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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Tenant’s ’friend’ locked out

241 replies

Catcherintherice · 26/12/2024 22:50

I am a landlord and around an hour ago took a phone call from my tenant. He is visiting family and accidentally locked out his friend who lives with him. Friend has no key and apparently no money as his cards are in the flat.
The friend is not a tenant and has never been a permitted occupier. Today is the first time the tenant has told me he is actually living there.
The flat is over 30 miles from me. I have visitors and have been drinking. I am probably not over the legal limit but I never drive after any alcohol.
I am not really happy about giving access to someone who isn’t a tenant, but as the tenant says he is there, I have offered that he can get someone to collect a key from my home.
I can’t think of anything else. I have posted in AIBU as I don’t think I’m being unreasonable in not offering anything else, and can’t think of what more I can do.
He has contacted a locksmith who has quoted over £400, and wants payment before he comes out.

OP posts:
ExceededUsefulEconomicLife · 27/12/2024 18:17

@MadinMarch I think a managing agent would meet the cousin that I'd asked them to meet because I was busy/unable. Obviously!

penelopelondon · 27/12/2024 18:36

I would arrange a visit to the house in a couple days with the excuse of changing the locks and get to see "what the heck is going on" with the snakes, the rodents and the 'cousin' because the whole thing doesn't sound good.

custardcreme77 · 27/12/2024 18:48

I’m worried about the poor animals 🙁

Catcherintherice · 27/12/2024 19:02

custardcreme77 · 27/12/2024 18:48

I’m worried about the poor animals 🙁

Please see updates. The tenant’s friend/cousin likely has access by now.

OP posts:
Paul2023 · 27/12/2024 19:36

MadinMarch · 27/12/2024 17:33

What do you think a managing agent will do in this situation?
My guess is that they would do exactly nothing. They would advise the tenant to get a locksmith out- they may at most recommend one to the tenant.
It's not much of an emergency in an agents eyes as it's fully within the power of the tenant to sort this problem out by getting and paying for a locksmith. The tenant should ask his 'cousin' to attend while the locksmith is there, and give permission for cousin to have the key.
It isn't the landlord's responsibility to solve, or get involved in at this stage.
Op should talk to tenant asap upon his return and look for evidence that 'cousin' is still living there. Hard to prove though, unless they're on friendly terms with the neighbours, though two toothbrushes and two toothpastes are a good starting point, and sight of any post if possible, as well as asking 'cousin' for proof of his address if he's living elsewhere.
Consider upping the rent and serving a s21 while you still can. Bear in mind if you accept rent from 'cousin' you have instantly created a tenancy for them

I kind of agree. Some letting agents are better than others , but out of hours there’s no guarantee anyone will be able to help. I’ve no idea if some agents offer out of hours services.
But in lots of cases the agents still need to get the landlords permission to do any works in the first place so that doesn’t guarantee that an agent will be any better

jennylamb1 · 27/12/2024 20:02

You sound relaxed about it, however I wouldn't be happy with another person who is not on the rental agreement living there or for exotic animals to be there without permission.

Discombobble · 27/12/2024 20:11

jennylamb1 · 27/12/2024 20:02

You sound relaxed about it, however I wouldn't be happy with another person who is not on the rental agreement living there or for exotic animals to be there without permission.

What else do you expect her to do given it’s the Christmas holidays and the tenant is abroad?

Catcherintherice · 27/12/2024 20:15

Discombobble · 27/12/2024 20:11

What else do you expect her to do given it’s the Christmas holidays and the tenant is abroad?

This pretty much sums up my feelings really. I can’t do much about it at present, and if I’m honest I’m a bit relieved at not having to deal with the reptiles.
( I know they are not my responsibility, but even though they give me the creeps I still wouldn’t want the poor things to suffer)

OP posts:
HadEnoughOfThisPish · 27/12/2024 22:08

You're a much more tolerant person than me, OP. I hope you manage to get things sorted when your tenant returns and that they start respecting your property and the terms of the tenancy agreement in future. They'd be looking for somewhere else to live if it was me. Good on you for keeping your cool.

Evan456 · 28/12/2024 17:47

If he’s got his phone he can get access to his cards/cash from that

AnOldCynic · 28/12/2024 18:21

@Catcherintherice, although your tenancy agreement is not with the cousin I think it would be wise to get a right to rent check on them if they are planning on staying?

FoolishHips · 28/12/2024 18:30

Will it affect your insurance if you don't stick to the contract? I'd be a bit worried.

Pawparazzi · 28/12/2024 18:40

You do know, don't you, that standard tenancy contracts will insist that everyone over the age of 18 and 'living' at the property must be named on the contract?
I would absolutely refuse point blank to have anything to do with this additional person staying at your property. It sounds as though your genuine tenant has been caught out here by the additional person having mislaid the key.
And as soon as possible, I'd be visiting my property to see for myself just what's going on. I'm assuming you manage the property yourself and it's not via a lettings agent?

Nikki75 · 28/12/2024 18:40

Your not 24hrs oncall emergency.. tell them it's not your problem and you are otherwise engaged.
Cheek of that !!

