To think we shouldn't be funding this on the NHS?

[AgileJadeDog]

I recently had my first stay in hospital due to a respiratory issue and I kid you not, every other person in the bay smoked+had a smoking related disease.

I have no idea if this is typical in other specialties/hospitals but it really hit me how much gets spent on completely self inflicted stuff. AIBU to think we shouldn't be funding stuff like this?

Smoking is a bad choice for everyone.

Not if you grow tobacco or make cigarettes ...

Maybe just don't have new arrivals ?

What about the many doctors and other hospital staff who smoke? Should they not be allowed to use the services they work in? 😂 I'm not a fan of smoking but you are being massively U to suggest a 2 tier system.

>>where a good percentage of my pay check is going
A good percentage of your what? Your "pay check"? Does anyone here get a "pay check"?

>>I have no idea if this is typical in other specialties/hospitals
Did you by any chance grow up in a country where people are afraid of <shudders> socialised medicine and "death panels"? Might this perhaps be colouring your attitude to non-judgemental universal treatment?

You don’t seem to understand how social inequalities work. Many chronic, life time smokers are now elderly and research shows that smoking and childhood adversity and poverty are linked. Often people started smoking very very young as a way of coping with traumatic life experiences and not having any other coping resources available. It becomes a habit, a comfort, perhaps the only thing that is comforting. It was also totally normalised back then. The reasons why younger people smoke are also more complex than just deliberately doing something ‘stupid’. Again it often comes down to a way of regulating stress, of living in poverty where there’s less opportunity for healthier coping mechanisms - that tend to cost money. As a psychologist I have also worked with many people who view smoking as deliberate self harm - a way of wanting to prematurely end their lives but in a less obvious (or foolproof) way than other methods.

I think all addiction should be viewed through a lens of compassion, not judgement. Think yourself lucky that you have not personally experienced it and been afforded more privileges in life than those you denigrate.

I don’t believe shaming people and increasing stigma is a solution, no. I believe the solution lies in eradicating the health and social inequalities that are strongly linked to addictive behaviours.

These people have probably given up hope. Sad.

Would you allow free treatment for those that used to smoke but have now given up and have COPD?

A good percentage of your what? Your "pay check"? Does anyone here get a "pay check"?

They will learn. But at the moment bots have a terrible US-centric slant. It's debatable whether it can ever be trained out of them. Work continues.

Colon cancer can be caused by a poor diet. Throat cancer can be caused by oral sex. Should we leave people who don't manage their diabetes and need amputations to sort themselves out?

There's better things the NHS should stop funding!

Excellent points!

Plane is hurtling towards the ground. You can either start smoking or parachute out. You’ve never done either. Which ever one you pick will save the plane from crashing. Which one would you choose?

Healthy living is not always the choice those with health privilege make it out to be!

It is much more complicated than just saying it is their choice.

Smoking is incredibly addictive and it’s even harder to quit when you’re very ill I would have thought.

It’s not for the NHS to make a moral judgement about whether someone is deserving of treatment- if the NHS offer a treatment say, dialysis, it should be for everyone who medically qualifies for it.

I view smoking related illness similarly to obesity. We should always fund the care. At the same time, every effort must be made to help people make the lifestyle changes necessary to avoid the risk, and that's complex but must be at the forefront of health policy.

My mum had COPD. She met many at support groups who had never smoked. My mum was born with pneumonia, had a very severe case of Whooping cough as a child, grew up in a polluted inner city area with coal fires and an asbestos factory nearby. When she eventually moved out to the suburbs as an adult it happened to be an area with a very high incidence of asthma and other lung problems (suspect that the nearby breeze block factory impacted this). Her lungs had no fucking chance and by her 40’s she had 30% long function.. You are vile, denying someone like her medical treatment. Have you watched someone die of respiratory illness. Shall I describe it to you?

I came from a deprived childhood (worse than most) and guess what I have never smoked. I chose not too when offered a smoke. My parents decided to stop smoking when they decided to have kids. For all their faults they made this choice. The risks weren’t known then but they could see the harm smoking caused. Smoking has help now for the nicotine addiction. I don’t agree with the poor smokers, they have social inequalities because it’s a clear choice. The selfish smokers who inflict secondhand smoke injury on others are truly the worst. I always laugh at those here who try to make their point based on fake professional knowledge. You’re not a psychologist.

Better tell our local hospital to stop treating rugby injuries all afternoon on a Saturday then (it would certainly cut waiting times!)

Treating smoking-related diseases places a significant financial burden on the NHS. However, others would argue / say that tobacco taxes already contribute substantial revenue to public coffers.

This. I've never been provided with anyone else's medical records while in hospital, myself.

I've been an overeater and a heavy smoker. I've had mental health issues. But I know first hand that you can give up a 20 year 30 a day habit from one day to the next, and that you can lose weight (I have the same weight and measurements as 50 years ago). So whilst I'm sympathetic and I know how complex it is, I also know that if you want to, you can.

I understand your view but it’s complex.

Some people have hard lives and they abuse substances and unhealthy things to cope - does that mean these people deserve help less should they get ill?

Smoking is oftrn started when people are too young to grasp the consequences or at a low point. It becomes a crux and an addiction. If you look at the tabacco companies they have traditionally lobbied the government, hidden medical research around the dangers and made a lot of money off of harming the general population. The addiction element means that many people can not give up easily or at all, despite trying. And despite all of this, cigarettes are still perfectly legal. To start smoking can be a choice made by young or vulnerable people, then they can't stop. I come from a family of smokers and my mum was able to give up easily, my dad still can't despite years of trying. I think it's only right the government fund treatment for smokers seeing as they havr spent so many years helping the tobacco companies to expand their empires and are only just now deciding to legislate more heavily against it.

Well not for the living human who is being born

Let me guess..

• You consider yourself a responsible driver (amazing isn't it, no one ever considers themselves an average or below average driver - despite that statistically half of all drivers fall into this category).
• You don't smoke.
• You aren't obese.
• You don't do 'extreme' sports, but you might do something 'normal' like tennis.

So 'self-inflicted' is basically for everyone else, but not you.

Same for alcohol!

Should midwifery services be provided free on the NHS? After all, it is a self-inflicted need.