Tired of the performative beggars and alcoholics this time of year

[Onand]

Is anyone else sick and tired of the huge number of ‘homeless’ beggars, alcoholics and addicts that descended on the streets since the Christmas rush started this year?

Manchester is rife with them- this year there is a particularly ropey bunch of alcoholics/ addicts that are obnoxiously ‘sleeping’ or sitting with their bags pointing directly out into the street instead of being against a wall, they’re building ‘dens’ in shop doorways which stink of human faeces and piss, dealers go from spot to spot, dogs forced to sit in uncomfortable situations (often not even their dog as the same one gets passed from beggar to beggar).

It’s a self perpetuating problem because soup kitchens serving buffets set up and cater meals for them whilst they’re generally being a nuisance and making the streets look an absolute shitty mess. Why are they tolerated? People need to stop giving them money as it just encourages them to keep doing it when there are services in place to help them.

Bah humbug I know, but It’s beyond grim.

There’s a guy that stands in our post office sorry asking for you to transfer 20 quid (!) to his online banking on his iPhone….

Oh dear, your 'goodwill toward men' feature appears to be malfunctioning. Such a shame these nasty homeless drug addicts and alcoholics are spoiling your view of the Christmas lights. Chuck another log on the fire and try to put it all to the back of your mind.

Don't know about you, but I genuinely miss the blind guy who used to play the violin outside Debenhams in Oxford Street in the early 1990s.

We have a huge problem in London. I used to work in central London and I used to arrive to work really early and you would see them arriving all together in a car in the morning, they would have a meeting, get their cardboard signs out (which were all the same and all had the words (god bless) written on them too. Each had a phone and they would go to work. It’s very well calculated and they would really hassle you for money.

i once had someone ask me for cash and i said no (we were in a food court eating and she came over) and she said how can I say I have no spare change when I have fed my children and that I should pay her. The audacity

"Who do not resort to this"?

Lucky you that your life hasn't become so unbearable you've ended up in the grip of addiction...

By the way, the problem is exacerbated by your cruel attitude. It's the reason we had 14 years of austerity which left people entirely abandoned at times of crisis.

How do you like it when the consequences of that turn up at your doorstep? Oh, right, not very much. Interesting

I see this in my local town. There is a bed available and local services have engaged with them (according to the local councillor anyway) but they can't meet the criteria of no drugs / abusive behaviour.

We also have a big issue seller who has been doing the job for 10 years. She's really friendly so I often stop for a chat. I don't donate as it's clearly gangs but that's not her fault. She clearly isn't making this choice freely and is dropped off daily in the BMW with tinted windows.

It's such a complicated thing dealing with the homeless as so much is going on at once.

And people are quite at liberty to tell him no. It is not hard. Though I find this hard to believe.

So you are just perpetuating the problem, aren't you? If you are concerned with homlessness or addiction it's not like there is a shortage of charities to donate to.

There by the grace of god....

Addiction is an illness, You can argue that people shouldn't take things but you don't imagine anyone sets out to be an addict do you.

It's not nice at any time of year, this time is especially shitty. Just count your blessings that you are who you are and don't have to experience the effects first hand.

Nobody is making a quick buck because they are homeless. Nobody wants this life. And the back stories of most homeless people is desperate

A huge number are ex forces and care leavers.

And the social services net to help people like this has been cut to ribbons.

A section 21 notice can be served, and people made homeless. Look up how many people who present as homeless to their LA would be entitled to help. They have to be vulnerable. And that’s a very very narrow definition. In any decent society any one homeless is vulnerable 🤷‍♀️

Yeah I can’t say but we have an active Salvation Army and so it becomes very unusual to see anyone homeless so they stick out like a sore thumb. They’ll be on the local Facebook pages. Some have proven to be be scammers and then they’ll be loads of posts about how people helped and now feel angry. Anyone genuine is helped quickly. It’s something they are very proud about. There was once a couple who blocked a doorway for months until being moved on but they were known to be begging in multiple places. Another man refused help, my friend literally tried to help him as she worked for the council but he didn’t want to be housed!

It's probably because the prisons are full. Lots of homeless addicts get put in prison for the winter. They offend so that they will be warm, fed and given a detox so they don't have to suffer the winter on the streets.

It's horrific that as a society, vulnerable people are in this situation. And worth remembering, that these people were most likely the children getting the donations of a Christmas gift from charity. Because they were being neglected and abused as small children.

You'd have been the poster on the posts about the neglected, abused child..saying you were being kept awake after reading about it.

Full o the Christmas spirit 🎅

There's a brilliant scene in "Breeders" where Paul's dad Jim says "Count your blessings"

His mum Jackie then says "Check you privilege".

Jim looks at her and says "Is that the same as 'count your blessing'?"

"Yes, but with more guilt" she replies.

Think that sums up trite comments perfectly.

Lots of sanctimonious folk come out on these threads but YANBU, Op.

There was a thread here ages ago about a Chinese woman who was racially harassed by a street beggar in London. An East Asian colleague of mine had something similar on the DLR.

Also a woman I know said she was followed down Oxford street being verbally abused by a “homeless” guy . She is a tall South Londoner and very streetwise and was as cool as a cucumber laughing it off and giving as good as she got but if that were me I’d have been quite upset.

I had a man threaten me in Glasgow when was 17 and a Scottish man in London quite aggressively tell me I should help out a “fellow Scot” - he heard my accent when I said sorry no change.