Laurmolonlabe · 29/12/2024 08:56

Tell the tenant's friend to get a cab to come and collect the key and bring it to him, and that you need to talk to him about the terms of the tenancy. the fact a cab or locksmith will cost a great deal is not your problem. the friend shouldn't have been living there AND it's his mistake he is locked out.
Be wary of letting the tenant or friend get a locksmith- you could finish up locked out of your own property -when you have a locksmith you have to swear and sign it is your property so the locksmith can't be charged with housebreaking.

RavenclawLuna · 29/12/2024 10:07

You are nicer than me. He would be getting his notice to leave, causing a massive disruption to you and having his so called cousin there without your knowledge

JHound · 29/12/2024 12:20

Catcherintherice · 26/12/2024 22:50

I am a landlord and around an hour ago took a phone call from my tenant. He is visiting family and accidentally locked out his friend who lives with him. Friend has no key and apparently no money as his cards are in the flat.
The friend is not a tenant and has never been a permitted occupier. Today is the first time the tenant has told me he is actually living there.
The flat is over 30 miles from me. I have visitors and have been drinking. I am probably not over the legal limit but I never drive after any alcohol.
I am not really happy about giving access to someone who isn’t a tenant, but as the tenant says he is there, I have offered that he can get someone to collect a key from my home.
I can’t think of anything else. I have posted in AIBU as I don’t think I’m being unreasonable in not offering anything else, and can’t think of what more I can do.
He has contacted a locksmith who has quoted over £400, and wants payment before he comes out.

I would make a point of saying there is only one person meant to be living at the property and that is tenant.

You are the rare rare, EXCEPTIONALLY rare example of a nice landlord willing to overlook that and help the tenant out. It’s not your issue as this is not your tenant in a jam.

JHound · 29/12/2024 12:20

It’s also wild that the tenant would openly tell you they have an unauthorised sub letter!

JHound · 29/12/2024 12:24

Also the friend or the tenant surely has a phone. And if so can arrange a direct back transfer to the locksmith.

I have done this before when a friend and I locked ourselves out. The story sounds dodgy.

Say you will engage with the legal tenant and that’s it.

JHound · 29/12/2024 12:39

@Ponderingwindow

calling up and saying you have an unauthorized housemate is just sheer stupidity.

This is what I don’t get. To take such a big risk by telling the landlord you are openly breaching the lease agreement is either breathtakingly stupid or likely something else that made the tenant desperate - such as an illegal sublet or illegal air b’n’b.

JHound · 29/12/2024 12:42

SnapdragonToadflax · 27/12/2024 05:16

I normally always side with the tenant, having had some utterly shitty landlords... but in this case the tenant is firmly in the wrong. I got locked out as a tenant and it didn't occur to me to bother the landlord - in fact I was really worried about letting them know after the fact, as I had to get a locksmith out. I didn't want them to think I was irresponsible.

If it were a houseshare I wouldn't be surprised the tenant didn't check the other occupier wasn't home - I've definitely lived in houseshares where I wouldn't have said anything when I was coming and going. But it does make it sound more like a sublet than a 'friend'.

Same. My knee jerk reaction is to side with tenants as from experience most landlords are awful and most rentals are subpar quality but reading this the landlord is clearly in the right and the tenant has a cheek!

ResultsMayVary · 29/12/2024 12:43

I am concerned that you've missed the opportunity to view the situation in person - there may be no pets, there may be multiple people living in your property not on the lease (2 men trying to get in sounds strange) they now have the code so can cut .multiple keys and you will need to fully replace the lock when they leave as it will be a security risk for subsequent tenants. Hopefully there is no property damage.

I think you should arrange an inspection as soon as possible and also hand over the management to an agency near the property who will be better equipped to deal with issues.

You sound like you are being compassionate but at real risk to yourself.

I hope I'm wrong but the whole situation sounds very strange.

JHound · 29/12/2024 12:49

Semiramide · 27/12/2024 09:43

Pretty much. In my experience, letting agents are as useful as a chocolate teapot when out of the ordinary difficulties arise.

But then isn’t that useful in this instance? They reinforce the lease clause, possibly notify the landlord and that’s it. Which is all that should happen.

JHound · 29/12/2024 12:52

Cherrysoup · 27/12/2024 10:41

My nice tenant (before aggressive drunk one) used to contact us at stupid o’clock for minor issues eg a mouse or a very minor drip from a rad. We told him no contact after 9pm unless it was a dire emergency. He was always drunk when he contacted us after 9pm, very dramatic ‘There is mouse, she very fast, I cannot catch her’. Get a snap trap! I literally sent some round. Problem solved. Put in place a really strict limit, but you need to investigate who the long term live in friend is, that’s breaking the AST according to you. What will you do about that?

A vermin problem is not a “minor issue”.

JHound · 29/12/2024 12:58

Catcherintherice · 27/12/2024 11:21

It’s 2 bedrooms plus a smaller room which is possible only a study/ nursery.

The tenant said he was visiting family. He is not originally from U.K. I don’t think he said how long he’d be away, but I got the impression it was a reasonably short time.

Two bedrooms makes it definitely sound like an illegal sublet of the second room to help cover rent. It’s risky both from the point of view of the second tenant and the landlord. I lived in one of these once and when the first tenant refused to pay me back my deposit I could not simply request it from the landlord / agent.

I had to go to court (luckily somewhere with a civilised system for protecting all kinds of tenants so got my money back plus costs and interest.)

I would arrange to speak with the tenant on their return about breach of contract.

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