To think a 3:20 finish is absurd?

[Itsr]

It’s mostly mums at the school gates. Because the 3:20 finish worked well at a time when most women stayed at home.

now most women work, which means two parents working, why does school finish ar 3:20?! Yes I know there are after school classes etc but some don’t go on for too long and they also cost.

what actually is the reason why the school day isn’t aligned with a work day (like it is with most private schools!)

You keep saying private schools finish at 6… I’ve never known one to unless children are enrolled in after school clubs (which they pay extra for and are run by external providers).

My gd finishes school at 2pm, thought that was early! starts at 7.50 prompt.

YABU.

1. The kids are exhausted after learning/socialising all day. Adding to the school day won't make them learn faster or better.

1. It's about what's best for the kids, not parents. School isn't meant to be about childcare.

1. Most parents arrange their working lives so they can pick their kids up at the end of the school day at least a day or two a week - otherwise we'd hardly spend any quality time together at all during the week. I don't know any kids in wraparound 5 days a week.

I certainly would have liked an end to long school holidays, ten weeks!

I don’t think anyone disagrees that working full-time and juggling childcare is easy. Many ppl don’t see any financial benefit from working whilst their kids are small due to high childcare costs, but to keep on the career ladder some have to take this hit. The government pushes for everyone to work, I am not so sure that this benefits children always, today poorer SAHP are looked down on, and richer ones are seen as ladies that lunch. I would have loved to go to sports days, plays and presentations but my leave was minimal and work was not near home plus an absent parent, don’t get me started on that 😂

We are probably talking different ages, ie not 7-8 necessarily, more 10+.

Age 7-8 we would have 4 hours of study a day and we’d go home for lunch and stay there, so totally agree that these early pickups still happen. However the option is there to have childcare in the school building around working hours as you describe.

It’s certainly a long day but does it matter whether the child plays with their friends at home or at school? School’s probably better, more variety, better facilities, more people to spend time with.

Not staffed as in loads of staff present, staffed with security guards and a couple other staff though. Hardly anyone would stay beyond 5 the way I remember it, but I was easily able to swim at 8, or we’d do a workout at 5/6pm. Some athletes would train before school, so in the building at 7am latest. Times have probably changed now, I imagine some of those activities would be more supervised.

In Finland for example my friends have kids now and they’re trusted to do what they want to do around the building after 5pm, eg use the D&T room for fashion design, use the pool/ track etc. Facilities would have their opening times and a facility supervisor, so if it’s open til say 7pm, you could go.

As you describe, paid cooked dinner would also be available if pre-registered for it.

Maybe it’s just the schools I went to, but 4 schools in 4 different countries were all similar and all were state.

what was the cost in relation to your overall earnings?

My friend moved to Germany when she got pregnant because she’d rather pay 50 EUR for kindergarten than… Not sure, 1-2K in London I think it is these days?

That's what after school care is for. And yes you have to pay for childcare.

School timings have never been convenient. Victorian schools ran from 9-5 with a 2 hour lunch break slapped in the middle of the day. It’s not all about SAHMs of the 60s. If school acts as childcare that’s a benefit but not it’s purpose.

I don’t agree that school should bend to work. Educating children is paramount. And I say this as a working mum.

Got it in one.

Some of the little darlings fall asleep in school at first.

@Itsr what actually is the reason why the school day isn’t aligned with a work day (like it is with most private schools!)

Who's going to pay the bill for the extra 2 hours and 40 minutes of school time to align with a conventional 09:00 - 18:00 working day? I'm not paying for that.

Why don't you pay for it?

I don't think private schools are close to adult working hours. I reckon it's because the kids and teachers get to tired. It's not that good but you can't expect them to open til 6pm!

Because there isn't enough funding. School should be 8.45 - 4pm ish. There could be far more sport and art

Next thing you will be asking ‘why schools can’t let the children board every night. It would be much more convenient for me. After all that’s what private boarding schools do.’ Why exactly did you bother having kids.

Do these countries you mention have high social charges

It’s so difficult as a working parent. But the hours suit children. More and better wraparound is needed and more flexible working. Not more school.

They have paid carers, such as teaching assistants or sports coaches, to look after the children from school finish until 6. The children's school day, as in their education, finishes at the same time as state schools because teachers have meetings / training / marking etc.

It's late and I haven't had time to read all the comments, but here in France school starts at 8am and ends at 5.45pm. They still have homework on top of that. Admittedly, days were slightly shorter (but not much) when they were in lower years. They get half-days on Wednesdays (and in primary school they didn't go in at all).

Because the school day is in line with how long kids can best concentrate and learn for, because that's what the school day is about.

It's not in line with how long parents work for, because that is not what it is about, so is irrelevant.

what happens to the children on Wednesdays if they don’t go to school?

I think that if as a society we want less families reliant on state support (and for many if not most, this will mean both parents working full time, or near enough full time, or in LP families, the parent working full time and probably then some) then we’re going to have to either vastly extend heavily subsidized wraparound provision, or extend school hours.

so you’re not wrong, OP. Extended school hours may not be what’s best for children, or what parents or teachers want, but I think it’s probably what the economy - and the anti-benefits crowd (many of whom are on this site)- demand.

FWiW I’m a higher earning LP, with a kid in after school club 4 days per week. Dad has access on the 5th day. If there was no after school club, I couldn’t do my job, and yes, would be on UC.

Finland. Ok. Might be. Sounds great. School system is very different from Denmark.

Danish schools are closed at 3.30 pm if you talk about secondary schools. Lots of kids will be off school at 2 pm.
Primary schools ends earlier.
After school care +10 yo will run at another location than school to 5.30 pm and one late night untill 7.30.
Most young people I know in Denmark will leave for home around 4 pm or go straight home from school but enjoy the late night with friends once a week.

Danes are not fond of long school days or after long hours at after school care not even teenagers.

No art, drama, anything creative and little sport at my daughter’s French school, a dry dull curriculum, none of the transplanted, disgruntled English children flourished tbh, the teachers were lacklustre too. But she learnt how to swear in French so all good.

The English school my other daughter attended had its own theatre set up, literature, artistic expression, school band, dances, still with high academic standards, the corresponding school heVy on languages, this is why we choose a scool and thank goodness we are able.

scool ! so funny! at school

The private schools here all finish at the same time as the state schools. There’s After School Club for the younger kids and sports clubs for the older kids - just as there is in the local state schools.

From what we observe (we both WFH so it's never been an issue), often the grandparents have the children. But really, it seems Wednesdays are designed to be activity days e.g. if you are a junior member of a rugby or football club, you train with them on a Wednesday afternoon.