestock, not even for humans to eat!

So we should all just eat meat because growing vegetables is bad for the soil, rather than cut down on chemicals used, not mentioning the sheer amount of animal waste that pollutes the waterways and kills ecosystems.

Its the evangelical nature of veganism.

Its not enough to be quietly vegan and eat what you want.

Most vegans seem to feel they must:

• tell everyone they are vegan
• tell omnivores 1000 reasons why it would be better to be vegan
• tell you any form of animal product consumption involves cruel torture

Do you what you want. But do it quietly - stop trying to tell everyone else they must too.

I know your post is lighthearted but just ask for cheese. I did it for years. Hi I’ll have the veggie pasta / burger/ pizza please but can I have it with dairy cheese. Literally no problem. But I can see why it’s annoying because I was in your position.

@roota coeliacs come in for it too. We are accused of being fussy, attention seeking, drama llamas, 1st world problems etc. Many believe coeliac disease is not real and just an excuse for people to be a pain.

I am not Vegan but have two Vegan DIL's. Cooking for them has opened my eyes to the choices out there, and DH and I now eat much less meat/dairy than before. They don't preach and are delighted that we cater for them when they come here. Why wouldn't we? Everyone is entitled to make their own choices and be accommodated. We have found some tasty food as a by product.

That said, I worked with a Vegan/Veggie who preached at every opportunity and also fell out with so many people due to her attitude. Every time we ate out she would make a comment, which was tiresome.

So, IMO it is not the choices made re food, but the person's personality that causes issues.

Out of interest in real life who is doing any of these things to you, directly and personally?

(Aside from the vegans in this thread which is dedicated to the topic)

It feels like this comes up a lot but I don’t know anyone who would approach a stranger in real life and tell them what to do, nor do I have any friends I’ve mentioned it to who haven’t asked first (see my original comment pages back about being asked at client lunches, new friends’ houses, etc)

How many vegans do you know in order to claim that “most vegans” do this sort of thing?

So what’s the alternative, we all just starve?

No, we just don't call each other "evil" for our food choices.

God gives me strength, I cannot with this ridiculous argument xD

So if I accidently run someone over with my car, I might as well go join the Talaban and murder a bunch of people deliberately?

By existing we do harm, sp the logical thing to do is to work on minimising it. Not go 'fuck it, I'll just kill everything'