Also heard other instances of intimidation. A friend of mine intervened when a teen girl was being sworn at in south London.

We don’t always know these men are homeless. There was a man in Twickenham who would be out begging every day on the high street until he sadly died. He clearly had mental health issues but what he wasn’t was homeless or in need of money. I didn’t realise until he died but he lived in his family’s large house on Twickenham green and had a car too.

Being an addict or alcoholic is not a cool lifestyle choice. It is an illness FGS

"Showing off terrible wounds"? Be grateful that you don't have a terrible wound.

This thread is an eye-opener, not to mention thoroughly depressing. I'm not going to read any more.

"Chants to herself: There are good people in the world, there are good people in the world."

There are some people that beg when they don’t need to BUT there will be a context to that. If you have grown up in a loving, trauma free family, you were supported to reach your potential, you are blessed with good health and you are financially secure, you would not dream of doing that. There will be a context.

Some gangs send people out begging, those people are often vulnerable and exploited.

Some people will be genuinely in need.

Most people that find themselves homeless and desperate have complex, often traumatic histories, mental health problems or are vulnerable in other ways.

We could all end up in the same situation.

Lots of us are protected from that possibility but it’s not beyond the realms of possibility. ‘They’ are no different to you, they have just had a different life history and you could conceivably end up there too. You think not?…(TW trauma)

Imagine there is a big celebration and all your nearest and dearest are there. You step out to take a call and the building explodes in a terrorist attack and you are the only survivor. You have life changing injuries. A brain injury (frontal cortex) that makes decision making harder.

The psychological impact, trauma and physical health issues mean you can no longer work and have to survive on benefits. You meet a kind person who is empathy and understanding as they have been through similar. You are alone in the world and they feel like a good connection in your grief. They give you a pill that they find helps them. They say it will make you feel better. Your grief and head injury mean your decision making is compromised.

You take it. It feels good (having had opiates in hospital during a traumatic event I can tell you - they take all the emotional and physical pain away and replace it with a warm fuzzy feeling). You want more. You need more. You get addicted. You start gambling to try and get the money needed to hold on to that blissfully warm fuzzy feeling that replaces the fear, anxiety, shame, huge gaping loss in the pit of your stomach. You lose it all. Your house, your savings. You have no one left. They were all in the attack. Then this someone offers you a home. Gives you gifts. ‘Looks after’ you. They now have a hold over you…

These people on the streets are people. They are people who often don’t have the benefit of a stable loving background. Have experienced multiple traumas as children and adults. This impacts how our physiology and brain function.

Im not suggesting we give them money. (I will offer to buy them a warm drink or sandwich). I think supporting charities like Shelter, buying the big issue etc is much better.

But to de-humanise them like you have is appalling and shows a massive empathy fail. You should see it and ask ‘How is a civilised society allowing this to happen and what needs to change? How can I play a part in that change?’ Not ‘ew that’s gross how can we hide it away so I don’t have to face it!’

Something can be said a lot and remain meaningful and appropriate. Just because you hear this often, doesn't make it a cliché.

OP your concerns are completely valid. I witnessed a student bragging in a tutorial that he poses as a beggar every Friday and Saturday night in the city centre. He says he makes hundreds of pounds, and he mocked the other students who are holding down legitimate ways of earning (less) money.

Bloody hell, it’s so rough up north - people begrudge the homeless. Blimey, as we say down south… I think what OP is seeing is poverty, up close and personal.

This thread plays out exactly why we are lurching towards the far right and Farage as PM within five years.

I consider myself firmly left wing but it is incredibly frustrating to see people like the OP being mocked, insulted and dismissed for expressing their real and often legitimate concerns about serious social issues that impact them.

Your post implies that ‘addicts’ and ‘alcoholics’ are not worthy of help and as though you think this is a choice they actively make.
Is this how you view them?

I agree with you OP.

I sometimes think that the people telling you to ‘check your privilege’ are the ones whose lives are so sheltered that they think many of these beggars are nice, lovely people who have just fallen on hard times.

The reasons are complex. While many will have had unhappy lives, others will have alienated all their friends and family through their addiction, actions and behaviour.

of course, no one chooses that lifestyle. But some of them are extremely aggressive. These are often chaotic people who make an area feel threatening and unsafe. But everyone is supposed to tolerate it? The reality is a fair chunk of them will have been provided with accommodation at some point, but have been evicted for not paying rent, anti-social behaviour etc

you can have compassion for them while still recognising they are a nuisance.

I’d like to see what the ‘check your privilege’ crew would say if they moved in next door to them? It’s only because they know that would never happen, they can allow themselves to feel smug.

Ah. I used to buy food for the middle eastern looking lady with a headscarf who mysteriously appeared in our little village selling the Big Issue.

(We were one of the very few families at the primary school and in the village that appeared BAME so I did wonder where she had come from)

Then lockdown happened and I shopped far less at the local supermarket as we got more deliveries.

But there is now almost always one headscarfed lady or another outside the supermarket these days. And I did see one being dropped off in the car park in a big black car that looked far more expensive than mine, which isn't saying much.

I thought, are these people homeless?

So I never give to Big Issue sellers now.

But I do give food and/or a hot drink, if I can conveniently, to people who appear to be homeless (and don't look dangerous or aggressive). I don't give money.